‘Just deal with it, Indonesia’ isn’t real foreign policy
The following piece is by Simon Copland and originally appeared at SBS…
Australia’s refusal to adequately engage with its nearest neighbour over the phone tapping scandal is a new expression of neocolonialism, writes Simon Copland.
The fallout from the Indonesian phone tapping controversy has hit a new level after Susilo Bamban Yudhoyono announced that Indonesia would suspend all co-operation on defence and people smuggling with Australia.
At the surface it could potentially seem like an overreaction. But when you look at the way the federal government has treated recent standoffs, it makes absolute sense.
In essence the government is acting in many ways just as Foreign Minister Julie Bishop said they would when she commented on asylum seeker policy:
“We’re not asking for Indonesia’s permission, we’re asking for their understanding.”
But it has gone further than that. The Coalition has been indignant that Indonesia hasn’t ceded to its demands on asylum seeker policy and on phone tapping its response has basically been ‘sorry we got caught’.
We’ve gone well past permission, and it seems like we don’t even care about understanding anymore.
We’ll do what we want and then get frustrated when Indonesia says no.
Indonesian President Susilo Bamban Yudhoyono said that this response was ‘belittling’ to his country, but I would go one step further. It is a new expression of neocolonialism.
Ever since Indonesia gained its independence, it has been the victim of ongoing neocolonialism. The Western World has interfered in Indonesia economically, politically and even culturally, all for its own good.
The approach from the Australian government sounds worryingly similar.
It reeks of interference, with an attitude that says ‘we know what is best’ and ‘you should just deal with it’. You can even see this in Indonesian commuters’ responses to the scandal – a feeling of being interfered with by a stronger neighbour.
It is not an approach that treats Indonesia as an equal, but rather as a place we can treat however we like.
It makes you understand why Indonesia is so angry.
They are rightly concerned that Australia is interfering politically, an approach which is not just insulting, but fundamentally immoral.
But if the immorality of the policy isn’t bad enough, the fact that the government thinks it can get away with it is potentially even worse.
With each step Indonesia has shown that it is unwilling to cop it from the Australia any more. Part of this is probably because we’ve crossed a line. But potentially more importantly, it is because the dynamics have changed from a time when this policy ‘worked’.
Indonesia is now stronger than in the past, and on the issues of phone-tapping and asylum seekers it is in many ways able to hold the moral high ground.
The fact that our government has been unable to recognise this – that it has tried to continue on the path of telling the Indonesian government to ‘just deal with it’ and expect that it will just work – shows a serious lack of understanding. A level of incompetency in foreign affairs that should make us all worried.
The Coalition has quickly made its mark early in the foreign policy arena. Unfortunately, it is an odd mixture of incompetence and neocolonialism.
Individually the two elements are bad enough, but put them together and they are the worst form of foreign policy we could possible ask for.
theguttertrash.com 
“Labor trying to play politics on foreign policy” says Christopher Pyne.
ROFLMAO!
http://news.theage.com.au/breaking-news-national/protests-in-indon-as-spy-row-heats-up-20131121-2xwnh.html
“Labor trying to play politics on foreign policy”
And Labor want to play ‘Team Australia’ with this lot? When will they learn?
From your link reb
Protesters in the Indonesian city of Yogyakarta are burning Australian flags as anger ramps up over the presidential phone tapping scandal.
it all sounded so easy back then
http://inagist.com/all/402697310594801664/
“it all sounded so easy back then”
Indeed, P-Plate Tony and the Minister for Vanity Fair have managed to completely destroy one of our most important international relationships in a matter of days…
Well done Tony!
Ah Reb don’t worry, i’d recon Pyne would bypass the obligatory diplomatic ass kissing and go strait for the rimming if he could manage to get that closet off his back. Unfortunately for us L stands for Lunatic which is another undisclosed truth the Liealition with the diplomacy of a bull in a fine china shop
in a matter of days…
Actually, I don’t think it is just his (lack of) response to this issue that destroyed it, it is just hte catalyst.
The Indonesians were never happy about the dog whistling the libs practiced in opposition, and even less impressed with the total disregard for their stance since the election. It was clear that Abbott’s visit there recently was not the ‘success’ it was trumpeted here as. In fact, I got the distinct impression (from their newspapers) that they were mightily upset with Tony trying to tell one story in one place, and a different one elsewhere.
It is like the Liberals have forgotten that “International” is a lot closer than it used to be in 1950
And it is all coming home to roost, to all our detriment.
I agree Jagged..elections do very funny things to people, they may actually say anything or do anything to get that top job 🙄
They organised a rent a crowd in Djakarta, that’s timely.
The reality, it has nothing to do with tones and everything to do with Xi, the spy thingy is a timely catalyst to make the break easier.
Do not be afrayd.
it has nothing to do with tones
Actually, it has everything to do with both his response, and his previous behaviour.
His response has been woeful, as Shorten tried to point out for him.
The anguished cries form the usual suspects insisting that Tony Abbott should “apologise” are about as sensible as they are sincere. Clearly its not really about our relationship with Indonesia as much as its about seeking vindication for their claims that Tony Abbott is not up to the top job of being our PM. Once again the current government is being saddled with a mess created on Labor’s watch and the chutzpah of leftist minions chiding Tony Abbott for sticking to the long standing convention about neither confirming or denying anything about intelligence gathering is breathtaking in its opportunistic hypocrisy. Frankly if minions of the left are so keen on an apology to Indonesia then they should be seeking one from Kevin Rudd and or the relevant former ministers from the class of 2009 when the phone tapping is alleged to have occurred.
As Alexander Downer suggests Tony Abbott should stick to his current position and never “apologise” especially as I am rather inclined to think that Indonesia is more than likely to be attempting to do precisely what it complains about to us. Its much ado about nothing and as much as it may hurt or beef producers were Indonesia to get up on an even higher horse the reality is that they need and want the “aid” we give them so we have no reason at all to bend the knee to their jumped up and arrogant political class.
Cheers Comrades
Despite all the lefty outrage, Abbott is doing the right thing not confirming-or-denying – or apologising for – any alleged spying (on Rudd’s watch).
As a matter of interest only, and the current kerfuffle won’t affect this, Australia’s Aid to Indonesia: Budget estimate for 2013/14: $646.8 million.
“His response has been woeful, as Shorten tried to point out for him.”
Shorten wont be doing anymore “friendly advice”.
It sems he forgot who is in charge now.
What a fucking idiot he is for publicly suggesting solutions on foreign policy during a crisis created under the ALPs own watch. Lets not forget it was they that let it be known to the Yanks we were spying on the Indos.
To suggest an apology has merely galvanised some Indos into demanding it and binding all furure governments into the same act everytime something embarrassing like this happens.
What a prized dickhead he is………
Abbott is doing the right thing not confirming-or-denying – or apologising for
The POTUS was able to apologise without actually admitting anything concrete from my understanding. It is all that is being asked.
Abbott is inflaming an already unsteady relationship with his current remarks
How is ‘restoring’ that relationship with Indonesia going like was promised in the pamphlet?
Indonesia has a very macho culture so does anyone really believe that they will respect us if we apologise?
My expectation would be for them to move the goal posts were that apology to be given
“The POTUS was able to apologise without actually admitting anything concrete from my understanding. It is all that is being asked.”
You can’t apologise without conceding there’s something to apologise for. Abbott has already expressed his regret that Yudhoyono has been embarassed.
*embarrassed
You can’t apologise without conceding there’s something to apologise for.
It’s called diplomacy.
“Indonesia has a very macho culture…”
LOL…
You really are such a worldly individual…
Have you ever actually met an Islamadonesian?
Abbott has already expressed his regret that Yudhoyono has been embarassed.
Alan Jones must have been teaching Tony Abbott how to apologise
You can’t apologise without conceding there’s something to apologise for.
er, there IS something to apologise for … 🙄 Talk about denial …
A Special News Ltd Bulletin for those tories who obviously wouldn’t have a clue about diplomacy (macho culture … WTF is that!) and think it will just blow over …
http://www.news.com.au/business/markets/why-australia-shouldnt-mess-with-indonesia/story-e6frfm30-1226765116840
Talk about being the best government to run the economy? 🙄
Lets trash Australia’s trade with Indonesia is worth more than $14 billion in a couple of days … $14 billion a year over four year =? + loss of future potential business …
Sure, governments spy on each other … this time Australia has been caught out … Abbott is the PM … he should apologise …
In the real world of business if a company is taken over they sort this crap out quickly and get on with it …
Despite all the lefty outrage, Abbott is doing the right thing not confirming-or-denying – or apologising for – any alleged spying (on Rudd’s watch).
As a matter of interest only, and the current kerfuffle won’t affect this, Australia’s Aid to Indonesia: Budget estimate for 2013/14: $646.8 million.
1. I watched Dolly Downer on Lateline too ToSY 🙂 🙄
2. Read my commet above …
er, there IS something to apologise for
I don’t disagree with that, and I think that they should just apologise, completely. But, if they want to play this crap that ‘we don’t talk about fight club’, it is possible to apologise without actually admitting to a specific charge.
I don’t believe that Obama did when he apologised, he implied, but didn’t admit.
We should just admit it, because, well, the evidence is hard to refute
“Abbott has already expressed his regret that Yudhoyono has been embarassed.”
It’s hilarious isn’t it?
The Australian govt gets caught red-handed spying on Indonesia, and somehow Indonesia, not Australia, are embarrassed by this….???
That’s Liberal Party logic for you..
“I don’t believe that Obama did when he apologised, he implied, but didn’t admit.”
Obama told Merkel “we aren’t spying on you (now) and we won’t in the future”. Why would you make that promise to Indonesia, who hasn’t always been our Best Friend Forever, and may not be again at some future time? Appeasement combined with naivety. Nice.
…I’vebeen a litle busy lately, and I’m sure the suggestion has been made…perhaps just get Shorten, Rudd, Carr, Gillard etc to apologise
Otherwise just blame Swan.
Nice.
And without admitting anything 😉
who hasn’t always been our Best Friend Forever, and may not be again at some future time?
Unlike Germany, who have always been Americas BFF 😯
perhaps just get Shorten, Rudd, Carr, Gillard etc to apologise
Well, get something happening
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2013/11/21/ri-halts-cooperation-with-oz-mulls-more.html
Inane obviously doe not watch Parliament. Who cares what Downer and Carr say..they are both irrelevant and on the outside. Why dont the drum trot out Reith he seems to have an opinion on everything or is he too busy selling the virtues of the prosperity of CSG and labeling anyone against it a commo including the CWA 🙄 meanwhile where’s Julian?
‘Actually, it has everything to do with both his response, and his previous behaviour.’
Good, then it has nothing to do with Xi offering the Indos a bag full of money and ‘ono cutting off military ties with Oz.
“Abbott has already expressed his regret that Yudhoyono has been embarassed.”
SBY should feel embarrassed that his own security people are so fucking corrupt they dont bother doing their job properly making sure that their President is not bugged.
After all he appointed them.
And to compare Germany to Indonesia is just downright stupid.
Modern day Germany does not foster/allow swarms of Jihadists to construct bombs and blow up innocent tourists.
Modern day Germany does not allow its military to cover up the deaths/murders of foreign journalists.
Modern day Germany does not conduct terror campaigns by its military against its non Islamic citizens
Modern day Germany does not allow religious fanatics the freedom to burn down churches of other faiths.
Do I need to continue or is that not clear enough for some of you ?
lol Walrus
Of course, it is their fault we successfully bugged them, and then didn’t take our advice when we told them to HTFU!
I just hope SBY does not have an LG television. Otherwise South Korea will cop it next.
http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/security-it/lg-australia-investigates-smart-tv-spy-claims-20131121-hv3nx.html
Why Don’t we just flat out ask them if they are spying on Us? Or why the Aussie Feds and ASIO had to point out that they had 2 huge Meth and Drug factories set up in northern INDO? Flooding the Aussie market with cheap meth? Fact is our intel knows more about what is actually going on there than they know themselves and it is a ridiculously corrupt country. I love this righteous act, its about as credible as Shapel and Datsun Corby’s story or as believable that Christpher Pyne has never sucked a dick. 🙄
Bill Shorten replies today to the PM:
“Our position continues to be one of support for the government … Now is the time for temperate language.”
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/the-pulse-live/politics-live-november-21-2013-20131121-2xwo6.html#ixzz2lFo7yHWF
What……………………..no mention of apologising now ?
This just in: Yudhoyono’s letter to Tony Abbott:
“Fact is our intel knows more about what is actually going on there than they know themselves and it is a ridiculously corrupt country”
Corruption is everywhere. We can see that at ICAC NSW.
But South East Asia is frankly unbelievable.
I’d put Vietnam, Cambodia and Indonesia on around the same level.
“Yudhoyono’s letter to Tony Abbott”
😆
Look Problem solved send Shirley Temple over there in his stockings and high heels to serenade some diplomacy
Let the flag burning begin!
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/spying-scandal-australian-flags-burnt-as-protests-heat-up-in-indonesia-20131121-2xx9k.html
Indonesians calling for WAR!!
http://www.skynews.com.au/topstories/article.aspx?id=926717&vId=
Bring it on brown people!!!
You would think that if you wanted to make some sort of symbolic gesture out of burning the Australian flag, you might be better served throwing petrol on one of those big canvas flags that fly outside embassies rather than a couple of little paper ones that look like they’re from the $2 shop.
Memo to Indonesia:
Flag burning. You’re not doing it right.
Why would you make that promise to Indonesia, who hasn’t always been our Best Friend Forever, and may not be again at some future time?
Wouldn’t that apply to Germany too … come to think of it, any country in the world … paranoid anyone?
What a bunch of Churchills the tories are … he made so many fkn stupid decisions based on 17th Century gunboat diplomacy its a wonder he wasn’t assassinated …
Here’s me expecting to be transported back to the 1950’s and obviously the Liberal Party Time Machine fkd up — we went an extra 100 years … FMD! 🙄
Next we’ll have Abbott’s version of the Inquisition! Was that a knock at my door?
Bring it on brown people!!!
Racism? 😯
(‘More Djakarta than Geneva’, or New York or Warsaw, seems to be going well.)
Great letter IPA, had me chuckling.
‘What……………………..no mention of apologising now ?’
A win for you, sire.
“Racism ?”
Nah TB just role-playing,.. 😉
“Indonesians calling for WAR!!”
They can start off by taking Christmas Island if they like. We should let them have it. Our “people smuggling” troubles would be over. Instead of a 500km voyage to Christmas Is, they’d have to risk a 2,750 km trip to Darwin. As for the Indos coming over here, not gonna happen. Too hard, too far, too exposed, too big of a country. We need a proxy war. Maybe a bitch fight between Christopher Pyne and Marty Natalegawa. Or Bronny Bishop and Mrs Yudhoyono.
If we give them Christmas Island the first thing those little brown muslim hordes will do is change it to Ramadan Island.
Bloody Muslims
If China buys Indonesia and Sri Lanka, forming a military sphere under China’s umbrella, we’ll be isolated.
The Chinese Dream
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/China-Military-Watch/2013-11/21/content_17119775.htm
The Chinese Dream
A bit more than a dream, methinks ….
And could be your nightmare, egg … and a few more around here … 😆
Bloody Muslims
Insightful, sreb … 😉
“We need a proxy war. Maybe a bitch fight between Christopher Pyne and Marty Natalegawa. Or Bronny Bishop and Mrs Yudhoyono.”
Nah…..you dont take a pea shooter to a gunfight…………………bring out the big guns I say
Amanda Vanstone Versus Mrs SBY………………….in a G-String mud wrestle
LOL……………………….now try and get that out ya minds all thru tonight suckers………………!
Thanks for that Walrus. 😯 🙄
Go England!
Yay for burning the ockertard tablecloth too!
TB the strategic situation for the Chinese is to let the US know they are an equal match, militarily, and that they fully intend expanding their interests throughout the whole region.
All aboard the gravy train.
l hope they shook free the bogans before igniting said table-cloths.
😆
“Amanda Vanstone Versus Mrs SBY………………….in a G-String mud wrestle”
Fifi owns the intellectual property for that form of diplomacy.
What……………………..no mention of apologising now ?
No, you were definitely right in that respect Walrus, the opposition have gone very quiet on it all.
Personally, I’d like them to draw a distinctive line, but, it appears they are just going to let Abbott continue to hang himself. They are playing the ‘partisan’ line at the moment but, when/if it goes even further south, Shorten has himself on Hansard twice pleading with Abbott to follow the example of the US and Germany, who were able to mend their rifts. And, while offering full ‘support’ for the Government, hasn’t actually agreed with his belligerent manner, just encouraging them to work on the relationship.
It’s probably best for them to keep their heads low. The News Ltd writers seem to be looking hard for a scapegoat, everywhere but with the belligerent one. Failing that, ignorance is their default position. It just isn’t happening. And, while they continue that, Abbott will continue his “short shrift” approach, oblivious to the long term damage it fosters.
http://www.theglobalmail.org/feature/talk-to-the-hand-the-australian-government-to-everyone/746/
Apparently Gillard has suggested that Abbott apologise to SBY. Perhaps the starting point for her is her own apology for being part of the government that approved this spying in the first place.
What a pathetic hypocrite Gillard is.
Fifi owns the intellectual property for that form of diplomacy.
Emphasis on the “dip” I s’ppose? Chocolate, perhaps? 😯
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I hope it has been noted here that those oft accused of being Marxists are actually disagreeing with the Opposition in the matter of a swift (now gone) apology and move on …
A bipartisan approach to a Team Australia would have only stirred the port more in “Macho”* Indonesia … but I guess guity is as guilty does …
*inane alert
What a pathetic hypocrite Gillard is.
Perhaps it should be a delegation of the four muskateers, ToM … Howard, Rudd, Gillard and Abbott … they all must have known and approved it at some time …
What a stench with all of them in the same room …
Pathetic bunch if you ask me …
Wonder whether Keating is giggling or crying?
Is any one actually running the country? Or just writing the next
political blunder comedy script?they all must have known and approved it at some time …
Exactly. Neither parties hands are clean in this. As the oversees media are reporting, it is not just the one instance, it is from a far back as when Howard was in charge, and Tony Abbott was in the Ministry. Playing the partisan game is a lost cause from here on out.
It is just a fact, for good or for bad, that spying goes on. Under all Governments.
The issue is how to handle it when it blows up, like this has. Whether you agree with Snowden releasing the details or not (I personally don’t, but I agree with the reporting of it, because, it was going to come out anyway once released), the facts are we have to deal with what is.
The Gillard Government handled the Live Cattle issue with the livestock’s best interests at the forefront, and we still had a strengthening relationship with Indonesia throughout, no matter how much it was declared otherwise. That can be attributed to the former Government, who took the necessary steps to ensure proper Governance of live trade, and dealt with their Indonesian counterparts appropriately, as evidenced by the strength of our relationship, even in the face off all the detrimental talk the then opposition were doing.
The Abbott Government should perhaps look and learn from the Gillard one, no matter how much pride they have to swallow. Indonesia is important to Australia as a trading partner, and may well become critical in the future as they grow with the Asian region.
Apparently Gillard has suggested that Abbott apologise to SBY.
Probably why Shorten is being so circumspect. International media tend to report things more accurately
Former prime minister Julia Gillard has suggested Tony Abbott follow the example of US president Barack Obama and provide Indonesia with an explanation of spying allegations. But she stopped short of saying the prime minister should apologise for the actions of Australia’s electronic spy agency in 2009.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/22/tony-abbott-barack-obama-spying-allegations-julia-gillard?CMP=soc_568
Approved the Spying in the first place..A certain Australian called Julian Assange..remember that elephant in the room reminded us of the Utter and complete Hypocrisy of Politicians exercising the political process…. And where do we arrive? a poli tit being outraged and trying to ply some political capital out of something they are neck deep in themselves…. its a cyclic never ending predictable story… sun comes up..faux outrage sun goes down please.. like Alexander Downers opinion on anything, its a tiresome bore 🙄
An apology has to be sincere. This act was intentional and Gillard was part of the government that did it, what’s the point of an apology? It is just more of the usual crap from Our former PM.
Fuck Tom seriously? How do you know a poli tit is lying?
Wake up Mate…. its a cyclic never ending, predictably formulated story manufactured to a boring age old barely digestible recipe. Just another rerun on the shopping channel of irrelevance.
The whole Indo thing Is Yawnfest 2013, Lieapoloser, Festival of the fallibly faux
Jullian, castigated like Snowden as a traitor because we all got a glimpse into the ass end of what goes on running the nation is not all above board…Shock horror..poli tits are idiotic…well der..Tony Abbott personifies The arcle type idiot and 53% of our apparently clever country installed a mandate to idiocy by installing a proven incompetent twat as PM. Again history repeats see John Howard the world worst treasurer.
So where do we arrive?
A power hungry poli tit projecting faux outrage to ply some political capital out of something they are neck deep in themselves. Another ploy to win an election with the wild dog press feeding on the carcass bones of political will with no meat of truth, choking on putrid chunks of reality. Sound familiar?
Sun comes up..faux outrage..blah blah ..insert culprit..sun goes down..repeat infinitum, do not learn lesson…start again next year buy again blah de blah.
Not often I quote Leon Trotsky…
You may not be interested in strategy, but strategy is interested in you.
I’m not too bothered either way Ricky. I just find it highly amusing that some non blame Abbott for stuffing up the Indonesian relationship (eg Adrian of Nowra), meanwhile the hypocrite Gillard thinks Abbott should apologise for the actions of her government
I agree ,the safe zone is to call all of them bullshit artists.
“some nongs”
I think the Litmus test of Narcissistic Hypocrisy is someone actually wanting to be in politics. Tom they are all bullshit artists with small consciences, Rieth became a lobbyist for CSG FFS…says it all
… no matter how much pride they have to swallow
Well and truly nailed the real issue, JJ!
An apology is just playing the game …
“Peace in our time” … yeah, right …
‘Indonesia is important to Australia as a trading partner, and may well become critical in the future as they grow with the Asian region.’
Our agricultural exports are safe, all we have lost is military cooperation and joint ventures of that nature. The real slap in the face for Abbott is that he cannot stop the Chinese Dream becoming reality.
The monk will get a sharp talking to from a Pontus minion, for giving up ground to the celestial kingdom.
An apology has to be sincere.
I’m sorry, why?
This act was intentional and Gillard was part of the government that did it,
It was also part of the previous Government Tony Abbott was a Minister in. Both Governments were spying on the Indonesians, which appears to have begun under Howard. If you want to play partisan blame like that Tom, you need to acknowledge that all Labor were doing was continuing the Howard policy, a few months into their tenure.
And, if Labor haven’t stopped it during their tenure, then there is nothing to say it is not still going on Under Abbotts tenure. Which might be why he is so belligerent.
what’s the point of an apology?
It indicates that, outwardly at least, the country is accepting that something has gone wrong with the relationship and, in order to heal that relationship, the first step must be taken. You also appear to have missed the piece I put up that stated that Gillard is not looking for an apology, which makes your outrage about ‘hypocrisy’ a little hypocritical to me. I, however, would prefer the apology route.
What is the point of no apology?
Our agricultural exports are safe, all we have lost is military cooperation and joint ventures of that nature.
And put at risk a further $14.6 billion. Yea, nothing to worry about 😉
But, live cattle, end of world
http://www.smh.com.au/business/australias-spying-program-could-damage-trade-ties-with-indonesia-20131119-2xtaz.html
That story is a beat up and badly nobbled together.
As I said, bilateral trade will continue in their interests and ours, China’s intention is to lift Indonesia out of their financial malaise and become a true friend.
That story is a beat up and badly nobbled together.
So we don’t currently have $14.6 billion in trade with Indonesia?
THe Chinese Dream encompasses state of the art military technology and a small standing army.
http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/opinion/2013-10/08/content_17012911.htm
‘So we don’t currently have $14.6 billion in trade with Indonesia?’
Yes, but its not in any danger over this spy saga.
Yeah i’m sorry you’re sorry… the cows are sorry Shapelles sorry the Balibo 5 are sorry, Th Bali bomber is sorry , the Bali 9 are sorry, the boats are sorry, god is sorry Allah is sorry, Buddha is sorry the whole archipelago is sorry, The baggage handlers are sorry…
Even Elton is sorry
Yes, but its not in any danger over this spy saga.
Sounds similar to the ‘we’ll fix the broken relationship’ mantra
That turned out to be both incorrect in its initial assumption, and catastrophic in its current implementation
The rank hypocrisy of Gillard is her wanting Abbott to apologise for the actions of an ALP government in 2009.
If the hypocrite thinks an apology is appropriate she can start with – ‘I deeply regret the actions that the previous government authorised, tapping the personal telephones of the President, his family and his ministers. An ALP government should never repeat this action’
Until Gillard makes this type of statement, she can STFU, her gratuitous, hypocritical and incompetent advice is unnecessary and hardly helpful in limiting the damage in the relationship.
Our trade is healthy and will continue in the interests of both our countries, with a free market the determinant.
The rank hypocrisy of Gillard is her wanting Abbott to apologise for the actions of an ALP government in 2009.
Tom, in case you missed it. I think you must have. I did post it further back up this thread, and then referred to it AGAIN further down
But she stopped short of saying the prime minister should apologise for the actions of Australia’s electronic spy agency in 2009.
You sound a bit desperate constantly claiming Gillard is a hypocrite for something she did not say. Is there a reason for that?
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/22/tony-abbott-barack-obama-spying-allegations-julia-gillard?CMP=soc_568
Our trade is healthy
Well, it was at the election anyway
and will continue
If Abbott can fix the mess he created. If not?
Nothing to fix, a rift over spying won’t effect trade relations.
Gillard wants an Obama style ‘apology’
The incompetent hypocrite can F**K OFF…until she accepts responsibility for the original decision.
I think I’m going to start calling you Ostrich egg.
Nothing to fix, a rift over spying won’t effect trade relations.
Of course not 😉
Indonesia says it is considering halting its ongoing talks on a bilateral economic pact with Australia as tensions escalate between the two governments following reports of the continent spying on the archipelago.
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2013/11/21/ri-oz-trade-danger-over-spying.html
Gillard wants an Obama style ‘apology’
Can you show the quote where she said that?
That’s funny, but any casual observer might think otherwise.
l agree Ricky,
primate culture hasn`t change in the `core` of it, so it is repeated reasonably regularly, and there will only be superficial variations to the usual pantomime. Teh-Left/Right will screech that its all the others fault, lndo will `threaten` some `trade` or military stuff, Teh-Left/Right will screech some more, but will eventually submit to the all-fours position.
#glorifiedprimates
She didn’t actually say she wants “an apology”
*Just sayin’
I’m having some leisure, and I’m not posting links. Gillard simply needs to receed into oblivion.
but any casual observer might think otherwise.
If enough voices keep repeating what wasn’t actually said, it is highly likely
and I’m not posting links
No, there are other words to describe what you are currently posting Tom 😉
THe Chinese Dream encompasses state of the art military technology and a small standing army. What fkn waffle … the Chinese have one of the largest standing armies in the world … do you know what a standing army even IS?
The rank hypocrisy of Gillard is her wanting Abbott to apologise for the actions of an ALP government in 2009. Abbott is the PM – take the job coip the shite … do you really believe he didn’t know? Nieve or wot!
Our trade is healthy and will continue in the interests of both our countries, with a free market the determinant. Well thanks for the reassurance, egg, 🙄
Nothing to fix, a rift over spying won’t effect trade relations. And you know … because?
The incompetent hypocrite can F**K OFF…until she accepts responsibility for the original decision.
ToM your doing a CW mirror … those in glass houses? Gillard is now a (well paid) citizen …
I think I’m going to start calling you Ostrich egg.
LOL! @ sreb! A fkn big one too!
That’s funny, but any casual observer might think otherwise.
egg, did you know we won WWI … and WWII 🙄
Teh-Left/Right will screech that its all the others fault, lndo will `threaten` some `trade` or military stuff, Teh-Left/Right will screech some more, but will eventually submit to the all-fours position.
While the rest of us watch on in horror!
The Robber Barons have really come home to roost … Noddy Newman has disbanded a committe of enquiry into the CMC chief ’cause they found he was guilty … 😯
I can see that cnt JBP fkn giggling in his grave … it needs napalming! Along with its spawn!
Thought I ‘d get the last in before Noddy cums knocking at the door with new laws against freedonm of speech …
We are seeing it now … Australia may not wake up until its too late … medieval amateurs …
Astounding!
‘If enough voices keep repeating what wasn’t actually said, it is highly likely’
So you are saying, what exactly?
‘LOL! @ sreb! A fkn big one too!’
Yeah, too amusing, but the majority here have their heads buried on a particular issue which colours my perspective.
So you are saying, what exactly?
That you’re a fkn moron if I had to hazard a guess… 😯
I was talkin’ to JJ.
You mean you’re trying to convert us to the True Liberal Way … (with references to the catlik church) …
Won’t work, Os, won’t work … been tried for over half a century … I don’t care if you are an ALP catlik or a LNP catlik but the goal is always the same … money, money, money …
Although at the moment Abboott (heheh) is fkn everything up and Snotty Noddy is close behind! I hear Victoria is having problems with a recalcitrant ex-Liberal too … 😆
I was talkin’ to JJ.
Perhaps. but reb beat me to it.
“Although at the moment Abboott (heheh) is fkn everything up”
Is he?? Sounds like you want him to fail and for Australia to get into trouble because your ALP luvvies are not in power.
If Gillard/Rudd had won the election would things be any different??
At the moment it is a mess created by the ALP (in 2009) which as usual the Coalition has to clean up.
If Gillard/Rudd had won the election would things be any different??
Well, under Gillard, we had a burgeoning relationship, even with the live cattle freeze and a loud-mouth opposition. She proved she could negotiate.
At the moment it is a mess created by the ALP (in 2009)
See above
https://theguttertrash.com/2013/11/21/just-deal-with-it-indonesia-isnt-real-foreign-policy/#comment-38083
‘Perhaps. but reb beat me to it.’
Yeah, the editor has a scathing wit.
“She proved she could negotiate.”
What comedy club do you belong??
heads-up TB, #noddy
.
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘so it begins, the harassment against ordinary every day citizens for merely showing that they disagree with the State Liberal Government of Queensland.’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘
‘
http://awombatsweb.wordpress.com/2013/11/17/queensland-police-threaten-political-dissenters/
So The Hypocrite Gillard say that Abbott should commit to never doing something her government approved.
That is world class hypocrisy
She should F**k off and stop reminding us of the unhappy experience
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘Yudhoyono’s letter to Tony Abbott:’ ‘ ‘ ‘ 😆 ‘ 😆 ‘ 😆 ‘ 😆
Nice-one lpad`osy
It was a well crafted letter, I gave it a distinction.
Is he?? Sounds like you want him to fail and for Australia to get into trouble because your ALP luvvies are not in power.
Abboott (hehehe) was destined to fuck up on the world stage (I actually predicted it!) I just want a fkn competent government … I don’t give a shit what their politics are … Go Clivey!
If Gillard/Rudd had won the election would things be any different??
We’ll never know … we went from the ridiculous to the ridiculous …
At the moment it is a mess created by the ALP (in 2009) which as usual the Coalition has to clean up.
Wrong again, Kneel, it was a mess created by the Libs- Howard/ALP – Rudd Gillard Rudd/Libs – Abbott – but the High Priest is now in power* … no-one else has the power to apologise …
* If you think The Pugilist Priest didn’t know what was happening he’s either incompetent or guilty … ya can’t have it both ways …
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Agree, ToM …
She should F**k off and stop reminding us of the unhappy experience
Just enjoy
ourher retirement …heads-up TB, #noddy
… did we predict this shite or not CC?
Jesus wept!
It was a well crafted letter, I gave it a distinction.
Well of course you did, Os egg, but it was plagiarised … I’ve never seen an original comment from ToSY in fkn seven years!
Once again the blogmeister has not provide his loyal subjects with a weekend Forum for breaking trivia …
Maybe Bill Shorten has had more “positive” influence on his Mum in Law than we suspected/expected …
http://www.news.com.au/national/governorgeneral-quentin-bryce-backs-australia-becoming-a-republic-and-legalising-gay-marriage/story-fncynjr2-1226766409885
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘That is world class hypocrisy’ ‘ ‘ ‘
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘She should F**k off and stop reminding us of the unhappy experience’ ‘ ‘ ‘
Agree yomm.
John-W, Kevin07, Joolya, the lot of`em.
Unfortunately Kerry dragged Keating into the studio for some historic foaming and frothing to generate some b-grade content for my abc2 channel.
l apologize to all viewers.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘did we predict this shite or not CC?’ ‘ ‘ ‘
Yup. We Foresaw. 🙂
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘What comedy club do you belong??’ ‘ ‘ ‘
‘ ‘ ‘ ‘She proved she could negotiate.’ ‘ ‘ ‘
Kneel`s comedy club, l guess.
Kneel has fully forgotten Joolya negotiated herself into government,
right under Mr-Rabbit`s nose.
‘JAKARTA police are bracing for a second day of protest at the Australian embassy, with religious rabble-rousers Islamic Defenders Front (FPI) promising to join the action this afternoon.’
Oz
“Well of course you did, Os egg, but it was plagiarised”
Guffaw. Google it then you bitter ol’
pommykweenslander. Then tell us who wrote it first. 🙂Talking of cricket.
http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/england-collapse-a-relief-say-fans-2013112281361
LOL! Stupid, Inane, Bitter … LOL! 🙄 🙄 🙄
OH and Pommy … the worst insult of all! 😯
I vaguely recall … something about age earlier this year too …?
Twisted Logic Sprouts at the Cafe
‘We can debate until the cows come home, but it all boils down to this. Abbott and Co simply were unfit to be the Opposition in this country and it’s showing now that they are in government.’
Le blogeur gai
The Bolter demands Bryce step down from the GG job, something to do with a conflict of interest in the Boyer Lecture and her son in law’s party platform.
Andrew Bolt can be a bit precious at times.
“Andrew Bolt can be a bit precious at times.
Wow. Who knew?
Even, Abbott, a notorious monarchist, handled Bryce’s speech with (a lot) more grace & poise than Bolt.
Bolt only pretends at tolerance. He is actually a strident sewer of hyperbole, on most issues. His lickspittles lap that shit up….so, in that sense, he very much plays up to his audience.
Well all the lefties are urging Abbott to apologise.
This is all the evidence i need that this is the wrong thing to do.
There is some advantages reading comments on leftoid blogs.
‘…so, in that sense, he very much plays up to his audience.’
Its hard to judge, his ‘comments’ section is closed. My feeling is that he has misjudged the electorate’s mood on gay marriage and the Republic. Bryce is also widely admired, so its unseemly to put the boot in just to win a few cheap political points.
Fail.
NOS..Abbott is doing a fine job at failing on all fronts, he is proving that he has finally fond his true calling “grate Australian failure”… he will be a veritable plimsell line of failure..in fact they will erect monuments to his catastrophic achievements, huge towering turds over CSG wells sucking the intelligence from anyone withing pissing distance 🙄
And Tom just for your lack of information…
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/julia-gillard-says-prime-minister-tony-abbott-should-follow-barack-obamas-example-on-spying/story-fn59niix-1226765779915
Andrew Bolt can be a bit precious at times.
Who?
Exactly Ricky. As your link illustrates, Gillard wants Abbott to square this away as Obama did with Merkel.
Gillard was part of a government that approved the tapping of SBY’s phone, that of his wife, and his ministers. So despite her government thinking it was fine to do this, she is now wanting Abbott to say he’ll never do what her government thought was quite appropriate.
That’s why she is such a pathetic hypocrite.
‘Who?’
chuckle
I’ve been looking for some dirt on Bryce, but there is nothing. So that ‘strident sewer of hyperbole’ is up himself on this occasion.
“I’ve been looking for some dirt on Bryce, but there is nothing”
All human beings have skeletons in the closet. I have not been following the topic so i may make a wrong comment.
I saw on a leftoid blog that lefties said that Bryce abused her power as Govenour of Queensland. And if lefties condemned Bryce there has to be some truth floating around.
I did a google search and i found this
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/g-g-sons-wedding-low-key/story-e6freuy9-1111118173551
“There was uproar in 2004 after Tom’s elder brother, Rupert, married Rachel Moor and the couple had their reception under a giant white marquee at Queensland’s Government House in Brisbane.
Official Secretary Justin O’Connor and Executive Officer Steven Blinkhorn were forced out of their jobs after clashing with Mrs Bryce and telling her it was inappropriate to stage the family wedding in the grounds. There was speculation that fears of a similar outcry ruled out any hope of a Sydney ceremony”
Apparently she used government house in Queensland for personal purposes.
“Apparently she used government house in Queensland for personal purposes.”
I should also say, like all the time. Anyway that is what the leftoids told me.
I did a google search and arrived at the telegraph only to use the word leftoid… what an agerous low intellect knob.atypically personifying the bleak age of abbotts negative vindictive assault on decent Australians. NOS personifies the Zombie Tony voter..full of hate for shit they are told to be outraged about..a brain dead army of the politically ignorant defiant of fact armed with a manufactured version of a perverse regressive reality.
End of Story.. Abbott is incapable of making the transition from “will say anything to get the job” parochial perspective cattle caller to international statesman. Abbott is not up to the job, but that was screamingly apparent considering his past.
http://www.news.com.au/national/indonesian-immigration-official-boat-people-free-to-go-to-australia/story-fncynjr2-1226766944095
Oh how we guffawed! Much amusement … talk about self fulfilling …
And Dolly Downer should go and have tea with Julia Gillard and compare notes instead of continuing to fkn things up … 😆
Its like being on the set of “Wonderland”… highly paid amateurs … script fiddling and poor direction … and actualy producing nothing … 🙄
Australia has really come of age since Abbott & The Acolytes took
controlup residence …Go Clivey!
Smash an Abbott voting Zombie over the head with the reality stick of truth and all they can manage is to wander aimlessly in perpetually narrowing right circles, consistently arriving at the same predictable place chanting irreverent three word mantras of rhetorical hate till they collapse in a pile of social carnage after sucking all the tangible nutrients out of everything in their greedy path. Remind them of their actions with any semblance of fact and they will seek to reprint history with the next lithium version that they will sell to the equally gullible.
Abbott & The Acolytes.. TB Priceless !! 🙂
“Oh how we guffawed! Much amusement”
Yes. Comments from a man who hopes Abbott fails.
There is no Hope for Abbott, its all past tense as in Epic Failed already and its only early, he’s just got started
Boats=fail
Repeal Carbon ETS=Fail
Economy Lie =Fail
CSIRO=Fail
Education =Fail
Diplomacy =Fail
Telecommunications=Fail
Not much hope left NOS in denial, you backed a pup chump
Ricky take off those blinkers, its not a pretty sight.
The number of boat arrivals have been reduced by 80%.
The carbon tax repeal bill has been tabled and will eventually come into law.
The economy is going well, consumer spending is trending up, a sign of confidence.
The CSIRO will inevitably be separated from the Klimatariat, which can only be a good thing.
Not sure what’s happening with education, user pay principle applies.
In the diplomatic arena he hasn’t done too badly, he should have apologised to ‘bang bang’ like Obama did Merkel, but beyond that he has received accolades on the international stage for his rejection of the CC fiasco.
With telecommunications …to the node will have to do.
‘The letter to Jakarta needed to contain all the elements that could, at the outset, have made this controversy a diplomatic victory for Abbott instead of a debacle. He chose to make it a debacle by listening to those intent on protecting their own skins and empires, the heads of defence, foreign affairs and intelligence. When Abbott spoke in Parliament I was thinking, ”No, this can’t be happening.”
Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/tony-abbotts-10-ways-out-of-this-mess-20131124-2y3se.html#ixzz2lcmFA4xf
Yeah omelette its all going so swimmingly for mr 1%..just peachy..just as predicted 99% of Australia has has a big fucking reality check… Its going so well that if he holds a double dissolution those who stupidly stared into the Abyss would toss this dud where he belongs along with all the other incompetents. 🙂