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Rostrum: 20 Weeks to the Election Edition!

May 1, 2013

fat-lady-singing-warning

Feel free to talk amongst yourselves……

 

 

 

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245 Comments leave one →
  1. May 1, 2013 9:28 pm

    So, what tune is Gina about to belt out for us?

  2. May 1, 2013 9:42 pm

    `Eat It` _ (by Weird Al Yankovich)

  3. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 1, 2013 9:59 pm

    The ALP doesn’t deserve success or support and the Liberals don’t deserve government.

    Place both about equal 5th.

    I’ve been told this abrogates responsibility, but I’m past caring. Neither deserves support and they won’t get it from me.
    ————————–
    There’s a very pleasant Italian restaurant nearby, and has a BYO option on Wednesdays. A great 02 cab sav tonight.
    This will all come to an end if I have to pay an extra ½ % in tax!

  4. May 1, 2013 10:07 pm

    Are you alright yomm.?
    You sound like you`ve fallen off the tea-trolley.?

  5. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 1, 2013 10:27 pm

    http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/air-engineers-cut-ties-with-labor-party-20130501-2it9k.html

    Aircraft Engineers Union stops supporting ALP, they will support Katter or the Greens or the Liberals.

    Those greedy types will support anyone who will throw some largesse in their direction. Their main gripe is the amount of tax they have to pay as a result of their overtime and classification rorts.

  6. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 1, 2013 10:27 pm

    The ALP doesn’t deserve success or support and the Liberals don’t deserve government.”

    The Howard gov’t was a successful govt. Your heroes in the ALP have locked up more children than Howard ever did.

    Now your heroes have brought out the lame and infirm and people with dementia to help them win the next election.

    We will not know what an Abbott govt is like until he is elected. he may be like Howard or he may be completely different. Or he may be like Gillard.

    We are now paying $7B/year in interest on the debt Labor has racked up since 2007. That would go a long way to paying for the NDIS.

  7. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 1, 2013 10:32 pm

    Nothing different in that comment 7.30, I’ve been saying it for quite some time.

  8. egg permalink
    May 2, 2013 8:13 am

    Its a slow news day…

    ‘With the eagerly anticipated global release of the latest Penfolds Grange looming, national liquor chain Dan Murphy’s has leapt out of the gates to offer a price of $669 per bottle, a 15 per cent discount to the recommended retail price for the iconic wine.’

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/dan-murphys-pops-cork-on-grange-price-war-20130502-2itra.html#ixzz2S57ZuxLX

  9. May 2, 2013 9:02 am

    I’d like Queensland more if there were no Queenslanders in it.

  10. May 2, 2013 9:06 am

    Hello Ross, nice to see you again..

    Yes – Queensland is a lovely place. It’s just the bogans who live there that spoil it.

  11. May 2, 2013 9:07 am

    How lucky am I…?!!

    Just received this in my inbox this morning…

    Attn.:Sir/madam, I am seeking your consent and good assistance in helping to claim an Estate worth over £45,000,000.00 in cash and properties, left behind by my late client who died on Feb 15th, 2004 in auto accident as you seem to be related due to your name identity. I shall however leave out the major details of this transaction till I receive an affirmation from you due to too many slanders on the Internet media. Best regards, Dr. Richard Malcolm (Esq.)

  12. TB Queensland permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:50 am

    I’d like Queensland more if there were no Queenslanders in it.

    Yes – Queensland is a lovely place. It’s just the bogans who live there that spoil it.

    😕

  13. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:50 am

    At $500 or $600+ a bottle, Grange seems a little pricey to me.
    ========
    That doctor seems nice, £45mill is quite a lot of money.

    …unless you’re a Treasurer, in which case it is practically nothing.

  14. TB Queensland permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:52 am

    What;s this Bash Queenslander Week?

    Another arsehole with the same areshole supporting him …

    G’day Ross, noice ta see ya here …

    Queensland IS the Sunshine State … its you fkn Mexicans that are so miserable …

  15. May 2, 2013 10:43 am

    I’d like Australia more if it had been settled by the French.

  16. grodo permalink
    May 2, 2013 10:58 am

    Its interesting to speculate on our origins. If there wasn’t the need to find somewhere new to dump their convicts, after the American war of independence, Australia may not have been invaded until well into the 19th century.

  17. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 2, 2013 11:09 am

    If more people were skilled on French the country would be a better place.

  18. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 2, 2013 11:25 am

    Here’s another headache for Gillard.

    Alcoa have announced this morning a complete review of their aluminium smelting worldwide and will be shutting down 11% of high cost capacity

    “……The review will include facilities across the Alcoa system and will focus on higher‐cost plants and plants that have long‐term risk due to factors such as energy costs or regulatory uncertainty. The possible curtailments could affect 11 percent of Alcoa’s global smelting capacity……..”

    So there goes a few more jobs

    Thanks for the Carbon Tax Gillard you low life grub

  19. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 2, 2013 11:26 am

    “I’d like Australia more if it had been settled by the French.”

    A little bit of France in the South Pacific ya reckon.

    Obviously you have never had the misfortune of visiting New Caledonia

  20. grodo permalink
    May 2, 2013 11:40 am

    I was under the impression that accountants would do well out of this tax on a harmless trace gas.

  21. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 2, 2013 11:58 am

    I’d like Australia more if it had been settled by the French.

    Good point. We’d have a lot less of those Indigenous types to worry about and it’s a fair bet we wouldn’t have wasted so much time trying to keep those pesky Japanese out.

  22. May 2, 2013 6:41 pm

    Don’t suppose anyone else saw Jones Vs Sonnen on the weekend?

    I didn’t know a man could break a big toe that heinously. 😯

  23. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 2, 2013 7:42 pm

    It’s great to see the CHICK MAGNET, John Della Bosca back on the TV. He’s still got it.

  24. egg permalink
    May 2, 2013 8:23 pm

    The Bolter is a little miffed that a another left wing character has been chosen for the Media Watch job…. his application was rejected out of hand.

  25. egg permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:17 pm

    Euro members are slipping into ‘debt deflation’.

    Spain and Holland are looking very shaky and almost certain to drift into a Japanese style depression unless something is done to rectify the problem.

  26. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:25 pm

    Don’t worry egg. The people at the Cafe have the solution. Debt is not a problem if you are sovereign in your own currency. You can just get the printing presses up and running and print your way out of trouble.

    Printing money is the solution to all our problems.

  27. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 2, 2013 9:41 pm

    It’s easy to support increasing debt if someone else is going to pay it back.

  28. May 3, 2013 6:13 am

    l don`t really understand the `debt-fetish` the teeebags have. When we had the `surplus-fetish` we also has an infrastructure and service deficit. Does it change any of your lives.?

  29. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:14 am

    Debt is not bad if we have the ability to service it.

    If we go out of our way to print more money (quantitative easing) then obviously this will reduce the value of the currency. Our manufacturers wouldn’t mind seeing a devaluation right now, but that’s unlikely to happen anytime soon.

    The left tend to spend money like its going out of fashion, while the right have a more pragmatic approach….being in the black.

  30. May 3, 2013 7:36 am

    No egg, you missed my point and explained hi/low dollar. Our dollar is high coz the yank and euro plummeted against a large suite of currencies (including_ours) some time ago.

    What l`m really asking is,
    How is Mr and Mrs Egg`s lives better with a `surplus`.?
    Or worse.?

  31. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:42 am

    I’ll leave that to the Finance Editor, he should be in the office around 9am.

    Meanwhile, 69% of SMH readers wouldn’t like Andrew Bolt as the anchor of Media Watch….fkn leftards.

  32. May 3, 2013 7:46 am

    so you need somebody else to tell you that you and your wife`s lives are better/worse with a `surplus`.?

  33. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:54 am

    Ah…I’m on a pension and its indexed, but I still have to work to stay alive.

    I’m more interested in the bigger picture.

    ‘INTEREST rates could be cut to a record low of 2.75 per cent next week as financial markets become sharply more pessimistic about the outlook following a run of weak economic data in Australia and overseas.

    ‘Bond markets raised the chances of a rate cut at next Tuesday’s Reserve Bank board meeting to 56 per cent, up from 36 per cent the previous day.’

    David Uren in the Oz

  34. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:10 am

    “l don`t really understand the `debt-fetish` the teeebags have.”

    Go ask the Greeks.

  35. May 3, 2013 8:19 am

    Yes, well aware of P.I.G.S splatter, not service-able national debts.
    But l am interested if and how it is effecting real-people, not the mindless torie-talking-points, cheerleading, etc.

    **************************************************************
    egg bolt would be a crap choice for mediawatch, he doesn`t do research, ask the `white` aboriginals

  36. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:23 am

    Media Watch has a team, its not a one man band. Gerard Henderson would have been more appropriate.

  37. May 3, 2013 8:27 am

    egg, any of those teeebag types, bolt, henderson, akerman carry the wrong image for the show and the wrong `fit` to the networks audience

  38. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:45 am

    “Go ask the Greeks.”

    Exactly !

    There is “Good Debt” and “Bad Debt” though.

  39. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:56 am

    7.30 should explain how much debt he wants.

    Another 10%? Or 20% or 50%

    That’s the thing with those hooked on debt, they hate to get specific. They like to make the profligacy of this government a problem that is dealt with by the next generation.

  40. May 3, 2013 9:06 am

    FFS yomm, jock shock, you guys are really a waste of time tying to talk properly with, L`m meant to be the repetitive one by sayin `teeebags“ but all you guys do is continually drop the same tired talkin points. _ read my previous comments _ l am interested if and how it is effecting real-people, not the mindless torie-talking-points, cheerleading, etc.

    How are your lives are better/worse with a `surplus`.?

  41. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 9:18 am

    So Mark Dreyfus is big noting himself and disregarded specific instructions from an approved airline safety officer (yes that’s what those hosties are)

    Mobile phones can interfere with aircraft radio and navigation systems, there is good reason that people are asked to turn them off. But Dreyfus considers himself above all that, too important, those types of safety regulations only apply to the rest of us.

    If the Attorney General can’t comply with a safety instruction under a CASA regulation, who should comply?

    He’s a tool and should get plenty of scrutiny for his cavalier attitude to airline safety.

  42. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 9:20 am

    People are better off when they have paid off their debt. They are worse off when they are servicing their debt.

  43. grodo permalink
    May 3, 2013 9:30 am

    Once we have paid off our debt we’ll have more disposable income to invest in leisure.

  44. IPA address permalink
    May 3, 2013 9:34 am

    L`m meant to be the repetitive one by sayin `teeebags

    Guffaw.

  45. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 3, 2013 9:37 am

    7.30, when you have money in the bank you can buy things. A hospital. A school. A Broadband network. A road. A railway. You can distribute money to constituents who might be struggling to make their lives a bit easier. As a nation, you have freedom and choices.

    When you rack up a bunch of debt, you need to spend your income servicing that debt and eventually paying it off. Or you can keep borrowing more and head down the Cyprus path.

    Debt is not always a bad thing. Sometimes you need to borrow for necessary capital expenditure.

    But when you are borrowing to fund the utterly fkn stupid cr@p dished up by the current Government, and there’s a fair chance that the basis upon which your debt servicing capacity was false (many predicted that the revenues were grossly overstated), and there’s a fair chance that the current revenue levels may well drop dramatically soon as the mining boom slows up, then racking up debt is utterly fkn stupid. Unless of course it’s your objective to completely trash an economy so you can create a justification for substituting a different set of economic principals which I am more and more convinced is occuring.

    I like it when my Government has enough money to fund roads, hospitals, schools etc. I don’t like it when I have to allocate more of my income, which I get for working, towards paying the salaries of bureaucrats who contribute nothing of value to my society.

  46. May 3, 2013 10:27 am

    yes snacy, l understand the theory`s and the preferred talking points from both sides of the duopoly, thanks.

    ln the days of Howard and `surplus` many peoples working conditions were eroded, including mine. l can blame the `surplus` but l suspect workchoice had more to do with it.

    ln the days of Joolya and `deficit` jobs and conditions are still crap. l could blame the `deficit` but l suspect Joolya`s workchoice-lite has more to do with it.

    Tho in the days of surplus, my neighbor`s cat coughed up more hair-balls, and since the days of deficit, dogs seem to sniff more arses.

  47. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 10:36 am

    “any of those teeebag types, bolt, henderson, akerman carry the wrong image for the show and the wrong `fit` to the networks audience”

    Spot on, retardland. The ABC represents the appropriation of public assets in the service of leftist causes. It steals money from ordinary folk under the “Your ABC” slogan but in reality it is “Their ABC”. It is interested only in servicing the intelligentsia, the chattering classes, Getupthemselves!, Greenies, union hacks and sundry species of Latte Sipping Leftists.

    Imagine the derangement if the luvvies turn on LNL and hear the sweet sound of Janet Albrechtsen instead of the increasingly earnest moans of Philip Adams blowing Bruce Shapiro. Valium sales would go through the roof. The cafes of Marrickville would need to call paramedics as soon as the conversation turns to the ABC reforms. Lifeline would be overwhelmed and the zombie leftoid ABC audience would rise from their couches, lurching through the streets looking to feast on human brains (which is why conservatives are particularly at risk).

    So you are exactly right, retardland. Presenters who are prepared to criticise the left will not be a “fit” with the ABC’s audience.

    But perhaps the shock would not be as great if you slowly changed the presenter mix so it more closely represented the diversity of views in the general population that pays for the ABC. Perhaps the current audience would slowly realise that there are other points of view out there.

    In a more intellectually challenging environment, the leftoid grubs might learn to question their prejudices, burst free of their insular monochrome cocoons and fly like brightly-coloured butterflies in the sunlight of open-minded discourse.

  48. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 10:37 am

    There is “Good Debt” and “Bad Debt” though.

    Exactly!

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    James’ comments are quite lucid these days … added responsibilities adding to the mix of knowledge and experience, mayhaps? 😉

    Seriously … well put, James … especially coupled with, Wally’s, comment above.

    Personally I’ve never had a problem with paying taxes … just the way the pricks spend squander it!

    Must check on Clivey’s UAP … at least he’s got some “financial management skills”!

  49. May 3, 2013 10:39 am

    “Unless of course it’s your objective to completely trash an economy so you can create a justification for substituting a different set of economic ideological principals which I am more and more convinced is occuring.”

    AGREED!

    They’re just trying to ram through anything now without any consideration as to how it will be funded in the future.

    It’s a very strong indication that the government knows it’s on the way out..

  50. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 10:42 am

    “Mark Dreyfus is big noting himself and disregarded specific instructions from an approved airline safety officer”

    Typical politician. Bronwyn Bishop once did the same thing as I recall.

  51. May 3, 2013 10:55 am

    ” The ABC represents the appropriation of public assets in the service of leftist causes. It steals money from ordinary folk “
    more torie talking points splatter, all the hostility at my abc, but none for sbs who cater to those `evil` boat-people.?

    There is plenty of clap-trap on the commercial networks to choose from, why do you torture yourself watching my abc.?

  52. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 10:58 am

    Aunty is the propaganda of the left and should be broken up.

  53. May 3, 2013 11:01 am

    ” They’re just trying to ram through anything now without any consideration”
    so reb, you will be voting for Mr-Rabbit then.? so he can reconsider his attitude to personal Liberty`s on things like gay-marriage, and maybe even voluntary euthanasia.

  54. May 3, 2013 11:06 am

    Well 730, Mr Rabbit said he wouldn’t stand in the way of RU486 and said that he would rely on the advice of the experts…

    Who’s to say he won’t change his mind about gay marriage especially when many Liberal MPs are now “coming out” in support of marriage equality including Melbourne’s mayor and former Liberal MP Robert Doyle.

    In stark contrast to the two-faced lying atheist bitch who remains steadfastly against it.

    the NZ decision to allow gay marriage will lead to the same thing happening here and I reckon probably within 12 months…

  55. May 3, 2013 11:07 am

    ” Aunty is the propaganda of the left and should be broken up.”
    So egg, why all the sooking about bolt and mediawatch earlier.?

  56. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 11:10 am

    “why do you torture yourself watching my abc.?”

    I quite enjoy a dose of leftist Pecksniffery every now and then, I can keep tabs on the latest in leftist “thought” and have a good belly-laugh when they try to work out whatever could have caused the latest jihadist outrage without mentioning the word ‘islam’.

  57. May 3, 2013 11:22 am

    “In stark contrast to the two-faced lying atheist bitch who remains steadfastly against it.”
    Yes reb, it`s been so `unbelievable` that Joolya`s mob have failed so dismally on the gay-marriage and voluntary euthanasia issues in my book. l did notice even old fuddy duddy Windsor is even ahead of them in his thinking on marriage this week.
    ************************************************************
    ” the NZ decision to allow gay marriage will lead to the same thing happening here and I reckon probably within 12 months”
    Yeah, me too. l hope you`re right, tho our Canberra idiots do seem to have a special talent of remaining stubborn and stupid for excessively long periods.

  58. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 3, 2013 11:36 am

    Well…………well………….well……………..well I’ll be……………now who would have thought that technology was still forging ahead and might overtake the need for a fibre NBN?

    Who would have thought that could be a possibility…………………….

    Gee we never saw this coming did we ?

    LOL

    http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/government-it/vectoring-could-boost-coalitions-nbn-speeds-20130502-2iue3.html

  59. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 3, 2013 11:37 am

    I’ve changed my mind on the NDIS…….Channelling Bolt……

    Division 1 Introduction

    5.1 The Act sets out when a person meets the disability requirements. The requirements are met if:

    (a) the person has a disability that is attributable to one or more intellectual, cognitive, neurological, sensory or physical impairments, or to one or more impairments attributable to a psychiatric condition; and

    (b) the person’s impairment or impairments are, or are likely to be, permanent; and

    (c) the impairment or impairments result in substantially reduced functional capacity to undertake, or psycho social functioning in undertaking, one or more of the following activities: communication, social interaction, learning, mobility, self-care, self-management; and

    (d) the impairment or impairments affect the person’s capacity for social and economic participation; and

    (e) the person’s support needs in relation to his or her impairment or impairments are likely to continue for the person’s lifetime.

    5.2 In relation to the above, an impairment that varies in intensity (for example because the impairment is of a chronic episodic nature) may be permanent, and the person’s support needs in relation to the impairment may be likely to continue for the person’s lifetime, despite the variation.

    6.3 The criteria to be applied in assessing whether the provision of early intervention supports for a person is likely to reduce the person’s future needs for supports in relation to disability, and is likely to have an effect mentioned in paragraph 6.1(c)(i) or (ii) above, are:

    (a) that the person has a recognised impairment for which there is contemporary credible and relevant evidence, or credible emerging evidence, which supports the proposition, which may include:

    …. evidence that a specific intervention (for example a specific therapy, piece of equipment, or support or training including working with a person’s family) will benefit a person by improving their functioning and reducing future support needs…

    6.4 For the purpose of paragraph 6.3 above, where the CEO does not already hold evidence to support the proposition, the CEO can consider evidence from a range of sources, including information provided by the person with disability or a person acting on their behalf, and may seek expert opinion in order to make a decision.

    6.5 The CEO may consider advice from a suitably qualified panel of experts on the available evidence for the purposes of making a determination…

    I have over the last 2 years worked in the Workers’ Comp Law area and what is described here is something that will have the Slater & Gordons licking their lips. This won’t be about those in wheelchairs, or those who are blind, or profoundly deaf. It’ll be about back strains, shoulder tears, depression and any number of other conditions which, whilst difficult for the sufferer, do not necessarily render them incapable of making a contribution to society but given such a financial incentive, inevitably will.

    I say no.

  60. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 3, 2013 11:43 am

    “This won’t be about those in wheelchairs, or those who are blind, or profoundly deaf. It’ll be about back strains, shoulder tears, depression and any number of other conditions….”

    That’s what I reckon.

    It’s going to end up as a halfway house for Lebanese backs and clapped out public servants.

    I’m not against the NDIS but…………..It needs to be a plainly demonstrable disability even to a layman.

  61. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 3, 2013 11:51 am

    I wonder what the cost would be for those basics like a wheelchair, hearing aids, and the like. I agree that $10k towards a $22k wheelchair is silly. Pay the lot. But don’t create a definition that we know in advance will be milked by the lawyers for all it’s worth.

  62. May 3, 2013 11:53 am

    Does a wheelchair really cost 22 grand?

  63. grodo permalink
    May 3, 2013 12:13 pm

    7.30… Bolt was taking the piss, the ABC morning program was discussing Barry and how he had the job before the Bolter pulled his stunt.

    The ABC newsroom is a disgrace, its full of leftards and needs purging.

  64. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 3, 2013 12:19 pm

    Apparently. It was an example in the news online the other day. A lady needed a wheelchair costin $22k and got $10k from the Govt. I am more than happy for the Govt. to stump up the full $22k in those circumstances.

  65. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 3, 2013 1:02 pm

    Looks like Immigration Minister Brendan O’Connor would make a good treasurer…………….

    ”Well, I’m making a forecast. I’m making a forecast like others have made forecasts. The difference is I seem to be being challenged – fine,”

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/457-visa-rort-figure-a-forecast-minister-admits-20130503-2ix3t.html#ixzz2SC8LcpqJ

    Oh please how long until we have an election and this nightmare is over ?

  66. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 1:18 pm

    Amazing things happen.

    While researching ways to put CO2 underground they stumbled upon a mint.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/new-wyoming-lithium-deposit-could-meet-all-us-demand-2013-4?IR=T

  67. May 3, 2013 2:00 pm

    From 2DT’s link…

    Opposition immigration spokesman Scott Morrison said the minister had been ”caught out” making up the number to justify his ”inflammatory rhetoric”.

    Scott Morrison accusing someone else of “inflammatory rhetoric” !!

    He is taking the piss right…??

  68. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 2:17 pm

    Barklamb accuses the government of ”dog-whistling” … its a fair assessment.

  69. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:14 pm

    Richo on Gillard:

    Julia Gillard has obviously decided that the national disability insurance scheme (now called DisabilityCare) and the Gonski reforms will be the monuments she leaves behind. You have to wonder though if it will all turn out to be nothing more than a mirage. ………………….

    the Gillard legacies will be like the rest of her prime ministership – plenty of promise and precious little delivery…………….

    It doesn’t really matter what the PM says anymore, Australians stopped listening a long, long time ago. For most voters, September can’t come soon enough………………

    This is no way to build a legacy. If you continue to hold a gun to the head of people on the other side of the political divide, when they know come September you won’t be around anymore, they will tend to resist. ………………….

    If she wants to leave monuments she should take a leaf out of Kim Il-sung’s book. He was called the Great Leader and was the grandfather of the idiot currently running North Korea. He built massive bronze statues of himself all over his country. They were 10m high and guaranteed he would be remembered after his death. She could well build one or two of those between now and September 14.

  70. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:26 pm

    Who would have thought that could be a possibility…………………….

    Gee we never saw this coming did we ?

    LOL

    Don’t get too gooey inside, Wally, you obviously didn’t read all the articel (I did ’cause I thought it might be clever technology) … this is the sting in the tail!

    The key factor determining the usefulness of vectoring to the Coalition’s NBN plan is the average length of the copper from the street corner nodes of its planned network to the subscriber. But the Coalition has given no indication of what it expects the average length of copper to be under its NBN plan.

    In a posting on his website, shadow communications minister Malcolm Turnbull refers only to previous FTTN (fiber to the neighbourhood) plans. “The last serious plans for FTTN in Australia in 2007 and 2008 had maximum loop lengths of between 750m and 800m,” he says.

    There is no public information on the average distance from the street corner pillars to homes in Telstra’s network. Brian Beckor, founder and director of Callpoint Spatial, a company that has extensive experience mapping Australia’s telephone network, told IT Pro that Telstra did not make the location of the pillars public, only the boundaries of the distribution areas they serve.

    Plus copper is far more expensive than fibre optics to manufacture and corrodes over time … and has to be replaced every couple of decades … and requires constant servicing (cable and connections) …

    It’s not about “seeing this one coming” – if we waited for the next big thing in science we’d all still be living in caves … technology isn’t like money and accounting … it keeps developing and improving … :roll:.

  71. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:41 pm

    Regardless, NBN is still behind schedule, low take up rates and over budget. Now we have the communications/electrical union teaming up with the small contractors to get more out of the principals.

    On top of this, NBN don’t trust their principal contractors. They don’t believe their excuses for overruns and delays.

    NBN is a great example of an ALP infrastructure project.

  72. grodo permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:42 pm

    Richo is on the money, a real smack in the face for Gillard.

    Whatever will the cafe mob make of it? Ignore it, presumably.

  73. grodo permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:50 pm

    The NBN reminds me of the Caledonian canal in Scotland, train travel surpassed it, leaving a very expensive government funded white elephant.

  74. Bacchus permalink
    May 3, 2013 4:59 pm

    To get anywhere near to the sort of speeds they’re claiming, you need to use bonding and vectoring. In the current Telstra Customer Access Network, this is not feasible. Provision of copper pairs was done with about 25% oversupply. Much of this extra capacity has already been used replacing faulty pairs over the years. Bonding requires multiple pairs of wires – The PMG only ever supplied one pair per customer in residential areas, and many business districts already have fibre.

    So to make it work at the claimed speeds, you need to haul in more copper cable to provide at least two pairs of copper wires per customer, install expensive and complex noise cancelling electronics on every cable (vectoring), and provide power, battery and signal conversion electronics in ugly cabinets every few hundred metres all over the country. That sure makes a lot of sense 🙄

    This doesn’t even consider the degraded state of the existing copper network, the $600K pa extra cost of maintaining an obsolete network, or the fact that 1Gbps will be commercially available from NBN Co this year.

    Sortius, who does seem to know his stuff, calls BS on the article…

  75. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 3, 2013 5:38 pm

    Oh yes………Sortius………LOL………..we have seen an example of his “expertise” before when he swore black and blue that a date stamp on a document from Tony Abbott’s office could not be true.

    Sortius is to technology what Wixxy is to the Thommo case

  76. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:00 pm

    Fibre requires uninterruptable power supply, otherwise it just shuts down with any power interruption… and more of them can be expected with the decaying infrastructure.

    For example batteries require maintenance, discharge tests, replacement. UPS generators need maintenance.

    Fibre is only maintenance free if you’re willing to sacrifice communication during a power outage.

  77. May 3, 2013 6:12 pm

    “Fibre is only maintenance free if you’re willing to sacrifice communication during a power outage.”

    Oh for the love of dog.. 🙄

    You are familiar with the concept of redundancy Yom?

    And I mean in terms of power, not employment, although that would probably come into play very quickly if you were left in charge of IT infrastructure….

    Just saying….

  78. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:17 pm

    The NBN reminds me of the Caledonian canal in Scotland, train travel surpassed it, leaving a very expensive government funded white elephant.

    LOL! Not a good analogy (and I like analogies) see what it does for tourism now! LOL!

    The canal is now a Scheduled Ancient Monument, and attracts over half a million visitors each year. British Waterways, who work with the Highland Council and the Scottish Forestry Commission through the Great Glen Ways Initiative, were hoping to increase this number to over 1 million by 2012

    Like many other “obsolete” canals in Britain they are now being restored and creating a lucratice income for tourism entreprenours … something you should study, egg …

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Oh yes………Sortius………LOL………..we have seen an example of his “expertise”

    And your expertise is in what, Wally?

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Fibre is only maintenance free if you’re willing to sacrifice communication during a power outage.

    What an unusually strange comment … almost as if you misquoted someone trying to explain how NBN may not work?

    And copper changes this how? Duh!

    BTW … re vectoring … the cables from the node STILL NEED TO BE REPLACED (the “old copper can’t be used it has to be replaced by new vector cabling – no saving) … vectoring is a means (like ADSL) to keep copper spluttering along …

    The USA is falling behind because it is in a massive RECESSION still … and will clutch at straws to keep up …

    Just another amateur red herring …

    If the power at the node or substation goes down so does your copper … but your mobile will still work …

    You and Wally really need to stick to playing Monopoly …

  79. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:18 pm

    So where is the UPS to homes in the event of a power failure?

  80. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:20 pm

    CORRECTION: lucratice – lucrative … for those who actually read my posts … 🙂

    BTW, The Caledonian Canal was not built to compete with rail …

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caledonian_Canal

    Just sayin’

  81. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:23 pm

    I’m simply suggesting that fibre won’t be free of maintenance.

  82. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:24 pm

    So where is the UPS to homes in the event of a power failure?

    Its the same as copper!!!!

    For those wondering what ToM means by playing acronyms to confuse!

    Uniterrupted Power Supply

  83. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:25 pm

    I’m simply suggesting that fibre won’t be free of maintenance.

    FMD! ToM – even YOU aren’t free of maintenance!

  84. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:25 pm

    “Like many other “obsolete” canals in Britain they are now being restored and creating a lucrative income for tourism entrepreneurs … “

    I take it the original owners went bust. NBN co will probably make a pretty penny for someone who finally buys it from the government at a fraction of its cost.

  85. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:26 pm

    Did anyone say fibre was maintenance free … straw clutching …

  86. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:32 pm

    I’m pointing out that if you have an asset with a value of $50bn, spending $0.5bn on maintenance may be quite good business sense.

    Businesses are always looking at the repair or replace balance.

  87. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:33 pm

    … for someone who finally buys it from the government at a fraction of its cost.

    Are you referring to Telstra?

    And ye’r ‘rang agin’ laddie … ye ma’ tak’ eal ya givn ta rea’ nae jus’ ‘t thae wee bits ye liake …

    Read oan …

    By 1990, the canal was in obvious need of restoration, with lock walls bulging, and it was estimated that repairs would cost £60 million. With no prospect of the Government funding this, British Waterways devised a repair plan, and between 1995 and 2005, sections of the canal were drained each winter. Stainless steel rods were used to tie the double-skinned lock walls together, and over 25,000 tonnes of grout were injected into the lock structures. All of the lock gates were replaced, and the result was a canal where the structures are probably in a better condition than they have ever been.[2]

    The canal is now a Scheduled Ancient Monument, and attracts over half a million visitors each year. British Waterways, who work with the Highland Council and the Scottish Forestry Commission through the Great Glen Ways Initiative, were hoping to increase this number to over 1 million by 2012.[2] There are many ways for tourists to enjoy the canal, whether it is taking part in the Great Glen Rally, cycling along the tow-paths, or cruising on Hotel Barges.

    And I’ve seen the results in the villages near where I was born of the restoration of canals … in West Yorkshire … fabulous stuff …

  88. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:37 pm

    Businesses are always looking at the repair or replace balance.

    Mmmm … Shall I suck the egg now or later?

  89. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:40 pm

    The canal is a good analogy in that the original owners blew their cash. The analogy falls down completely in the long term unless their is a mass fetish for useless fibre.

  90. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:49 pm

    ‘…something you should study, egg …’

    It finally came good in the 21st century.

  91. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:50 pm

    It was always a poor analogy – one you agreed with – not me … I just pointed out why …

    AUSTRALIA will purchase 12 new electronic warfare fighter planes to cover the delays in the Joint Strike Fighter project, Julia Gillard has announced.

    The Prime Minister this morning unveiled the 2013 Defence White Paper and said $1.5 billion would be allocated over four years to make the aircraft purchases …

    … The first three of the JSF fleet are now not expected to arrive in Australia until 2020.

    Thank you, Mr Howard …

    Dumb and dumber … who to vote for?

  92. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:55 pm

    ‘Even the arrival of the railways at Fort William, Fort Augustus and Inverness did little to harm the canal, as trains were scheduled to connect with steamboat services’

    Yep, I got it wrong, the canal has always been used as a tourist attraction.

  93. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:59 pm

    The analogy falls down completely in the long term unless their is a mass fetish for useless fibre.

    Bugger … seems mass fetish wins over personal bias …

    Business like it … apparently

    It seems more businesses are also in favour than against it, with a survey of 504 businesses by the Australian Institute of Company Directors finding 49 per cent agreed the NBN was “a positive thing for Australia”, compared with 37 per cent who disagreed.

    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/it-pro/government-it/whoever-wins-election-the-nbn-will-be-built-20130429-2iovv.html

    And so do plebs … even MORE …

    Labor’s national broadband network is more popular than the Coalition’s cheaper version, according to the first national poll on the policies.

    Of those who had heard about the government’s NBN, about 63 per cent of those surveyed supported it, reveals the Fairfax/Nielsen poll of 1400 Australians. However, of those who have heard about the Coalition’s alternative, only 41 per cent back it.

    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/opinion/political-news/poll-shows-voters-prefer-labors-nbn-20130415-2huzb.html

  94. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 6:59 pm

    The canal was built for political reasons, using government money, and it was a commercial failure.

  95. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:00 pm

    Yep, I got it wrong, the canal has always been used as a tourist attraction.

    One of the reasons I post here. egg … !!! Ta

  96. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:04 pm

    The canal was built for political reasons, using government money, and it was a commercial failure.

    Ah! A delayed split! Clever ploy!

    It was built to STIMULATE the economy … BECAUSE of political decisions, that were eventually rescinded …

    The canal was conceived as a way of providing much-needed employment to the Highland region. The area was depressed as a result of the Highland Clearances, which had deprived many of their homes and jobs, and faced with laws which sought to eradicate their culture, including the right to wear tartan, to play bagpipes, and to speak Gaelic, many were emigrating to Canada or to the Scottish lowlands

  97. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:13 pm

    “to wear tartan, to play bagpipes, and to speak Gaelic”

    Sometimes it takes a lot to convince people to better themselves.

  98. May 3, 2013 7:14 pm

    ” fibre won’t be free of maintenance.” (yomm)
    probably true, neither is copper, but copper has no more `spare` capacity in some areas, so the theory of giving users more `pairs` of copper to boost bit-rate is just bullshit anyhow

  99. May 3, 2013 7:22 pm

    ” So where is the UPS to homes in the event of a power failure? (yomm)
    so what`s the point with the Uninterruptible Power Supply.?

  100. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:44 pm

    Sometimes it takes a lot to convince people to better themselves.

    There are so many “lines” I could write … Let’s just say it was a Tory government who made those laws …

    On 27 July 1803 …

  101. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 7:58 pm

    The canal was a huge concept for its time, similar to Scaper’s dream of a VFT from Townsville to Port Hedland. It would have been commercially viable if the boom went on forever.

    Unlike John Howard’s Darwin to Adelaide slow rail, which I think he sold for a considerable loss. Nils might correct me on that.

    On this occasion the boom and bust of the capitalist system has determined that the northern VFT won’t get off the ground … for the time being.

  102. May 3, 2013 8:11 pm

    egg, a couple of decades ago, l thought fast-rail was a good idea, but l really don`t think it will ever happen now. from Sydney to Bris/Melb is about an hour flight, and very cheap with budget airlines. l really doubt a fast-rail, which can only carry passengers and `small`cargo would pass a cost benefit analysis, and it wouldn`t capture a market share from the airlines, as it would take around 3-hours from Sydney to Bris/Melb. Remember, Sydney to Melb is the `biggest` route, and Melb to Bris via Sydney is the 2nd biggest. Canberra would still be a `micro` destination for most travelers.

  103. TB Queensland permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:21 pm

    The canal was a huge concept for its time, similar to Scaper’s dream of a VFT from Townsville to Port Hedland.

    No it wasn’t (it was a major undertaking) but to link a wannabe to the project is not just silly but insulting to someone of John Watts standing at the time … read the link …

    Nils might correct me on that.

    No he won’t … LOL!

    … but l really don`t think it will ever happen now …

    Australians who have never visited and travelled Europe suffer the reverse of Europeans who have never travelled Australia .. distances are irreconcilable (?) …

    Dinner calls!

  104. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:43 pm

    I agree 7.30 and ToM also gave me some good advice on this a couple of weeks ago, which I have taken on board.

    The Sydney to Canberra run might go ahead at some point because of Sydney’s need for a second airport.

  105. egg permalink
    May 3, 2013 8:49 pm

    ‘but to link a wannabe to the project’

    I could have mentioned Gina, but I thought that probably have been more offensive.

  106. May 3, 2013 10:44 pm

    our rattling tea-tins still aren`t thinking for themselves, just regurgitating IPA clap-trap supplied by Tom Switzer _ sound familiar
    http://wmmbb.wordpress.com/2013/05/03/abc-a-case-for-privatisation/

  107. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 7:43 am

    The ABC has a left of centre ethos and should be privatised.

  108. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 8:10 am

    ‘ABORIGINAL women who are victims of violent domestic clashes have been sentenced to jail in regional NSW after retreating from their claims against their abuser – a trend that has sparked calls for an urgent review of police handling of false accusation cases.

    ‘The Weekend Australian has uncovered 20 cases in which 19 indigenous women and one 17-year-old girl from towns stretching from Walgett to Wagga Wagga were prosecuted after retracting the substance of police statements made immediately following an alleged domestic incident.’

    Natasha Robinson in the Oz

  109. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 9:31 am

    Over at AIMN we have yet another economic ignoramus repeating the line that ‘our debt is like being on $100k and having a $10k mortgage’

    It is the line Gillard has used – which is the evidence of her own economic ignorance.

    It is complete crap, but over there they just repeat complete crap and ban anyone who can show it as such.

  110. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2013 9:36 am

    our debt is like being on $100k and having a $10k mortgage

    I could pay off a $10K debt on that salary in a couple of months. Lets see Swan pay off the $250B he has created since 2007 in a couple of months

  111. May 4, 2013 11:49 am

    ” Well 730, Mr Rabbit said he wouldn’t stand in the way of RU486 and said that he would rely on the advice of the experts…

    Who’s to say he won’t change his mind about gay marriage “
    On channel-7 sunrise news segment this morning, to paraphrase,
    Mr-Rabbit will let a conscience vote on marriage `after` election,
    `but` he hasn`t changed his view on marriage,
    `and` Mr-Rabbit doesn`t believe the rest of his party has either.
    ****
    Just thought l`d give you the heads-up reb as l know this may effect you.
    Watch Mr-Rabbit carefully, he is probably just weasel-wording.
    (Joolya is equally crap on this issue too)

  112. el gordo permalink
    May 4, 2013 11:53 am

    Abbott is talking straight, he’s confident of the outcome, but will accept the majority rule. No skin off his nose.

  113. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 11:58 am

    No skin off his nose.

    But Pell might intervene on behalf of the Vatican! 😯

    Secular society my arse!

  114. May 4, 2013 12:17 pm

    ” Abbott is talking straight,”
    Pigs Arse egg.
    Mr-Rabbit is a dedicated dog-botherer, that won`t be giving the okay to to any `personal`Liberty` issue, including but not Limited to, voluntary euthanasia, womens health issues, or gay-marriage. Actually, he more likely to lead the cross-burners and cranks in sessions of poofter-bashing, womens oppression and making the ill suffer.
    reb should dig up the sunrise clip and decide for himself, and not listen to Tiebags.

  115. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 12:39 pm

    Without actually committing myself to a position, I’m thinking-

    • Commodity prices are expected to fall in the not distant future
    • The $ will fall
    • Employment in the resources sector will fall at that time
    • Manufacturing will struggle, particularly vehicle manufacturing, until the $ falls
    • Loss of jobs in manufacturing, followed quickly by loss of jobs in resources would be an economic death spiral

    Therefore, it may make reasonable sense to provide decent support to the vehicle manufacturing industry in the short term, until the end of the resources boom.

    Once manufacturing shuts, it won’t open again.

    Any other views?

  116. May 4, 2013 1:03 pm

    Actually yomm, `mining` employs 1.2% of the national workforce.
    You can bank on job losses in mining in the future,
    the mines will be automatic/robotic (not too far away)

  117. May 4, 2013 1:17 pm

    On the Auto Industry yomm,
    you need to decide just how many Billion$ should be thrown down this bottomless pit, it is already a dead-duck, has been for years, pollies just too stoopid and corrupt and cowardly to bite the bullet

  118. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 1:21 pm

    7.30, I think that might be where you show a lack of understanding of the support the resources sector provides to the economy.

    If you wander up and down St Kilda Rd in Melbourne, or around North Sydney, or Southbank in Brisbane, you’ll see the range of engineering, financial, recruitment, services companies that are entirely or substantially supported by the resources sector.

    It provides a far greater benefit to employment than simply the number of people who work on site.

    A reduction in the activity in resources sector will have a significant economic and employment effect.

    Ultimately the $ will fall, and manufacturing will be more viable, and perhaps some support is reasonable in the interim.

  119. May 4, 2013 1:38 pm

    You`re over-weighting your mining argument yomm.

    Engineering.? depends on specific type.
    When mines need digger buckets and borer fingers they are air-freighted in from places like Malaysia or Indonesia at about 25% the price to have them made in Aus.

    Recruitment.? That will be much less once robotic mine-trucks are used.
    Ditto for the Financial services that doo `pay-roll`.

  120. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2013 1:56 pm

    Manufacturing will struggle, particularly vehicle manufacturing, until the $ falls”

    I think a strong dollar is bad for exports but good for imports. If the car makers import lots of stuff to make a car it may not make much of a difference.

    But it does look like a main reason for maintaining car making is because it is a National security issue. We need to be able to make things here if Australia is attacked.

    Also I think there is a large flow on effect to people who make things for the car companies. The flow on effect may more than make up for the subsidies.

    But I must admit i was annoyed when i found out people on the production line at Holden are on 94K/year. And with overtime they can earn >100K. I do not think subsidies should be going to keep wages so high.

  121. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 1:57 pm

    • Employment in the resources sector will fall at that time

    Already happening … big time! Support services are feeling it badly now … NO new projects going ahead anywhere …

  122. May 4, 2013 1:59 pm

    Yomm, you also under-estimate `jobs`. They are the lynch-pin of most things in a capitalist/consumer society that makes the system work.

  123. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 2:46 pm

    7.30 I’m simply pointing out that the resources boom is ending, but the $ remains high. If manufacturing closes due to the high $ it won’t reopen when it falls, sites will be sold off for warehousing, commercial or residential development. The machinery will be scrapped or possibly shipped off shore.

    It certainly won’t remain in place to be switched on again.

    So the worst possible outcome is high $ closes manufacturing, just before the $ falls due to a resources decline.

    In that context industry support might not be a bad policy.

  124. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 2:51 pm

    Just an observation, with US interest rates at 0.25 its almost in tune with Islamic banking.

    ‘Sharia prohibits the fixed or floating payment or acceptance of specific interest or fees (known as riba, or usury) for loans of money.’

    We live in strange times.

  125. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 2:56 pm

    We should let market forces determine what happens to manufacturing, but obviously a government would need a mandate to bring that off.

    Abbott’s the man.

  126. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:00 pm

    “Just an observation, with US interest rates at 0.25 its almost in tune with Islamic banking.

    And I think ours is at 4%. I think this means we are paying 16 times more on interest for our debt than the Americans. Is this wrong?? Our govt debt is at 10% of gdp and this could mean that repayments are similar to 160% of GDP if we compare our repayments compared to the Americans.

    I just watched Lateline. Stephen Koukoulas was on. He made the amazing statement that Australia’s main problem was that we do not have enough debt. We need to increase our debt for some reason according to Koukoulas.

  127. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:15 pm

    Here is Koukamaniac

    http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2013/s3751658.htm

    hey’re AAA rated they’re as good as gold. The problem with the Australian level of gross debt now and this is the Basel three requirements for looking after banks in the post GFC world is we don’t have enough debt.”

  128. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:25 pm

    ‘Mr-Rabbit is a dedicated dog-botherer,’

    But it won’t interfere with government business and the reason is simple, a huge influx of backbenchers could make life difficult for Abbott.

    He has witnessed joolya’s autocratic and divisive approach to government and he won’t be following suite.

    There is a clique in the party who want gay marriage and if they think they have the numbers then it will go to a formal vote.

    The left are paranoid about this catlick man… can’t see what all the fuss is about.

  129. May 4, 2013 3:30 pm

    l am not disagree-ing so much as adding to your story yomm.
    on The high $ you are correct, more manufacturing will close,
    also correct won’t reopen when $ falls, sites sold off for warehousing, commercial etc.

    ” If manufacturing closes ”
    We have been bleeding manufacturing jobs for years,
    already in death-spiral, can`t pull out now

    ” due to the high $ ”
    Due to stupidity mainly.
    Backing `auto`, average replacement by consumer is about 8.5-years

    Should have backed the daily consumables like food

  130. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:41 pm

    Andrew Bolt has been channeling me…

    ‘If those in charge of the ABC are incapable of addressing the ABC’s bias, the ABC’s critics have no option but to call for the ABC to be starved or sold.

    ‘What can’t be fixed must be broken, and should be junked.’

  131. May 4, 2013 3:47 pm

    so egg, you don`t like my ABC either.?

  132. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:51 pm

    Recruitment.? That will be much less once robotic mine-trucks are used.

    No, 730, still need operators … RMT’s are still embryonic … Tamrock have are mote control f/end/loader that can be operated remotely but the operator must be close … robotic equipment on a minesite isn’t the same as a domestic vacuum cleaner!

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    In that context industry support might not be a bad policy.

    I’m inclined to agree … its not just the workplace and the plant and equipment loss … as an ex production manager (yeah, I’ve done that too!) its the loss of knowledge and skills that cripples an industry like manufacturing – its not just about whacking cars together …

    Strangely, it occurred in Australia in the late 1930’s … Australia couldn’t manufacture its own war materiel (weapons, ships, planes) because the country had relied so much on wool exports that the manufacturing industry had all but collapsed! We relied as did Britain on the USA to manufacture and supply just about everything … (Just substitute mining for sheep!)

    Generations forget what occurred before they were born … and these days with little history being taught those lessons will be hard learned this time around …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    We should let market forces determine what happens to manufacturing

    Mmmm … like we did with the banks during the GFC? Or the building industry with the First Home Buyers grants from both state and federal governments?

    Not that I’m disagreeing, egg, I’m a firm believer that if we live in a market economy then businesses should survive or fall on their own ability …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    When I studied Financial Management we were old that most Western economies and particularly Australia, rely on two industries to keep the economy chuffing along (and they are indicators) one was new housing and the other was new motor cars …

    Problem is that there has been so much “interference” by governments of all persuasion that the waters have been extremely muddied!

    Just sayin’

  133. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 3:59 pm

    We can agree that a high Australian dollar is making manufacturing unprofitable, but then came the straw that broke the camel’s back.

    ‘THE carbon tax is contributing to a record number of firms going to the wall with thousands of employees being laid off and companies forced to close factories that have stood for generations.

    ‘Soaring energy bills caused by the Government’s climate change scheme have been called the “straw that broke the camel’s back” by company executives and corporate rescue doctors who are trying to save ailing firms.’

    Lewis and Jacob in the Daily Terror a couple of months ago.

  134. May 4, 2013 4:03 pm

    operated remotely but the operator must be close
    Right now TB true.
    The tech`s are working on `fully-robotic` sat-nav type of trucks.
    lt will remove a couple of hundred drivers, and replace them with a couple of dozen techs. Not today, sure. But in the next few years, new mines will not employ too many people during operation.

  135. May 4, 2013 5:08 pm

    Robot trucks fitted with radars, lasers and GPS systems work Rio Tinto’s West Angelas mine in the Pilbara. ___ fully laden robot trucks weighing as much as a fuelled A380 Airbus and as high as a two-storey building are working in mining pits, often within a few metres of people. ___ So far, it is just a trial. But it is working so well that, within three years, half the trucks working for the nation’s biggest iron ore exporter – Rio Tinto – will be hauling the nation’s main resource bounty without drivers. ___ Rio, which is pioneering the move into robotic mining equipment in Australia, ___ The three-year trial employed five of the trucks; now Rio is looking at pushing the button on the purchase of 150 more, at a cost of more than $6 million each. ___ Full automation at Rio’s Pilbara operations is years away, but it is gathering pace. ___ Last month, the bell tolled for most of Rio’s 380 Pilbara iron ore train driver jobs when the company said it was reviving a program to automate the vast majority of its private Pilbara railways and the 41 train sets, each 2km long, that run on them. ___ Most of the jobs done by drivers will be replaced by computers and Perth-based operators by 2015 ___ the rapid automation of Rio’s vast network of Pilbara mines, railways and ports, which when combined make ____

    http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/rise-of-the-machines/story-e6frg12c-1226291014017

    check this one out TB

    not a lot of mine jobs in the future

  136. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 5:47 pm

    Mines aren’t particularly labour intensive now. There aren’t hundreds of truck drivers employed on any mine.

    Equipment is now more reliable, so less fitters and electricians employed – but even robot driven machinery has to be shut down for maintenance – by people.

    Mining employs people in CBD office based engineering, planning, finance, and it will continue for a while yet.

    But eventually it will decline, our $ will fall, and it would be handy to have a base load of manufacturing to continue to retain some technical capability.

  137. May 4, 2013 6:26 pm

    ” it would be handy to have a base load of manufacturing to continue to retain some technical capability. ”
    couldn`t agree more yomm, but that has not been the pattern of the ruling class to date, anybody that actually does any kind of hard-yakka has been shoved under the bus in one way or another. lf they haven`t been shafted in the name of `progress` with automation (auto-assembly_to_cane-cutters) then they are being shafted under `free-trade` which just allows dumping of cheap stuff. Victoria lost it`s last fruit cannery this week.

  138. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 4, 2013 6:33 pm

    It is the high wages in Australia which is killing us. Germany is a large exporter with similar wage rates but they have Europe to sell to and I think they major in high tech stuff.

  139. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 6:48 pm

    Neil, I don’t believe it is the high wages, and we shouldn’t preserve manufacturing by cutting incomes.

    The big problem with traditional manufacturing is the high $, combined with the dead hand of unnecessary union intervention and disruption.

    Manufacturing plants don’t get built without a whole lot of union disruption, demarcation disputes, claims. Operations don’t achieve best practice because the construction coverage leaks into operations, preserving redundant work practices and coverage.

    Manufacturing plants shut downs and overhaul get similarly disrupted.

    Other areas that could hold technical capability- airlines, power generation & distribution- suffer similar union disruption.

    The above represents a good reason not to provide industry support, so I haven’t made up my mind.

  140. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 6:49 pm

    lt will remove a couple of hundred drivers, and replace them with a couple of dozen techs.

    And that’s “good” for the economy? Think about it … I avoid the “self serve aisles” in supermarkets … if people don’t earn wages doing tasks … then who gets the money?

    The Robber Barons just keep at it …

    BTW … where (how) do you get the idea that you can replace a coupla hundred “drivers” (actually operators) with a coupla dozen techs? Like drones a “tech” can operate half a dozen drones … you obviously don’t play first person PC games … a five truck trial is just that … and Rio are one of the most anti personnel companies I’ve worked for (as a self employed consultant) …

    I suppose TV camera operators could be replaced by robots … but they aren’t …

    If the Robber Brons think that eventual control over the “dull masses” (Sir Wnston Churchill) will happen when everything is automated … they need to read the history of France …

    Slightly OT but related … I’m currently researching 3D printers … if I buy one (around $1000) then I can replicate (plastic) parts and build a BETTER one …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    But eventually it will decline, our $ will fall, and it would be handy to have a base load of manufacturing to continue to retain some technical capability.

    Once again I agree … the problem we have as we toddle down the Uber Kapitalist track of our “big brother” the USA … (now in steep decline BTW) … is that people are obsessed with ways to make a quid dollar … it narrows focus and stunts long term thinking … its all about now, now, now … my pet beef the smart phone is a classic example … why do you need to answer a text (of all things) while you are driving … and run the risk of killing a complete stranger and the rest of your life … ?

  141. May 4, 2013 6:50 pm

    kneel, Germans are also losing some of their manufacturing to eastern europe, it also will depend on `what` they try and export, and to `whom`. Comparing most countries in the rest of the world isn`t really much use, Australia is basically too different to the rest of the world, tho there is some similarities with Canada, the landscape and weather are still too different.

  142. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 6:51 pm

    It is the high wages in Australia which is killing us

    It is, Kneel, the USA’s basic wage is $7.50 ph … what’s wrong with that?

    Richest nation in the world has been the biggest urban myth in history!

  143. TB Queensland permalink
    May 4, 2013 6:53 pm

    Comparing most countries in the rest of the world isn`t really much use

    So who do we compare with?

  144. May 4, 2013 7:08 pm

    ” BTW … where (how) do you get the idea that you can replace a coupla hundred “drivers” (actually operators) with a coupla dozen techs? ”
    TV doco`s TB

    ” Like drones a “tech” can operate half a dozen drones … ”
    exactly

    ” you obviously don’t play first person PC games … ” NOPE

    “a five truck trial is just that … ”
    read the perthnow item.?

    ” I suppose TV camera operators could be replaced by robots … ”
    just like drones
    ****************************************************
    l`m not saying it`s good TB, just `how` it is.
    l reckon it`s stoopid, major national fcuk-up
    ******************************************************
    TB yank minimum wage of $7.50/hour only came in half-way thru Obama`s first term. Before that it was $4.75/hour. The california orange farmers would go to town to find Mexicans at picking time and pay the Mexicans $1_to_$1.50/hour to pick.

  145. May 4, 2013 7:41 pm

    ” unnecessary union intervention and disruption.” (yomm)
    l know it fits with your favorite ”unionz-boo” theme, but it`s not really the case.
    lf you actually look back at recent events, you might notice that most of the union stuff is `reactionary`, that is, we don`t hear from a union until a disaster event has actually happened. Last month the brick wall collapsed and killed three people, no union noise was made before-hand, only after. l can think of scaffolds collapsing in Sydney and Melbourne within days, a crane coming down in one of the cities, and only noise afterwards.
    The `free-trade` fetish is what`s killing manufacturing and primary producers.

  146. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 8:05 pm

    And the cry went up… FREE TRADE or PROTECTION?

    This has been around for over a hundred years and perhaps its time to consider our future.

  147. egg permalink
    May 4, 2013 8:17 pm

    But lets look at some of the benefits…. it indirectly helped workers get a fair wage.

    ‘By 1905, the protectionists were in the ascendancy, and Alfred Deakin’s policy gained prominence. To qualify for protection, companies had to pay their employees ‘a fair and reasonable wage.”

    ‘The 1907 Harvester Case, in which Mr Justice Higgins of the Commonwealth Court of Conciliation and Arbitration delivered his renowned judgment on the ‘living wage,’ confirmed what became a remarkable statement of social policy in Australia. According to Higgins, Sunshine Harvesters could only receive protection from North American competitors in the event it provided its workers with what amounted to the living wage.’

  148. May 4, 2013 8:26 pm

    l hear what your sayin egg, but there is more options that the fools in charge haven`t even considered. Blanket `free-trade` and blanket `protectionism` are the two opposite extremes and ignores all tools that lay between them. Tax-law and `Havens` are part of this problem, along with spineless, weak national leadership.(from both sides) and states.

  149. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 10:00 pm

    it`s not really the case

    The single issue that has created the rust bucket that used to be manufacturing is poor industrial behaviour.

    It is the single issue that has caused under investment for 2 or 3 decades

  150. May 4, 2013 10:36 pm

    ” The single issue ”
    There is rarely `single-issues` or reasons for anything yomm, trapped yourself within your own ideology there. `Under-investment` can`t be blamed for primary produce being ploughed back into the ground by farmers. The foreign investment fetish is a highly useful indicator tho, it shows `new` local wealth is not being created.

  151. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 4, 2013 11:31 pm

    I don’t think so. For decades there ahs been no capability to plan upgrade, or expansion, or renewal, or reconstruction…without a huge risk of industrial disruption.

    Investors shy away from the cost and time overruns due to the industrial activity, so plant degrades, there is no new investment.

    Thanks unions.

    …and I may have persuaded myself that industry assistance is just a waste of money when unions are so determined to run manufacturing into the ground.

  152. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 5, 2013 12:03 am

    I thought it was dropping the tariffs which wiped out our manufacturing base. I think people came to the conclusion we could make televisions in Australia for say $5,000 or import them from China for $500.

    I think dropping the tariffs had bipartisan support.

  153. May 5, 2013 9:14 am

    I just bought two new pairs of dress shoes online for US $100 each plus $20 postage.

    The same shoes cost $250 – $270 each here in Australia.

    Expect to see more of this if the govt decides to hike the GST.

  154. TB Queensland permalink
    May 5, 2013 10:33 am

    ” Like drones a “tech” can operate half a dozen drones … ”
    exactly

    My poor grammar … was meant to be sarc …

    The single issue that has created the rust bucket that used to be manufacturing is poor industrial behaviour.

    Often by management … I’ve been on BOTH sides of the fence … lack of R&D and innovation is the major problem … and poor skills/knowledge learning systems …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++

    I just bought two new pairs of dress shoes online for US $100 each plus $20 postage..

    HOW MUCH!!!!!

  155. May 5, 2013 10:41 am

    Some of us do choose to shop outside of K-Mart and Big W TB… 🙄

  156. egg permalink
    May 5, 2013 10:55 am

    ‘How good is this….?’

    Its wonderful seeing society change for the better on this issue, it makes everyone free and relaxed.

    A couple of gay guys staying at my place had booked as a double and on their arrival my business partner offered to set up another bed.

    “No, that’s fine”, they said.

    Just a few years ago that wouldn’t have happened.

  157. May 5, 2013 11:04 am

    “Just a few years ago that wouldn’t have happened.”

    This is true egg…

    I used to have to ask if a place was “gay friendly” before booking. Now I don’t bother..

    Although your business partner is probably displaying a hint of homophobia – why the presumption that they would need another bed? If they booked a double then clearly that’s what they wanted..

    Would your business partner ask if they wanted another bed if it was a M/F couple?

    I suspect not.

    Just sayin’.

  158. egg permalink
    May 5, 2013 11:38 am

    ‘Although your business partner is probably displaying a hint of homophobia’

    Not all, we have gay friends in common who are happily settled, its just that over the years the gay couples that turned up were always defensive … not wishing to offend… and would take separate rooms.

    My business partner did get it wrong, in that she thought they might want a twin share… according to standard practice.

  159. TB Queensland permalink
    May 5, 2013 1:43 pm

    … according to standard practice.

    LOL! But “who’s” standard practice … good post, egg …

  160. egg permalink
    May 5, 2013 1:59 pm

    ‘But “who’s” standard practice …’

    It was always their choice to take an apartment with two bedrooms, so this new turn of events is a wake up call to the accommodation industry.

    Even though we don’t yet have gay marriage the people have accepted the concept and are relaxed about it. That’s why Abbott will have a party room vote on the issue, because he’s pragmatic and a populist.

  161. egg permalink
    May 5, 2013 3:31 pm

    The ‘progressive’ (sic) blogosphere ‘have just accepted (the NDIS) as a political victory for Abbott, not a policy win for Julia Gillard’s government.’

    Joolya thought she had him wedged….ha ha.

  162. May 5, 2013 4:57 pm

    With that, and his apparent willingness to stomp on the Waterhouse Infection, Abbott, is certainly playing a shrewd, winning hand at the moment.

    There’s no denying it.

  163. May 6, 2013 7:31 am

    With just over four months to go before the federal election, Australians have switched off, with more than a third having little or no interest in September’s election. A national survey by Melbourne University also found most Australians believe the quality of leadership and the tone of debate is worse than usual. And 70 per cent lack confidence in the federal government, including almost half of Labor voters.

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/voters-tune-out-in-droves-with-4-months-to-go-20130505-2j1fd.html#ixzz2SSLY7Qwu

  164. egg permalink
    May 6, 2013 7:41 am

    ‘Abbott, is certainly playing a shrewd, winning hand at the moment.’

    Yep, he’s even unloading promises he can’t keep, such as the $4.3 billion paid parental leave scheme.

    This was his baby, but he’ll have to defer it until the budget is back in the black.

  165. May 6, 2013 8:15 am

    reb, l don`t usually read the comments, but these one`s are funny.
    Did you notice the embedded media polled even worse.
    http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/political-news/voters-tune-out-in-droves-with-4-months-to-go-20130505-2j1fd.html#ixzz2SSLY7Qwu

    ******************************
    ” Yep, he’s even unloading promises he can’t keep, such as the $4.3 billion paid parental leave scheme.”
    lf that`s true egg, chalk up another point on the 730reportland prediction scorecard.

  166. egg permalink
    May 6, 2013 8:42 am

    ‘If that`s true egg’

    To be honest, I’m just making shit up but clearly he has no choice in the matter.

  167. May 6, 2013 9:09 am

    Eric Abetz pandering to the religious nutjobs…

    WARNING: It’s vomit inducing.

    http://abetz.com.au/speeches/address-to-the-australian-christian-lobby-conference-brisbane

  168. May 6, 2013 10:05 am

    So reb, you went trolling around the Abetz site and expected NOT to be vomit-induced.?

  169. May 6, 2013 10:15 am

    ” To be honest, I’m just making shit up ”
    egg, it was pretty clear to me when Mr-Rabbit announced the rolled-gold parental plan, he would jettison it at the first sign of surplus withdrawal, glad you caught up

  170. egg permalink
    May 6, 2013 10:24 am

    Its not that he wants to jettison the PPL scheme, its middle class welfare, but he’s a pragmatist and it can be easily jettisoned.

  171. May 6, 2013 10:45 am

    “So reb, you went trolling around the Abetz site and expected NOT to be vomit-induced.?”

    No, I found it by clicking a link on twitter…

    I just never expected so much vomit to be forthcoming….

    It made me feel physically sick to think that that so-called speech actually had any merit, “little lone” having the temerity to publish it on his web site as something to be proud of.

    What a complete tosser he is.

  172. TB Queensland permalink
    May 6, 2013 10:55 am

    Abbott, is certainly playing a shrewd, winning hand at the moment.

    But haven’t you noticed how he now has to go back to the puppeteers before he makes an “announcement” … he probably can’t spell spontaneous … ’cause he certainly ain’t …

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    To be honest, I’m just making shit up

    NO! Giggle, giggle!

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    What a complete tosser he is.

    You’re in a good mood today! He’s a Fuckwit™ and an arsehole of the lowest order!

  173. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 7, 2013 12:17 pm

    Business as usual in Unionland.

  174. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 1:31 pm

    Old habits die hard. Maitland is well practiced in lying, as are so many corrupt union officials. Maitland’s old union continues to expand its power in the ALP.

    Former union boss John Maitland has been caught lying to a corruption hearing within minutes of sitting in the witness box.

    A secret recording of a phone conversation was played to Mr Maitland after he was asked repeatedly whether he had ever lied to the inquiry and if he understood he must not discuss private evidence with others outside.

    From The Age

  175. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 7, 2013 1:36 pm

    The ICAC hearings are so popularly attended here in Sydney they could have held them at the Olympic Stadium.

    They are the most sought after seats in the City

  176. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 1:57 pm

    I see SB linked the same story.

    I wonder how many current ALP MPs were sponsored by Maitland…Combet certainly as a former MUA official.

    Maitland is a crook, but he’s been a stalwart of the ALP hack/faceless man/warlord structure. The ALP is just poisoned with this type, and a couple of terms in opposition might encourage them to offload their corrupt structure.

  177. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:05 pm

    TONY Abbott’s expensive paid parental leave scheme is “all about” encouraging women of “calibre” to have children, the Opposition Leader said today

    Read more: http://www.news.com.au/business/worklife/big-business-slams-abbotts-paid-parental-leave-scheme/story-e6frfm9r-1226636500339#ixzz2SZlsVzXy

    It is certainly generous by Australian standards, but not really so in comparison with those operating in a range of other OECD countries, and many others too.

    The notion that professional women should be encouraged to have children is reasonable, and good for society.

    It’s an interesting question and not one easily dismissed as middle class welfare. On balance, I’m in favour of a systems more generous than the current one, perhaps phase in Abbott’s over 5 years. I really don’t like the big bang approach to new policies, they finish up just getting dismantled at each change of government.

  178. egg permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:17 pm

    “There’s only one vote for it in the party room.”

    It makes Abbott look good in the eyes of women, so even if the party room force him to drop the PPL scheme it doesn’t matter….

  179. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:25 pm

    A LEADING union official has stepped into the upper house of State Parliament.
    Cesar Melhem announced today that he will move into the Victorian Legislative Council to take a position left vacant by Labor’s Martin Pakula.

    Mr Melhem follows in the footsteps of Federal Employment Minister Bill Shorten, who was also an AWU secretary before his political life.

    Great!! That’s just what the ALP needs – another low grade union hack in parliament. Cesar Melhem is no Bill Shorten.

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/union-official-cesar-melhem-enters-state-parliament/story-e6frf7kx-1226635908276

  180. TB Queensland permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:35 pm

    Abbott: ‘Paid parental leave scheme for women of calibre'</i.

    This tells you a lot about the wannabe … 🙄

    http://www.news.com.au/business/worklife/big-business-slams-abbotts-paid-parental-leave-scheme/comments-e6frfm9r-1226636500339

  181. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:36 pm

    “Maitland is a crook, but he’s been a stalwart of the ALP hack/faceless man/warlord structure. The ALP is just poisoned with this type, and a couple of terms in opposition might encourage them to offload their corrupt structure.”

    The whole Uniomnland system is corrupt. Union officials have little accountability to members. Unlike company directors they do not have to disclose the benefits they receive, they essentially set their own salaries and seem to hold office permanently, subject to the occasional challenge from a rival faction.

    This, coupled with the fact that the unions control half the votes at ALP conference means that many union officials move on to a parliamentary career. It is little wonder then that Albanese, Cameron and Combet have had to explain their links to Unionland crooks to ICAC. It is little wonder that the PM is under police investigation for the AWU slush fund scandal or that pathological liar Craig Thomson is dancing his grotesque little dance around the truth. Once the cream of the working class/now the dregs of the middle class indeed!

    Unions have little relevance in the workplace these days. Their main function is as a conveyor belt delivering to high office the misshapen turds that bob to the surface of the stinking union cesspit. It is no wonder that we have a blood-spattered PM expert in factional power games but devoid of the necessary skill to govern well or even competently.

    (And please don’t bother with the look-over-there BS. It is not relevant.)

  182. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:38 pm

    “Mr Melhem follows in the footsteps of Federal Employment Minister Bill Shorten, who was also an AWU secretary before his political life.”

    Just what the country needs. Long live the AWU!

  183. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:42 pm

    I can understand ‘women of calibre’ TB. Professional women are renowned for delaying family. On the other hand, welfare recipients…

    Now call me elitist, but I wouldn’t mind seeing more professional women become mothers.

    (and that’s not simply because I’m a natural magnet to them)

  184. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 7, 2013 2:51 pm

    “and that’s not simply because I’m a natural magnet to them”

    Obviously they are so busy with their careers that they don’t have time to be discerning and have to settle for any old gigolo!

  185. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 7, 2013 3:16 pm

    Yes, Tanya’s quite upset at Tony’s overt misogyny. Although back in June last year, that choice of words wasn’t such a bad thing……..

    http://www.tonywindsor.com.au/releases/120620a.pdf

    Hint, Tanya, you don’t get far in political life without expressing the words “high calibre”.

  186. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 7, 2013 3:17 pm

    That really should read…..”You don’t go long in politics”….. Use of the expression is not a condition of success, just that it goes with the territory.

  187. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 7, 2013 3:18 pm

    By the way, TB, Abbott said “women of that calibre”. Kind of changes the meaning.

    Don’t you think?

  188. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 7, 2013 3:57 pm

    “The notion that professional women should be encouraged to have children is reasonable, and good for society. ”

    That’s right. Professional women who have a high degree of education don’t just breed like many others do.

    Unlike the the “breeders” that just lay in wait each night for any sign of a flouro jacket coming in the front door early as no overtime means the income will need to be made up for somehow in order to afford the fags , the pokies and a few cartons of VB.

    Then once they are past being fertile they just hang out watching question time well into their senior years.

    They truly are tiresome burdens upon the rest of us

  189. egg permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:02 pm

    ‘Now call me elitist, but I wouldn’t mind seeing more professional women become mothers.’

    Over at the cafe there is confusion on the subject, but when they get their thoughts together they will say its elitist and Tony is true to form.

    Upper middle class welfare won’t get a run over this cycle …..

  190. egg permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:13 pm

    ‘Unlike the lower middle class “breeders” who consider it a decent investment.

    ‘Baby Bonus is a non-taxable, income tested payment of $5,000 per eligible child paid in 13 fortnightly instalments.’

    The baby bonus is middle class welfare and should be abolished altogether.

  191. TB Queensland permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:24 pm

    Kind of changes the meaning.Don’t you think?

    Yes it does …

    Even more demeaning … he was still referring (as ToM is) to “professional” career females … I believe he also mentioned women “we … train to higher degree level” …

    We are dicussing a “welfare” program here, no matter who pays … and the remark is not only sexist and elitist but discriminatory in a number of ways… unless only women can become parents …

    And this … referring to the policy itself

    Mr Abbott’s predicament has been summed up by a shadow minister: “There’s only one vote for it in the party room.”

    (the first sentence of my original post wasn’t mine BTW … you’ll notice the stuffed up )

  192. IPA address permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:26 pm

    ‘Unlike the the “breeders” that just lay in wait each night for any sign of a flouro jacket coming in the front door early as no overtime means the income will need to be made up for somehow in order to afford the fags , the pokies and a few cartons of VB.’

    Nice. 😉

  193. 2DT Shock Jock permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:27 pm

    ‘Baby Bonus is a non-taxable, income tested payment of $5,000 per eligible child paid in 13 fortnightly instalments.’

    That’s right Egg…………………………..6 months of tax free fags and booze money and pokies.

    Eventually the breeders retire to Queensland and whinge and whine over the blogosphere about how tough they had it.

    Did you know a few infiltrated our ADF………..?

    Julia had her pyjama party/sleepover at Blacktown a few weeks ago to win a few over

  194. IPA address permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:32 pm

    “Christians, who make up some 42 percent of Asian-Americans, face surveillance and repression, particularly, in China, where religion is tightly regulated, and dissent from the party line can land adherents in jail. Over half of Asian immigrants, Pew notes, cite freedom of religion as a key advantage of living in America. New faith-based migration could also be seen soon among Christians fleeing increasingly Islamic regimes in Egypt, Syria and other Middle Eastern countries.”

    Religious freedom lures many to U.S. from Asia

  195. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:43 pm

    Maybe women of “that” calibre might have the pride to encourage the best out of their children. I’m agnostic on PPL, although we’ve certainly taken it.

    His point is all about creating an environment where women, who do have the children because thay have a womb and stuff and are called Loretta, don’t have to choose parenthood or career at the expense of the other.

    People who complain about the lack of female numbers on boards of companies, in partnerships of law firms, and in other senior occupations should really be applauding this. It encourages mothers to remain engaged in the workplace and with their careers. Is that really such a bad thing? In our case, PPL has made no difference to our parental decisions, but in others it might.

    It’s probably economically a bit much, but to try to couch the argument in the old failed misogyny rubbish is false and will backfire, as it did last time.

  196. grodo permalink
    May 7, 2013 4:57 pm

    If the upper middle class can’t be subsidised, then the lower middle class shouldn’t either…. its only fair.

  197. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:04 pm

    “the remark is not only sexist and elitist but discriminatory in a number of ways”

    It was not just tawdry but completely disgraceful. Talk about ‘tin ear’.

  198. armchair opinionator permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:18 pm

    Baby Bonus is a non-taxable, income tested payment of $5,000 per eligible child paid in 13 fortnightly instalments.’

    That’s right Egg…………………………..6 months of tax free fags and booze money and pokies.

    Nothing of the sort, but you do show your snobbery and your downward envy of anything other than a big stick approach to the poor. Your own ‘top-down’ class warfare is always screamingly obvious.

    The BB was introduced as the only acceptable version of maternity leave for liberals, it was deliberately not means tested. The libs could not bear the thought that wealthy stay-at-home mums would not get baby making money from taxpayers. Apparently they must have ‘equality’ with the paid workforce even if they don’t work.

    Does anyone really think abbotts PPL will eventuate?

    We’ll have a partisan ‘independent’ audit that will find we are so badly off due to ‘labor’s spending’ that the nation cannot afford anything, we must have austerity for everyone but the wealthy. There will be no mention of the structural deficit that labor inherited from howard/costello with middle class welfare and the necessary shepherding of the country through the GFC. We’ll need to sell everything off and there will be immediate calls for increased productivity through all kinds of urgent IR reforms. The PPL will be shoved to the back room never to see the light of day. We will get ‘teh surplus’ but it will come from the transfer of federal govt debt to ordinary australians – watch the private debt soar.

  199. el gordo permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:22 pm

    ‘Does anyone really think abbotts PPL will eventuate?’

    Not in his first term.

  200. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:42 pm

    Abbott should have a 5 year program to extend the current very modest scheme.

    The Gillard scheme is incredibly miserly by international standards.

  201. el gordo permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:49 pm

    Gillard has been criticized for reducing the bonus for subsequent children, which comes into effect on July 1.

    I found this informative.

    http://theconversation.com/time-to-put-baby-bonus-myths-to-bed-10320

  202. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    May 7, 2013 5:50 pm

    ”they don’t have time to be discerning and have to settle for any old gigolo!

    They could do worse, and choose a former crooner from Brisbane who wears zip up shoes, and thinks shiraz should be chilled and arrive on the table in a 4 litre box.

  203. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 7, 2013 6:04 pm

    Just heard an interview with Penny Wong. The answers to most question were

    TonyAbbottonyAbbottonyAbbott………….Joe Hockey…………………Peter Costello ………………….TonyAbbottonyAbbottonyAbbott

  204. TB Queensland permalink
    May 7, 2013 6:16 pm

    We’ll need to sell everything off and there will be immediate calls for increased productivity through all kinds of urgent IR reforms.

    While the real problem is folk ducking under desks, around corners and into the lav to play with their mobile phones … 🙂

    Wally & ToM

  205. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 7, 2013 6:18 pm

    LOL

  206. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 7, 2013 6:20 pm

    And………………

    “Nothing of the sort, but you do show your snobbery and your downward envy of anything other than a big stick approach to the poor. Your own ‘top-down’ class warfare is always screamingly obvious. ”

    PMLATO

    (Pissing Myself Laughing At That One)

  207. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 7, 2013 6:23 pm

    “Just heard an interview with Penny Wong”

    I heard one from her last year.

    It went…………………… “Surplus…………………..definitely in Surplus……………….this Governement has delivered………………………..In Surplus……………………………We are in Surplus as promised……………………”

    Ya dont hear her saying that anymore

  208. May 7, 2013 6:48 pm

    ““Christians, who make up some 42 percent of Asian-Americans, face surveillance and repression, particularly, in China, where religion is tightly regulated, and dissent from the party line can land adherents in jail. “

    Oh spare me the sob story for teh christians.

    Frankly the constant bleating from the christians lately that their somehow no longer afforded the respect they expect by “the rest of society” is becoming increasingly tiresome.

  209. TB Queensland permalink
    May 7, 2013 8:49 pm

    Now muslims are a different story … 😉

  210. Ol' Sancty permalink
    May 7, 2013 10:01 pm

    And the pooftas……it’s them pooftas that get me!!

  211. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 7, 2013 10:09 pm

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/budget-hole-could-deepen-to-80-billion/story-fn3dxiwe-1226636445707

    Rate cuts due to fiscal policy: Swan

    These rates are possible because the government has (had) in place a responsible fiscal policy over the past five and half to six years,” Mr Swan told reporters in Canberra.

    So the low interest rates are due to the genius of Swan but the budget deficit is due to the GFC. Nothing to do with Swan.

  212. TB Queensland permalink
    May 8, 2013 9:45 am

    It was not just tawdry but completely disgraceful. Talk about ‘tin ear’.

    Abbotts real problem though is that his “tin ear” is soldered to lead brain …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    So the low interest rates are due to the genius of Swan but the budget deficit is due to the GFC. Nothing to do with Swan.

    As I’ve said before governments have far less impact on business in a market economy than the urban myths suppose …

    BTW, didn’t someone say that the interest rates would never be lower than a Coalition government a few years ago? 😆

    Just sayin’

  213. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 8, 2013 9:51 am

    “BTW, didn’t someone say that the interest rates would never be lower than a Coalition government a few years ago

    You couldn’t resist could you. But I still think Howard was right. Whether it would be good or bad i do not know but interest rates would be lower under a Coalition govt.

    Have you seen the rates overseas?? Some countries have zero interest rates. Ours are way above the rest of the world most probably because of Swans deficit budgets. We need a high rate so people will lend us money to pay our debt.

  214. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 8, 2013 9:54 am

    Another point. We are paying much higher interest rates on our government debt. So interest payments on govt debt at 30% of GDP is most probably similar to some European country with govt debt at 100% of GDP.

  215. May 8, 2013 10:47 am

    That`s nonsense kneel, AAA rating means we pay a lower interest rate on borrowings than the basket cases are.

  216. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 8, 2013 11:41 am

    What is our bond rate compared to Germany’s?? I think you will find ours is much higher. We are paying a lot more interest on our smaller amount of debt which most probably equals what Germany is paying on their larger amount of debt.

    And remember you have to add Federal and State debt together which equals about 30% of our GDP.

  217. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 12:15 pm

    “….AAA rating means we pay a lower interest rate on borrowings than the basket cases are.”

    AAA rating actually means that we are rated Investment Grade that’s all. The actual “spread” within the class can be quite large as it’s the extra price we have to pay to obtain the funds we require.

    From memory anything below BBB is Junk but the 3 major agencies do differ in their gradings slightly.

    I’ve got a feeling that 1 of the 3 majors has Germany on a AAA rating but on “Negative Watch”. Yet still they pay less than us.

    And I’m pretty sure that last week 1 of the 3 issued a subtle warning about continuing deficits undermining our ratings.

    Did anyone notice that through all the bravado of Swan yesterday about low rates that he actually looked like a very very worried man.

    He was throwing off some real negative vibes yesterday I thought.

    Don’t forget representative of S&P , Moodys and Fitch all attend the Budget lockup and get the opportunity to question Swan whilst in there.

    I think there might be a good deal of cage rattling by the Big 3 before the election and I don’t think it will be helped by the forward estimates or the debt ceiling he declares next week.

    Lets face it…………. This bunch of economic fuckwits didn’t listen when so many commentators said :

    “You’ve spent enough to get through the GFC …….now stop spending”

    No they ignored the advise and now the Treasury is out of bullets and the RBA is low on them.

    Thanks to this pack of c**ts we are now on the verge of a fiscal and monetary crisis.

  218. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 12:31 pm

    Another example of “We Told You So to Swan”

    And now we have the news that part of the Carbon Tax compensation now needs to be removed because they set the tax per tonne too high.

    But as usual they ignored all the warings.

    http://www.news.com.au/national-news/federal-election/families-to-miss-out-on-promised-tax-cuts-as-budget-woes-continue/story-fnho52ip-1226637363434

  219. TB Queensland permalink
    May 8, 2013 2:37 pm

    You couldn’t resist could you. But I still think Howard was right.

    Well you keep spouting historical data like a Liberal Party robot with diarroeah … as for Howard – of course you would …

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    AAA rating actually means that we are rated Investment Grade that’s all

    So, Kneel, what, Wally, is actually saying … especially if it was someone who he disagreed with … is that you’re talking out of your arse (see above) … 🙂

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Thanks to this pack of c**ts we are now on the verge of a fiscal and monetary crisis.

    Oh, stop being a little girl and suck it up princess … I doubt you’ve ever seen one …

    Have you ever wondered where the “” 3 major agencies “” were in the years leading up to the GFC … ?

    And I have been saying that the GFC ain’t over yet – I hear no fat lady singing – just a lot of moaning and groaning … from the rich and comfortable …

  220. Neil of Sydney permalink
    May 8, 2013 4:55 pm

    So, Kneel, what, Wally, is actually saying … especially if it was someone who he disagreed with … is that you’re talking out of your arse (see above)

    What did i say that was wrong?? I think Walrus was replying to 7.30.

    And I still think Howard was right .Interest rates would have been lower under the Coalition. Bad news of course for self funded retirees.

    Have you seen the cash rates in Europe?? Ours are WAY above everybody else. Some countries have a zero cash rate.

    Why are our rates so much higher than Europe. It looks strange.

  221. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 5:42 pm

    “I think Walrus was replying to 7.30.”

    Correct

  222. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 5:55 pm

    I think Howard is being taken waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay out of the context of the time these days.

    I think he was implying with his “rates will always be lower line” that given normal circumstances the RBA will respond to an LNP government in line with the long term trend on the low side.

    The implication being that if the ALP was in power and expenditure was out of control the RBA would need to raise rates higher to rein in the economy. Now we find they have spent so much they need to contract severely with the RBA doing all the heavy lifting. So here we sit at “emergency rates”. And they are fuckwit Swan’s own words during the GFC for rates at this level.

    And don’t forget Howard said that when the Big 4 were raising and lowering in line with the RBA in the main.

    But those days are gone and the Big 4 do what they like.

    Besides whether rates are higher or lower depends very much on the normal interest “price” plus the risk premium attached (perhaps a Forex fear) which is dependent on where a Bank is raising the funds i.e. domestic or overseas.

    A very complex mechanism.

    But a bunch of economic fuckwits running the joint does not help.

  223. May 8, 2013 6:04 pm

    AAA
    l highly doubt that. A basket case P.I.G.S and Cypress will not get the cheaper rate a less risky AAA country, they will pay more, as more risky to lender.
    FYI Germany not basket case.

    Same works in general banking,
    Blue-collar slobs seen as more risky, pay higher interest on loans.
    Doctors seen as less risky, automatically gets lower rate offered to them.

  224. May 8, 2013 6:10 pm

    ” the GFC ain’t over yet ”
    correct
    ” just a lot of moaning and groaning_ from the rich and comfortable ”
    agree

  225. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 6:16 pm

    Germany might not be a basket case but……………….For your information

    http://www.moodys.com/research/Moodys-changes-the-outlook-to-negative-on-Germany-Netherlands-Luxembourg–PR_251214

  226. egg permalink
    May 8, 2013 6:18 pm

    ‘Why are our rates so much higher than Europe. It looks strange.’

    The mining boom was the prime mover in Oz, to restrain inflationary pressure, but now the fat lady sings.

    The nearby goldmine is coming off and workers are being given notice, which negatively impacts the nearest town in a multitude of ways.

  227. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 6:18 pm

    ” the GFC ain’t over yet ”

    Not for the EU.

    But it appears more likely that thanks to a new abundance of oil and gas the USA will sail out of their current problems albeit with some headwinds.

  228. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 8, 2013 6:29 pm

    Cheap fuel and stories like this will save the USA.

    Could you imagine something like this happening in China ?

    http://techland.time.com/2013/03/04/how-an-83-year-old-inventor-beat-the-high-cost-of-3d-printing/

  229. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 10, 2013 2:27 pm

    Former ALP minister on the current cretins:

    There is so little credibility for the government to stand on that no one is bothering to listen… September can’t come soon enough. The election will see carnage on a scale not seen in most slaughterhouses.

    .

  230. May 10, 2013 3:15 pm

    “There is so little credibility for the government to stand on that no one is bothering to listen.”

    My sentiments exactly!

  231. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 10, 2013 3:21 pm

    Also from the article:

    This week the PM conceded she had moments when she doubted herself. At last, she shares something with most Australians.

  232. IPA address permalink
    May 10, 2013 3:55 pm

    ‘Nothing says “‘look at how many amazing people Canberra has produced” quite like a hideous airborne turtle with ten tits.’

    😯

  233. May 10, 2013 4:02 pm

    That’s priceless!

  234. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 10, 2013 4:21 pm

    Surely that is just some drug-addled photoshopper taking the piss?

  235. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 10, 2013 4:32 pm

    What is with the 10 tits? Is it a metaphor for the federal government spraying its lactating largess on an increasingly dependent population which has become infantilised by the nanny state?

  236. Splatterbottom permalink
    May 10, 2013 4:35 pm

    Actually the tits look kind of cute – there may be a bit frottaging going on if it gets too close to the ground!

  237. TB Queensland permalink
    May 10, 2013 6:47 pm

    Wally, thanks for the 3D Printer link … you may recall I’ve been researching which model to buy … I knew about the pellet extruder but not the history … (now in my Favourites) … a cheap 3D scanner is on its way too … that’ll be the complete set!

    Ask anyone who invented the transistor and you’ll be surprised at some of the answers …

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    “There is so little credibility for the government to stand on that no one is bothering to listen.”

    My sentiments exactly!

    Mine too!

    But I’d add it goes for the Opposition as well …

    “‘look at how many amazing people Canberra has produced”

    And toillette (where is the bugger anyway!) wonders why people in the city should want to own a rifle or six …

    And the POMMIE company who “made” it owns it still after a $300,000, outlay fkn high rental!

  238. Evil Walrus permalink
    May 10, 2013 6:49 pm

    No probs TB

    “Ask anyone who invented the transistor and you’ll be surprised at some of the answers …”

    Some hairy bloke in a dress ?

  239. TB Queensland permalink
    May 10, 2013 6:49 pm

    I had to look “frottaging” up … what a sheltered life I must have enjoyed … 🙄

    I’ve suspected for sometime you studied “art”, sb … such a colourful language style … 😉

  240. TB Queensland permalink
    May 10, 2013 6:50 pm

    You looked it up!

  241. TB Queensland permalink
    May 10, 2013 6:52 pm

    Wally, most people will say – the Japanese …

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor#History

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