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Gravity Movie Review

October 6, 2013

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With thanks to our exclusive sponsors, we present another instalment in our sporadic series of concise movie reviews especially designed for the attention-span challenged.

This weekend we went along to see Gravity…

Sandra Bullock and George Clooney star in this sci-fi epic directed by Alfonso Cuarón.

They find themselves alone and stranded after their space shuttle is damaged.

George Clooney dies but Sandra Bullock survives after miraculously managing to make it back to Earth.

THE END.

Four stars.

 

*Spoiler alert: This review may contain key elements of the plot.

 

 

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90 Comments leave one →
  1. October 6, 2013 8:20 pm

    You MUST see it in 3D by the way…

  2. TB Queensland permalink
    October 6, 2013 8:39 pm

    George Clooney dies …

    Fk! Sreb! Now The Minister won’t go! (In my own case its probably a good thing … but I’m not a “big” fan of Ms Bullock either {what a surname 🙄 } … in fact I’m not a fan of Ms Bullock at all …

    BTW, WTF is a *Spolier alert:

    If you mean “spoiler” 😉 it should be at the FKN TOP! Before we read it … 🙄 🙄

    Are certain posters here having an effect on you????

    … is it all about the money! Have you reverted to WCP again? Are you under pressure? Is Steven S making another movie about you? Tell us the TRUTH!

    BTW … ★★★★ … seems a bit high for you … is it really that good?

  3. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    October 6, 2013 9:00 pm

    Thank you reb, yet again you’ve saved me a few hours that would otherwise be spent in a cinema!

  4. October 6, 2013 9:03 pm

    “is it really that good?”

    Yes! It really is! It grabs you from the very beginning and doesn’t let you go until that last moment. Some genuinely tense moments that have you on the edge of your seat.

    Also, the 3D is wonderful and the special effects are spectacular. I think you’d really enjoy it.

  5. egg permalink
    October 6, 2013 9:04 pm

    ‘Are certain posters here having an effect on you????’

    Nils?

  6. TB Queensland permalink
    October 6, 2013 9:20 pm

    3D???? mmmmm

  7. October 6, 2013 10:06 pm

    Pass , new Woody film with Cate Blue Jasmine is fantastic. 3D? I hate 3D.

  8. TB Queensland permalink
    October 7, 2013 9:46 am

    Woody (Allen????) ????? 😯

  9. October 7, 2013 9:51 am

    I hate Woody Allen…

    He’s a pathetic little individual who plays a pathetic little individual….

    If there’s humour involved, which according to “some people” there is, it’s pretty much lost on me…

  10. TB Queensland permalink
    October 7, 2013 10:01 am

    Absolutely agree, sreb … never liked the man/person and his movies are childish/amateurish to say the least …

  11. October 7, 2013 2:51 pm

    l was going to say l can`t think of anything that appeals to me less than a `space` movie, but Woody Allen has managed to do so.

  12. egg permalink
    October 7, 2013 4:33 pm

    Woody Allen is a cult hero, a creature of the green/left underground. What most punters want is the thrill and excitement of being lost in space, no need for Smellorama on Gravity, its a visual sensation which takes you out of this world.

    I havn’t seen it yet, but as everyone is giving it four stars its a sure bet.

  13. egg permalink
    October 8, 2013 10:28 pm

    Gravity is spectacular and over the next few years i expect a spate of copy cats… 4 stars.

  14. egg permalink
    October 9, 2013 1:42 pm

    I would have given it four and a half, but the Soyuz scene was clumsily handled.

  15. TB Queensland permalink
    October 9, 2013 2:31 pm

    Woody Allen is a cult hero, a creature of the green/left underground

    Wonder if that will stop some contributors here accusing sreb, 007 and me of being “lefties” all the time? 🙄 🙄

  16. October 9, 2013 2:52 pm

    I’m glad Clooney dies. I hope it was painful & drawn out.

  17. October 16, 2013 10:28 am

    Interesting perspective….

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-16/toh-gravity/5024066

  18. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 16, 2013 10:53 am

    Interesting indeed.

  19. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 12:59 pm

    What fkn nonsense …

  20. October 16, 2013 1:15 pm

    “What fkn nonsense”

    Actually it makes a lot of sense…

    Particularly if you have actually seen the movie, but I’m guessing from your response, that you haven’t………?? 🙄

  21. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 3:15 pm

    But she doesn’t really mention the barking dogs and the ghost of a dead man saving her life. The dogs were fine but the ghost was silly.

    The comparison with 2001 is interesting,in that it reflects a new audience in the digital age. Little dialogue,visually beautiful space adventure,its made for a world market

  22. October 16, 2013 3:30 pm

    “The dogs were fine but the ghost was silly.”

    I agree the ghost was silly.

    Where were the barking dogs?

  23. Meta permalink
    October 16, 2013 4:17 pm

    (Ghosted, too?)

  24. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 4:43 pm

    The sound of barking dogs when she was overdosing on CO2 and then the ghost knocked on the door.

  25. October 16, 2013 4:50 pm

    Oh ok.

  26. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 5:06 pm

    … but I’m guessing from your response, that you haven’t………??

    yep, knuckle rap recieved … been a bit busy just lately with some family issues …

    I was referring to all the dog bothering over a film, eg “Gravity” is empty and “2001” is full of religious signs … still if I haven’t seen it I shouldn’t comment …

  27. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 5:25 pm

    “2001″ is full of religious signs …’

    Not really, the extraordinary discovery on the moon lends itself to the theory that we are not alone and humans are intelligently designed.

    The last part of 2001 was a disappointment.

    ————-
    ‘Oh ok.’

    Bollocks was in the Soyuz on a Russian frequency and heard the dogs barking, along with a Russian man happily chatting. This is realistic and that’s where I would have brought in the ghost voice only … no need to change the script.

    This is plausible sf.

  28. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 6:03 pm

    egg, I agree with you re “2001” – I have seen that one a few times now … 😉

  29. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 6:46 pm

    The producers are spinning a yarn and they lean on the metaphysical.

  30. October 16, 2013 6:49 pm

    “Bollocks was in the Soyuz on a Russian frequency and heard the dogs barking, “

    Oh yeah, I remember now… 🙂

  31. October 16, 2013 6:55 pm

    “I was referring to all the dog bothering over a film, eg “Gravity” is empty and “2001″ is full of religious signs …”

    I think that’s the beauty of Gravity. There aren’t any religious “signs”…

    It simply revels in the beauty and majesty of the Earth and the universe, and the complete randomness of events that are beyond our control that could wipe us out in a second.

    If anything, it asks us to appreciate the life that we have, albeit insignificant in the greater scheme of things, and to appreciate how fragile the planet is, and how fleeting life is.

    I enjoyed the way there was no religious bollocks….

    It’s an exercise in existentialism if anything.

  32. October 16, 2013 7:01 pm

    I thought the article I linked to was interesting because she quite nicely captures the existentialist theme that wades through the movie, although I disagree with her concluding statements that a belief in God would somehow add to an ability to “make sense” of some things.

    Clearly that is bullshit.

  33. October 16, 2013 7:11 pm

    The “problem” with To’s article is that she seems to think that life or existence is a problem to be solved, with presumably “a belief in God” being the answer.

    Gravity actually suggests, in my not-so-humble opinion, that the beauty and majesty of the Earth, the cosmos, and the fleeting and fragile nature of life itself, is awe-inspiring enough, without having to introduce some sky-fairy nonsense into the equation…

    Life is a mystery to be lived, not a problem to be solved.

  34. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 7:11 pm

    Well thank you … I thought I had missed soemthing …

    As you should know, I am a sci-fi fan … its on our fkn list, we just can’t seem to get there!

    BTW, watched, The Colony, with lunch …

  35. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 7:29 pm

    And a noice little Aussie, B Grade, WWI film, Forbidden Ground (Battleground on some sites) a couple of days ago … recommend it.

  36. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 7:31 pm

    Whoo, forgot …

    Life is a mystery to be lived, not a problem to be solved.

    Profound … I like that!

  37. October 16, 2013 7:41 pm

    “the beauty and majesty of the Earth, the cosmos, and the fleeting and fragile nature of life itself, is awe-inspiring enough, without having to introduce some sky-fairy nonsense into the equation…

    Life is a mystery to be lived, not a problem to be solved.”

    My sentiments exactly.

    It’s way cool enough, without having to make up shit to substantiate life with some kind of hocus-pocus meaning.

  38. TB Queensland permalink
    October 16, 2013 8:29 pm

    The World and most of its people is such a wonderful place …

    … my one negative thought is that some alien mob will find us and we become the equivalent of all the 15th Century indigenous peoples of the World …

  39. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 9:02 pm

    Imagine some alien mob discovered this jewel a few million years ago, a garden of Eden with bizarre creatures covering every nook and cranny, bursting with life. Only the ape had extraterrestrial potential.

    They wouldn’t be interested in seeing us revert to 15th century technology, with so many mouths to feed humanity would be reduced to savages and risk extinction. A boring script.

    They intend making Avatar 2, 3, 4 which offer greater potential to put bums on seats.

  40. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 9:49 pm

    China is keen to develop their movie credentials, Nicholas Cage and Nicole Kidman were over there recently and picked up gongs. The dictatorship needs to buy Hollywood and produce serious propaganda dressed up as fantasy.

    http://thedissolve.com/news/670-china-is-making-55-propaganda-movies-one-for-each-/

  41. egg permalink
    October 16, 2013 10:18 pm

    ‘Missing link’ gene found that triggered leap in intelligence two million years ago – and allowed early humans to start talking.

    ‘Duplicated gene’ allowed man to talk and transmit knowledge

    ‘Humans share 96% of genome with chimpanzees

    ‘Instant leap in brain evolution let early man leave our ‘cousins’ behind’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2138861/Missing-link-gene-triggered-leap-intelligence-million-years-ago–separated-man-apes.html#ixzz2hsmnxepY
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  42. armchair opinionator permalink
    October 17, 2013 2:13 am

    …that the beauty and majesty of the Earth, the cosmos, and the fleeting and fragile nature of life itself, is awe-inspiring enough, without having to introduce some sky-fairy nonsense into the equation…

    Pretty much what richard dawkins has been saying for decades.

  43. October 17, 2013 9:03 am

    “Pretty much what richard dawkins has been saying for decades.”

    I’m not sure I can relate to Richard Dawkins….

    I think it’s that whole self assured and smugness thing he has going on.

  44. armchair opinionator permalink
    October 17, 2013 9:29 am

    I don’t see him as such reb, I see him in the category of not tolerating fools and impatience with a system of funded mass delusion. Time for humans to grow up and think for themselves, stop looking for supernatural guidance from a supreme being.

  45. October 17, 2013 9:38 am

    Fair enough AO…

  46. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 17, 2013 10:21 am

    And yet until science can explain where the universe comes from people will speculate on the nature of the watchmaker.

    When people stop believing in god, they don’t believe in nothing, they believe anything. These days it is Gaia and the Church of Global Warming. It has its hypocritical huckster High Priests growing fat on the ignorance of true believers, living large, flying around the world in carbon intensive jets while all the while admonishing the faithful to adopt simpler frugal lifestyles. Let us all bow before Saint Suzuki, Fat Albert Gore, Tim Flummery, Bishop Bono and James Cameron. And who can forget that image of Blessed Bob Brown outside his country cottage with its chimney belching CO2 into the atmosphere.

  47. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 10:39 am

    Amen to that.

  48. October 17, 2013 11:13 am

    “And yet until science can explain where the universe comes from people will speculate on the nature of the watchmaker.”

    Oh, that’s just “intelligent design” nonsense – the catchphrase for dog-botherers who are desperately trying to stay relevant in more enlightened times….

  49. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 17, 2013 12:03 pm

    “Oh, that’s just “intelligent design” nonsense”

    It is if you take it too far, for example by asserting that the fact that we can’t explain how the universe was created means that either god exists or that he doesn’t.

    But so far we are only guessing. Either way.

  50. TB Queensland permalink
    October 17, 2013 12:36 pm

    When people stop believing in god, they don’t believe in nothing, they believe anything.

    And that’s a rather trite statement … its not that they believe in “anything” … there are realities to believe in love and nurture … family … good friends … the beauty around us … LIFE and living … here and NOW … not in some nirvana, hell or heaven in the “future”

    Some of us don’t believe in BS that has no real evidence …

    … and I for one have never really trusted a profession that had some of its members betting on whether the atmosphere would ignite when they fired off the first atomic bomb …

    … experiments (including climate forecasts) are just that … seeing if “stuff” works – or not …

    But so far we are only guessing. Either way.

    Generally referred to as agnosticism … welcome …

  51. October 17, 2013 12:54 pm

    “And that’s a rather trite statement … its not that they believe in “anything”

    That’s exactly what I was thinking…

    We don’t believe in “anything,” I personally believe there is no god, but that doesn’t mean I don’t have a “spiritual” outlook on life…

    “I am incapable of conceiving infinity, and yet I do not accept finity”

    ~ Simone de Beauvoir

  52. October 17, 2013 1:11 pm

    “I must interpret the life around me as I interpret the life that is my own. My life is full of meaning to me. The life around me must be full of significance to itself.”

    “If I am to expect others to respect my life, then I must respect the other life I see, however strange it may be to mine.”

    ~ Albert Schweitzer

  53. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 1:17 pm

    ‘Some of us don’t believe in BS that has no real evidence …’

    Like human induced global warming created by models? You cannot be agnostic on a question of science, so unless you recant on AGW I’ll assume its faith which keeps you riveted.

  54. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 17, 2013 3:51 pm

    TB: “And that’s a rather trite statement … its not that they believe in “anything” … there are realities to believe in love and nurture … family … good friends … the beauty around us … LIFE and living … here and NOW … not in some nirvana, hell or heaven in the “future”

    That is what I meant about ‘taking it too far’.

    “Some of us don’t believe in BS that has no real evidence …”

    Exactly my point about global warming!

    Generally referred to as agnosticism … welcome …

    Thank you. Anything beyond that is a leap of faith. Both religious fundamentalists and Bolshie atheists try to take it beyond that. I don’t mind that they do so as a matter of belief, but taking it further in the public square is pointless.

    “I am incapable of conceiving infinity, and yet I do not accept finity. I want this adventure that is the context of my life to go on without end.”

    Sounds like an all to human reaction to the prospect of death. Probably why people have so often throughout history thought about an afterlife.

    We don’t believe in “anything,” I personally believe there is no god, but that doesn’t mean I don’t have a “spiritual” outlook on life

    That comment I made was a bit trite – my point was that there are lot of irrational beliefs out there besides religious ones. As a matter of interest, what does a “spiritual outlook on life” mean?

  55. October 17, 2013 4:05 pm

    “As a matter of interest, what does a “spiritual outlook on life” mean?”

    Happy to oblige, as far as I can in written words anyway…. 🙂

    I guess what I mean is that while I completely reject the notion that there exists some sort of “god like” entity that demands that we believe in it and worship it otherwise we spend eternity in hell, at the same time I have come to accept that there are powerful forces and energies around us…

    That might all seem a bit new-agey, but it is something that I’ve experienced and can’t explain…

    Similarly, I am at a loss to explain how a certain piece of music can move someone to tears and have a profound emotional and psychological effect, or the way in which a spectacular sunset may do the same.

    Some may consider “Karma” to be an an irrational belief, but it’s something I’m more inclined to believe in than the idea that there’s some sky fairy.

  56. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 17, 2013 4:20 pm

    I’m with you on the music, reb. I suspect that music is a more direct path to the emotions as it is unmediated by words.

    No doubt the evolutionary biologists have their theories about why we feel the way we do and where we get the sense of wonder and awe, and why Karma is such an attractive concept.

    There are two quotes that cover much of what I hold dear:

    “Every act of kindness is a little bit of love we leave behind”.

    and

    “Two things stand like stone:
    Kindness in another’s trouble
    And courage in your own”

    They may be trite and soppy, but they cover a lot of ground.

  57. October 17, 2013 6:14 pm

    “When people stop believing in god, they don’t believe in nothing, they believe anything. ”

    What bullshit.

    I’ve never ‘lost’ a belief in god, because I never held one. I am a critical thinker & a cynic. I certainly don’t believe ‘anything’, assuming that by ‘anything’ you mean to infer that I would be easily ‘had’.

    ” Anything beyond that is a leap of faith. Both religious fundamentalists and Bolshie atheists try to take it beyond that. I don’t mind that they do so as a matter of belief, but taking it further in the public square is pointless.”

    Well I’m not a bolshie, but I’m definitely an atheist…& not too coy to say so. While religion is prominent in the public square, even just while it’s politely humoured, there is no reason why it can’t also be disputed in the public square. In fact, it should be disputed in the public square, because some of its mental obstacles seek to influence broader society.

    Dogs, infants & the unindoctrinated are all atheists.

    I totally reject that my assertion that there is no god is faith based. It is based in logic. By extension, all those who believe in their particular god for their particular religion, reject all other gods & (arrogantly imo) assume that only theirs is applicable. I just believe in one less god than them.
    I don’t think it’s necessary to have all of the answers to the origin of life to be able to correctly identify man made religions as the fantasy constructs which they clearly are. Inventing ‘god’ as a way of rationalising what we don’t know just doesn’t hold water. It’s much simpler just to accept that all things are not known & it is entirely likely that there is no overarching grand meaning to our existence anyway.

    The most obvious evidence that religion is humancentric & fabricated is in the dogmas specific to each religion & its adherents.
    The hocus-pocus is not logically defensible, yet each sect & denomination clearly sees itself as the followers of the only ‘true’ god. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence, and no evidence apart from anecdotal exists to support a deity. That’s simply not good enough. The ‘vibe’ is worthless.

    A more defensible position may be for believers to claim that a ‘creator’ is possible, largely because it’s impossible to prove otherwise, no matter how unlikely. But, all religions tend to go well beyond that & claim exclusivity & invent rituals & dogmas which they assert came directly from their god.

    Atheism is the only sensible position, when you put human religion under the microscope.

  58. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 17, 2013 6:20 pm

    Here’s a quiz TBoss. I’ll deal with the other stuff tomorrow.

  59. October 17, 2013 6:22 pm

    Haha, I’ve seen this recently. 🙂

  60. October 17, 2013 6:24 pm

    Not a fan of black metal at all, fwiw. Certainly don’t believe in satan any more than a god.

    Posers, imo.

    Have heard a few tracks I like. But not many.

  61. October 17, 2013 6:31 pm

    I got 100%, so I’m True KVLT, apparently. 😯

    Reminded me that I do love AKERCOCKE & have all of their albums.

    I wouldn’t have really called them black metal though.

  62. October 17, 2013 6:31 pm

    “I don’t think it’s necessary to have all of the answers to the origin of life to be able to correctly identify man made religions as the fantasy constructs which they clearly are..”

    Hear hear!

    With the exception of Buddhism perhaps, which is actually based on logic.

  63. October 17, 2013 6:35 pm

    “No doubt the evolutionary biologists have their theories about why we feel the way we do and where we get the sense of wonder and awe…”

    No doubt.. And like you said earlier, it’s all guesswork.

  64. October 17, 2013 6:47 pm

    I think the evolutionary biologists would have no issue adjusting their theories in the face of other new theories or evidence. That is how science advances & strengthens itself. Noone ever said it was infallible.

    Religion only changes reluctantly to save face as it is dragged against its will into the present. It acquiesces when it no longer has a choice but to do so or dispute widely established observable phenomena of the physical world. It moderates its position as a PR exercise.
    With that in mind, given centuries of claiming to follow the will & word of god, if that were to be believed to be presumably inviolable, how can the religious position be credibly moderated. Isn’t that just further evidence that it’s man moderating it for his own ends?

  65. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 6:56 pm

    In an effort to escape my Catlick past, I admit to being influenced by Buddhism and Taoism.

  66. October 17, 2013 7:10 pm

    What Boss said at 6:47pm

    Standing ovation!

  67. October 17, 2013 7:12 pm

    “In an effort to escape my Catlick past, I admit to being influenced by Buddhism and Taoism.”

    I’m not so much “influenced” by Buddhism, but out of all the so-called “organised religions” I find myself nodding in agreement with the things I’ve read about Buddhism more than any of the others….

  68. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 7:41 pm

    More recently I’ve been fantasising that a contemporary version of the Buddha’s life would make a good film. He’s a responsible manager, with an upper middle class lifestyle… and his wife just had a baby. So he packs his swag and clears out.

    The script writers will have a field day.

    Taoism has a fashionable book called the I Ching and it has a 64 part structure, the same as the genetic code. Coincidence? Probably.

  69. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 8:13 pm

    On the question of dog.

    ‘Taoists recognise a vast pantheon of gods and goddesses, they do not acknowledge any that are omnipotent or eternal. All the gods, including Laozi, are divine emanations of celestial energy.’

  70. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 8:51 pm

    Further west the Egyptians, Greeks and Romans all had a pantheon of gods.

  71. TB Queensland permalink
    October 17, 2013 9:27 pm

    Hey that’s deep shit, man, gimme the mushroom …

  72. egg permalink
    October 17, 2013 10:36 pm

    The Mayans also had a pantheon of gods.

  73. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 18, 2013 10:10 am

    “I’ve never ‘lost’ a belief in god, because I never held one. I am a critical thinker & a cynic. I certainly don’t believe ‘anything’, assuming that by ‘anything’ you mean to infer that I would be easily ‘had’.”

    That was a general observation, not specific to you and not meant to be true in every case, just as generalisations about religion and believers are not true in every case.

    What I meant was that there are a great number of weird and wonderful beliefs that inform peoples’ minds. From astrology to naturopathy to the Global Warming Cult to Critical Theory to feminist claptrap the world is full of irrational beliefs.

    The point is that there is little we can know with certainty – mathematics, and maybe the rules of logic which determine the logical consistency of propositions and conclusions but have little to say about the validity of the underlying premises of arguments. Beyond that there is little to be certain about. I agree with one underlying current of postmodernist thought which acknowledges the limited areas of certainty and then asks “OK then, what do we do now?”

    That is the situation we are all in, whether we know it or not.

    I’m definitely an atheist… I totally reject that my assertion that there is no god is faith based. It is based in logic.”

    What logic is that? You can’t prove there is no god. You can think it unlikely that there is a god but you really can’t prove it. A logical position would be to assert that the null hypothesis is that there is no god and until someone proves that god exists it is irrational to believe in god. That would be a form of agnosticism.

    While religion is prominent in the public square, even just while it’s politely humoured, there is no reason why it can’t also be disputed in the public square. In fact, it should be disputed in the public square, because some of its mental obstacles seek to influence broader society.

    We are mostly agreeing here. When I said: “taking it further in the public square is pointless” I was suggesting that using religion (or atheism) as a basis for social policy is unproductive. It introduces concepts which are likely to be unpersuasive to people who do not hold those irrational beliefs and it is wrong to try to inflict such beliefs on others.

    I don’t think it’s necessary to have all of the answers to the origin of life to be able to correctly identify man made religions as the fantasy constructs which they clearly are.

    Religion has been pervasive in human history. Clearly superstition as an alternative to our inability to know things has been around for a long time. But religion’s role is much greater than this. In particular and especially in early civilisations it is very difficult to keep society together without religions. Early city states did not have the resources which would have been necessary for them to police themselves. It required far fewer resources to achieve social control through religious doctrines.

    Religion also served to explain setbacks like natural disasters and military defeats – don’t panic just buckle down and be more pious.

    Religion also served as a means of handing down wisdom; the lessons learned by earlier generations.

    The reason the Catholic Church is such a long-lived institution is that much of what it has to say, even if that is not original or exclusive to it, is still relevant and valuable.

    Religion also answers a need some people have for meaning in their lives. Rightly or wrongly many people seek or assume a teleological explanation for existence.

    Historically, and in increasing numbers in more recent times, many people are satisfied without resort to a theistic belief system which explains their feelings of awe and wonder and gives meaning to their lives.

    The most obvious evidence that religion is humancentric & fabricated is in the dogmas specific to each religion & its adherents.

    The hocus-pocus is not logically defensible, yet each sect & denomination clearly sees itself as the followers of the only ‘true’ god. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence, and no evidence apart from anecdotal exists to support a deity. That’s simply not good enough. The ‘vibe’ is worthless.”

    The more doctrinally specific religions are the more they differ. They can’t all be right. And more particularly belief in the more specific doctrines is just that – belief.

    Where we disagree is your assertion that such beliefs (the vibe) are worthless.

    During my atheist years I was deeply unhappy and frustrated at the inability of logic to provide answers to moral questions especially the question of what I ought to do in any given situation. In the end I made a choice, subject to some overarching principles – mainly to respect the freedom of others to make their own choices. One point Benedict XVI made in his speech which notoriously angered Muslims was that Islam required blind obedience to Allah, since he was god and humans could not always understand his ways, whereas Christianity required Christians to apply the filter of reason, it being a faculty with which god endowed us.

    Like many others here, I am happy with the choice I made. I am aware of its limitations but it has given my life direction and purpose (and a large number of children).

    Atheism is the only sensible position, when you put human religion under the microscope.”

    Agnosticism is a more sensible position. Atheism is just another leap of faith, albeit in the opposite direction.

  74. October 18, 2013 11:14 am

    “Religion also served as a means of handing down wisdom; the lessons learned by earlier generations.

    You can’t be serious…

    The Catholic Church waged war with Science for generations…

    And still does when it comes to issues around sustainability and climate change…

    Apparently we’re all just meant to believe that “dog will provide,” so you don’t need to worry about pesky things like “an education,” n’ such..

  75. October 18, 2013 11:20 am

    “One point Benedict XVI made in his speech which notoriously angered Muslims was that Islam required blind obedience to Allah, since he was god and humans could not always understand his ways, whereas Christianity required Christians to apply the filter of reason, it being a faculty with which god endowed us.”

    *Cough* *cough* Ahem…

    (picking myself up off the floor)..

    Christianity also insists that their god is the one true god, and any other form of worship is equivalent to worshiping the satan.


    Exodus:

    I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. “You shall have no other gods before Me. “You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth.…

  76. public toilet permalink
    October 18, 2013 11:25 am

    I’d like to reply, but not on this device. Hopefully later this arvo.

    I think atheism is the polar opposite of a leap of faith.

    Generally, I see agnosticism as several things…a bet each way, total disinterest or maybe a sense that it’s taboo & impolite to publicly challenge religious nonsense.
    I am very close to your definition of agnostic, but find it more honest to describe myself as an atheist.

    Thanks for the considered response.

    More later. 🙂

  77. Splatterbottom permalink
    October 18, 2013 11:55 am

    Reb, if you read the Bible literally you end up with a whole mass of contradictions. A better approach is to look at the life of Jesus, and at his parables and teachings. Even then there are contradictions in the Bible as it has come down to us. I think Pope Francis is trying to get Catholics to focus on the big issues – care, compassion and loving your neighbour.

    The Church clearly won its battle with the Club of Rome and Paul Ehrlich in the 70s. Humans didn’t die out due to overpopulation by 1980. Also, Global Warming is a less tenable religion than Christianity. It has little to do with science other than as an example of what happens when science is politicised.

    Anyway, each to his own. I don’t believe that my choice was irrational in the scheme of things. The beliefs I have adopted and the fundamental rules I follow seem decent enough to me. But that was my choice, and everybody else should make their own choice. There is no other way to deal with life than to think hard and make the best decision you can. Anything else is dishonest

  78. egg permalink
    October 18, 2013 11:59 am

    Monotheism has given religion a bad name, I have no problem with lots of dogs. I wouldn’t go so far as to call it a Jewish plot, more a devilish off the cuff idea with disastrous results.

    I pose the question that an alien mob may have tinkered with apes to bring them up to scratch and become space travellers.

    I have no evidence to support this theory.

  79. egg permalink
    October 18, 2013 12:02 pm

    But if I’m correct, our deity is out there.

  80. October 18, 2013 5:12 pm

    Just like religion in general, el gordo, that is ‘possible’. And by ‘possible’ I mean, impossible to rule out, no matter how ridiculously improbable it is…& I’m actually inclined to lean further towards that than any of the fantasy junk espoused by ‘conventional’ traditional religions…but that’s also probably what my friend splatter means when he says ‘people will believe anything’. 😉

  81. egg permalink
    October 18, 2013 7:51 pm

    ‘no matter how ridiculously improbable’

    Best keep an open mind, our bias give impetus in a specific direction which helps us build up a belief system. There is comfort and security in groupthink, part of our survival mechanism.

    Traditional religions are generally crap because they become bureaucratic structures long after the original event, in the case of Taoism and Christianity it was a couple of hundred years.

    That’s when they seriously begin making shit up, to suit their purpose.

  82. egg permalink
    October 18, 2013 9:52 pm

    The Taoist see their gods as ‘celestial energy’ and here’s an example spotted over Hong Kong a week ago, close to the heart of the celestial kingdom. Apologies to the blogmasta for straying off the track.

    I always read the comments to see if its a fake, there are a lot out there. Its also worth keeping mind that awe and wonder are important emotions required for religious belief.

    By coincidence I took a pic of a UFO a few years ago and its identical to the one over Honkers.

  83. October 18, 2013 10:08 pm

    Good thread everybody. 🙂
    Those that follow the teachings tail of dog, always overlook the most important thing that separates `followers` from atheists, and that is `they` don`t believe in the dozens of egyptian dogs, greek dogs, roman dogs, incan dogs and viking dogs. Dawkins said it best l reckon, that atheists have just gone `one-dog-more` 😆

  84. October 18, 2013 10:41 pm

    Big-Fuel and Nasa are delusionals of the startrek variety,
    believing that the planet can be endlessly polluted, and once it`s ability to support life with clean air and clean water is destroyed, the elite of mankind will be able to jump in their `spaceship` and go live on a brand-new planet.
    .
    My bet is they are wrong.
    .
    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘Scientists have discovered that our solar system is very unique. Earth is located in a star system that is by no means the norm in space. As a matter of fact, our solar system appears to be the exception. A stunning exception, in the way it’s laid out to actually foster the very conditions on Earth which makes life possible. In the universe at large, chaos, explosions, and mind-bending collisions between massive celestial bodies appear to be commonplace. After you watch this video, you may never see our little blue planet quite the same again.’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘
    http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2013/07/31/how-the-universe-works-clockwork-and-creation/

  85. egg permalink
    October 19, 2013 9:02 am

    ‘A pair of ‘flying saucers’ were inadvertently captured on camera while a holidaymaker was taking pictures at a seaside resort.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2465882/Photographer-captures-pair-flying-saucers-taking-pictures-West-Country-seaside-resort.html#ixzz2i76IUMZ3
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  86. TB Queensland permalink
    October 19, 2013 10:12 am

    Generally, I see agnosticism as several things…a bet each way, total disinterest or maybe a sense that it’s taboo & impolite to publicly challenge religious nonsense.

    Maybe its because we just don’t know? Toillette …

    And I’m sure you know I don’t consider any subject “taboo” particularly organised religion …

    There’s a couple of issues with, sb’s, “rational” but that falls into the “disinterest” category … and he finds some areas taboo …

    BTW, I rarely bet and then “socially” ie Keno while at a club with friends (two numbers per game $1 a game 10 games – I never lose) or Melbourne Cup $20 and maybe a sweep.

  87. October 19, 2013 10:51 am

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘A CATHOLIC brother has fronted a Brisbane court charged with sex offences committed at BoysTown – a former home for wayward boys – almost 30-years ago.

    The 58-year-old man yesterday appeared in the Brisbane Magistrates Court on 11 charges alllegedly committed between September 30, 1984, and December 1, 1986,

    The brother, who cannot be named until he is committed for trial, was not required to enter pleas to nine counts of indecent treatment of boys under 14 and one each of assault causing bodily harm and carnal knowledge against the laws of nature.’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘
    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/catholic-brother-in-court-on-child-sex-charges-from-boystown-30-years-ago/story-fnii5v70-1226742487302
    .
    .
    Here comes the usual `defending` of dogs representatives on earth
    from teabag`osy and oh 🙄 snacky

  88. egg permalink
    October 19, 2013 2:50 pm

    ‘no matter how ridiculously improbable’

    The point I’m trying to make is that its possible to visualise the early stages of a spiritual movement, before it adopts bureaucratic license and becomes a religion.

  89. egg permalink
    October 19, 2013 4:23 pm

    chuckle

    ‘And as my wife put it, when you have a hold of George Clooney, only an idiot would let him go.’

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