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New Report paints Terrifying Picture of Global Warming Future

December 4, 2013

15

Life in Sydney will be like in subtropical Queensland by the end of the century according to shocking new research released today by Dr Peter Christoff, Associate Professor at Melbourne University.

Dr Christoff says that if global temperatures are allowed to rise by four degrees – which is the current trajectory of climate change – Melbourne’s climate will be akin to Griffith in regional NSW and Canberra will feel like outback Cobar.

Alice Springs will mirror modern-day Sudan, while Darwin will be like no other city on earth in 2013. The Top End would be virtually uninhabitable, with more than 300 days a year of 35-plus degree heat.

The downside to warmer winters on the eastern seaboard in 2100 is the prospect of “anarchy” in our region prompted by the dislocation of 250 million people from the Asia-Pacific, climate refugees who will need to be resettled in part in Australia.

The “profound” shift in living conditions as a result of climate change is raised in the new book “Four Degrees of Global Warming: Australia in a hot world.”

The book explores the dire changes that are likely to accompany four degrees of warming on 1990 levels, including Australia becoming reliant on food imports as a result of a 90 per cent decline in agricultural production in the Murray-Darling food bowl.

Other consequences include:

  • 250,000 coastal properties inundated by rising sea levels at a total cost of $63 billion
  • 17,200 heat-related deaths a year – up from 5800 today
  • Snow will disappear from all but the highest alpine peaks
  • 250 million people in the Asia-Pacific will be displaced

The mass exodus from low-lying Bangladesh and coastal cities of China, Indonesia and India poses perhaps the biggest challenge for Australia, which could face a wave of climate refugees on a scale that would dwarf the current asylum seeker crisis.

In a chapter written by Professor Ross Garnaut, the prospect of “anarchy” and the breakdown of nation states is raised.

“Warming of 4 degrees celsius and more would precipitate such large change in global politics as to force the reshaping of national boundaries,” Garnaut writes.

“It may lead to a small number of more effective states combating anarchy by absorbing others.

“The survival of states with anything like the current boundaries and roles would be one of the less likely eventualities.”

Professor Garnaut believes there is “still a chance that global mitigation efforts will hold global warming to two degrees” as long as countries are willing to turn up to the Paris climate change conference in 2015, prepared to commit to deep emissions cuts post-2020.

The book’s main author, Dr Christoff, said Australia would need to swap its five per cent emissions reduction target to 38 per cent within 10 years to keep warming under two degrees.

“It’s inappropriate for us to wait for a global agreement. Delaying is going to be more costly and less efficient. There’s no point in delay,” he told The Gutter Trash.

“We have about a decade.”

 

 

 

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479 Comments
  1. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 12:06 pm

    Pretty alarming.

  2. Walrus permalink
    December 4, 2013 12:19 pm

    1) The best way to get heard and sell a book is to scare the shit out of people

    2) As soon as I saw the reference to Ross Garnaut I calmed down as I then realised the book would be found on a bookshelf under “Fiction”

  3. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 4, 2013 12:32 pm

    I thought it was the beginning of someones comedy routine- however there was no punchline.

  4. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 12:54 pm

    Christoff’s thesis is that a global warming tipping point is a decade away, whereas the Denialati claim a global cooling tipping point is less than 18 months away.

  5. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 1:30 pm

    The pause continues.

  6. TB Queensland permalink
    December 4, 2013 1:45 pm

    Noice try, Kneel … 😆

  7. Splatterbottom permalink
    December 4, 2013 2:44 pm

    Behold the end is nigh! Oh Gaia have mercy on us poor carbon sinners! We will repent our sinful carboniferous ways. We will purchase your carbon credit indulgences by the truckload. We will build Solar Temples and cover the landscape with wind-turbine crucifixes. We will honour your High Priests Flannery, Garnaut and Gore.

    Or maybe as Mencken said:

    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”

  8. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    December 4, 2013 2:51 pm

    That’s all very well, but can you believe some people don’t want to cull the sharks that eat surfers?

    I hope climate change results in huge carnivorous koalas and kangaroos. Let’s see how the conservationists feel about “entering their territory” then.

  9. December 4, 2013 2:57 pm

    “I hope climate change results in huge carnivorous koalas and kangaroos.”

    We have a correspondent writing up that very story as we speak!

  10. December 4, 2013 3:43 pm

    I was unaware that the ocean was “Surfer Territory”. Thanks for setting me straight.

  11. December 4, 2013 4:36 pm

    Tony Abbot great, Andrew Bolt truth, Scientists are Commo’s , Benardi is intelligent, Economy in ruin, Nothing to see, debt is bad, boats are stopped, Kneell has brains, imbecile as PM ….. see if you put it all in 3 words and repeat it infinitum anything is possible 🙄

  12. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    December 4, 2013 6:35 pm

    Yes Steve, humans can use water as well as land. Amazing isn’t it!?

  13. TB Queensland permalink
    December 4, 2013 7:05 pm

    That’s all very well, but can you believe some people don’t want to cull the sharks that eat surfers?

    The bigger the economy gets the more Fuckwits™ will survive … I know what should be culled …

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    We have a correspondent writing up that very story as we speak!

    I didn’t get any emails, sreb?

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    G’day Steve! Surfers generally vote Liberal – Born To Rule!

    Yes Steve, humans can use water as well as land. Amazing isn’t it!?

    Rewrite: Yes Steve, humans can exploit water as well as land. Amazing isn’t it!?

  14. December 4, 2013 7:13 pm

    “I didn’t get any emails, sreb?”

    Errr….

  15. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 8:29 pm

    Ummmm….

    Only splatter gets a credit, the rest of you are woeful.

  16. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 8:52 pm

    ‘The mass exodus from low-lying Bangladesh and coastal cities of China, Indonesia and India poses perhaps the biggest challenge for Australia, which could face a wave of climate refugees on a scale that would dwarf the current asylum seeker crisis.’

    With global cooling there maybe an increase in immigration from the UK, that’s about it. Plan B is aimed to avoid mass migration by feeding people in situ.

  17. egg permalink
    December 4, 2013 9:25 pm

    * 250,000 coastal properties inundated by rising sea levels at a total cost of $63 billion

    * 17,200 heat-related deaths a year – up from 5800 today

    * Snow will disappear from all but the highest alpine peaks

    * 250 million people in the Asia-Pacific will be displaced

    As northern hemisphere winter snow cover increases, sea level rise will pause and no evacuations will be necessary. Heat deaths will become a thing of the past and 250 million people in the Asian Pacific will stay put…Plan B.

  18. egg permalink
    December 5, 2013 12:40 pm

    Flummery’s Non-Taxpayer Funded Junket

    http://www.fijisun.com.fj/2013/11/29/delegates-gather-for-climate-conference/

  19. December 5, 2013 9:41 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘We have about a decade.’ ‘ ‘ ‘

    Too Late. We Don`t.

  20. December 5, 2013 9:47 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘I was unaware that the ocean was “Surfer Territory’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘

    The bogan flavored shark snacks haven`t been holding their `territory` too well this year.

  21. Sparta of Phoenix AZ, USA permalink
    December 6, 2013 12:24 am

    http://nypost.com/2013/12/05/global-warming-proof-is-evaporating/

    I remember making the comparison of AGW and organized religion to Tim about 6-7 years ago and he went ballistic! However, clearly it was spot on (I get lucky once in a while)….I grabbed the bit below from another piece…I remember learning about the scientific method as a child, back when they still taught such things without revisionist input and from the beginning of this debate the “theory” just couldn’t hold up to the method’s basic premise (so call me a denier, flat Earth guy, in for big oil blah, blah). Authoritarian, the root of all Leftwing dogma…CONTROL…..

    “In a classic 1955 lecture on “The Value of Science,” the celebrated physicist (and future Nobel laureate) Richard Feynman warned that science would be hobbled if it tried to stifle its doubters and skeptics. “If we want to solve a problem that we have never solved before, we must leave the door to the unknown ajar . . . [D]oubt is not to be feared but welcomed and discussed.”

    Science isn’t settled by majority vote, and invoking “consensus” to shut off debate is authoritarian and anti-scientific. There are always inconvenient truths to challenge what the majority thinks it knows. Ninety-seven percent of experts may be impressed with the emperor’s new clothes. That’s no reason to silence those who insist the emperor is naked.”

  22. egg permalink
    December 6, 2013 7:37 am

    ‘Mind you, the term “pause” is misleading in the extreme: Unless and until it resumes again, it’s just a “stop.” You don’t say a bullet-ridden body “paused” breathing.’

    Timely article Sparta, from which I’ll borrow that sentence.

  23. egg permalink
    December 6, 2013 7:57 am

    Global cooling involves big winds and waves, returning in a 60 year natural cycle related to sol.

    ‘More than 120,000 homes were left without power as the most serious tidal surge for 60 years is predicted to hit the east coast tonight.

    ‘As they were taken away from their homes in dinghies, forecasters feared the worst is yet to come during tonight’s high tide at around 10pm.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2518340/Sea-walls-breached-raging-seas-hours-BEFORE-high-tide-140mph-Arctic-winds-batter-British-coastline.html#ixzz2mdTrEvss
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  24. egg permalink
    December 6, 2013 10:20 am

    A grass roots free market agricultural revolution in China.

    http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/2013-12/04/content_17150252.htm

  25. December 7, 2013 11:34 pm

    Feed Them.
    They Will Come.

  26. egg permalink
    December 8, 2013 7:59 am

    A straight man feeds lines for comics, so I fail to see why you are here.

  27. egg permalink
    December 10, 2013 7:35 am

    It appears the end is nigh after all.

  28. egg permalink
    December 10, 2013 9:05 pm

    ‘Britain’s unilateral carbon tax should be scrapped before it causes blackouts, pushes up household bills and makes the UK uncompetitive, ScottishPower argues.

    ‘Keith Anderson, chief corporate officer, warns that the “carbon price floor” (CPF), which taxes companies for burning fossil fuels, will make Britain’s remaining coal plants “largely uneconomic by around the middle of the decade”.

    ‘With Britain’s spare power margin already forecast to fall as low as 2pc by 2015, the carbon tax will force more closures and “threatens to make us even more vulnerable to the risk of blackouts”, he warns.’

    UK Tele

  29. egg permalink
    December 11, 2013 5:06 pm

    ‘ABC chairman Jim Spigelman has announced a series of sweeping editorial reviews to ensure impartiality at the public broadcaster.

    ‘Systematic briefings will be given to staff to ensure more airtime is given to the news issues that remain “important to all Australians”, the ABC chairman has revealed.

    ‘In a speech at the National Press Club in Canberra, Mr Spigelman said he had been concerned since his appointment in April 2012 with the frequency of allegations of a lack of impartiality.

    ‘But this was more a case of the “imperfection of human endeavour rather than systematic bias”.

    Oz

  30. TB Queensland permalink
    December 11, 2013 5:13 pm

    sreb, do you get the impression that this particular thread may have been a – mistake …?

    Just sayin’ … 😉

  31. December 11, 2013 5:27 pm

    “do you get the impression that this particular thread may have been a – mistake …?”

    Just this one….??

  32. egg permalink
    December 11, 2013 5:38 pm

    ‘this particular thread may have been a – mistake …?’

    Yeah, its crap.

  33. December 11, 2013 5:42 pm

    High praise.

  34. egg permalink
    December 11, 2013 5:44 pm

    There’s no fkn biff and my sword is rusty.

  35. December 11, 2013 6:13 pm

    Global cooling requires limitless denial, junk-science, and willful stupidity. lt perfectly suits Limited-News.

  36. December 11, 2013 6:23 pm

    ” lt perfectly suits Limited-News.”

    and egg. 😯

  37. egg permalink
    December 11, 2013 8:09 pm

    Global warming stopped 17 years ago and the junk science is the IPCC, so you are both in denial, brainwashed by a compliant media into thinking a harmless trace gas caused a civil war.

    ‘Drought was a key factor contributing to unrest and civil war in Syria, and the severity of the drought was probably a result of human-caused climate change, new research presented here Monday (Dec. 9) at the annual meeting of the American Geophysical Union suggests.’

    http://news.yahoo.com/human-caused-climate-change-may-worsened-syrian-unrest-022058269.html

  38. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 10:57 am

    ‘I think this whole climate change debate will go down in history as one of the great frauds on the Australian people—similar to Y2K, I would suggest. The suggestion is that having the world’s biggest carbon tax, which will reduce our emissions by five per cent—that is, five per cent of the 1.4 per cent of emissions that come from Australia—will change the climate of the world. You have heard Senator Milne time and time again telling us all that this climate change process in Australia is what is going to save the world. She cannot possibly believe that. Nobody in their right mind could possibly believe that.’

    Ian MacDonald

  39. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 11:04 am

    Could someone nick over to http://jennifermarohasy.com/ and tell Luke that I’m banned at that blog and he can find me here.

    Thanking you in advance.

  40. December 12, 2013 12:17 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘A village in Madagascar has been hit by a deadly outbreak of the bubonic plague, medical experts on the island have confirmed. Tests were carried out after at least 20 people in the village, near the north-western town of Mandritsara, were reported to have died last week.’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘

    http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/village-in-madagascar-hit-by-deadly-outbreak-of-bubonic-plague/

    Dumpty, your Junk-science still aint competing with traditional methods of destroying mankind.

  41. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 1:00 pm

    I see your 20 deaths from bubonic plague and raise 40,000 extra deaths in the UK this winter.

    Beat that short arse.

  42. December 12, 2013 1:27 pm

    “Beat that short arse.”

    Is there any need for that sort of thing…?

  43. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 2:45 pm

    chuckle

  44. December 12, 2013 2:59 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘London – KILLER freezes, floods and heat-waves will devastate Britain during the next 30 years, climate ­experts have warned. Many people could die as extreme weather becomes common. There will be more freak winds like the October storm, which killed four people. Heat-waves will be lethal and the sea level will rise, leaving coastal towns at risk of being swamped by storm surges.’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘

    http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2013/12/09/climate-chaos-killer-winter-storms-predicted-to-impact-uk-for-next-30-years/

    Another nail in Dumpty`s junk-science coffin.

  45. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 3:31 pm

    Wait a minute, the IPCC is now claiming extreme weather is caused by AGW?

    Christ all bloody mighty, we have reached a tipping point and it has nothing to do with carbon dioxide.

  46. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 12, 2013 4:01 pm

    The suggestion is that having the world’s biggest carbon tax, which will reduce our emissions by five per cent…………………………..will change the climate of the world.

    This is one comment made by my conservatives like Bolt which i disagree with.

    A carbon tax which reduces CO2 emissions may or may not change the temperature. But that is not the point. If AGW is real you have to start somewhere.

    Putting on a CO2 tax may lead to a change in behaviour which leads to some new discovery which will alter the climate. It is called research.

    You have to start somewhere and make an attempt f you believe AGW is real.

  47. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 5:15 pm

    Neil, CO2 does not cause global warming, the scientific evidence is conclusive.

  48. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 5:24 pm

    From Teabag’s link

    “They present the European Union and Member States with significant challenges in preparing Europe for a future with greater frequency of extreme weather.” –Daily Star

    During the down wave natural variability will produce extremes in weather because of the wobbly jet stream. Its happening in both hemispheres simultaneously.

    Perhaps a journey back in time, to the end of the Medieval period, will open your minds to the predicament we find ourselves in.

  49. TB Queensland permalink
    December 12, 2013 6:29 pm

    … by my conservatives …

    Family? Whoa! Can’t get anymore rusty than that! 😯 🙄 🙄

  50. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 12, 2013 8:03 pm

    “Neil, CO2 does not cause global warming, the scientific evidence is conclusive.

    Maybe so but that was not my point.

    My point was the stupidity of people (eg Andrew Bolt) saying a Carbon tax was useless because it would have no effect on temperature. You have to start somewhere. The starting point maybe a waste of time but it may lead to a solution after trial and error. People who really do believe in AGW should not be asked to solve the problem without trying and failing.

    It is called research. Most research goes nowhere but some leads to a solution.

    Family? Whoa! Can’t get anymore rusty than that”

    Good to see TB you read what I say very carefully. Even finding some mistakes. Keep it up, you may learn something.

  51. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 8:11 pm

    ‘You have to start somewhere.’

    The game is almost over, Neil. If you had come to my lectures and absorbed a bit of reality, its patently clear we have run out of time.

    Don’t know what else I can say.

  52. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 12, 2013 8:20 pm

    Well 48% of the population voted for Labor.

    It is not over because Abbott is having trouble abolishing the Carbon tax. I think the Senate may not agree to what Abbott wants to do.

    Is this correct??

  53. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 8:43 pm

    Yes they are stalling, good strategy by the watermelon coalition. Being a pragmatist he won’t go with a double dissolution election, preferring to wait for the new senate on July 1.

    If they don’t come to the party then our supreme leader will have a double D over this single issue. Even if he is running badly in the polls I still think he would go for it.

    And because the science of global warming is crap our supreme leader will come out with guns blazing …. telling the brainwashed masses the truth.

    What do you make of the graph?

  54. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 12, 2013 8:58 pm

    Well the graph is all over the place.

    I am not sure what to say. It looks like Labor/Greens/Socialists WANT AGW to be true for some strange reason. I think common sense does not apply.

    PS. I hope you are reading this TB. You might learn something.

  55. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:05 pm

    Toilet has criticised any connection between AGW supporters and faith, but I can say for certain the left have swallowed this scam hook line and sinker.

    The graph illustrates quite clearly that the global cooling tipping point was in 2001.

  56. TB Queensland permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:22 pm

    Keep it up, you may learn something.

    One is (almost) funny … 😆

    PS. I hope you are reading this TB. You might learn something.

    Then you go and bugger it up … 🙄 🙄

    Tories no snese (sic) of humour, don’t get irony, misunderstand cynicism and flat out spelling sarcasm … 🙄

  57. TB Queensland permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:25 pm

    … but I can say for certain the left have swallowed this scam hook line and sinker.

    I relly don’t think its about political persuasion by the masses, egg … more like the morons who pretend they can run the show …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Noddy Newman & The Nitwits now want to sell off more Queensland assets … does he even KNOW why Anna bLie and her lot were voted OUT? Another a “born to rule” twat.

  58. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:31 pm

    Jools tried to persuade us of carbon pollution and had success in dividing the nation.

    James Taylor with a satirical piece in Forbes.

    ‘Slaughtering millions of this country’s birds and bats each year is a small price to pay to reverse this documented climate mayhem. If wind turbines slice up more and more bald eagles, California condors and whooping cranes in mid-flight, that is the price we will gladly pay to put an end to this global climate disruption. To make an eagle omelet, you have to kill a few eagles.’

  59. Neil of Sydney permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:34 pm

    ” but I can say for certain the left have swallowed this scam hook line and sinker.”

    And what does that say about “The Left” ??

    PS. I hope you are reading this TB. It is the beginning of your education.

  60. egg permalink
    December 12, 2013 9:45 pm

    This is really a question for future historians, but gullible comes to mind. They are so immersed in the faith, dispensed by snake oil scientists, that rational thought is overwhelmed by pseudo science, a cargo cult of the 21st century.

  61. egg permalink
    December 14, 2013 5:09 pm

    No living person has seen a cycle this weak.

  62. egg permalink
    December 14, 2013 9:33 pm

    Cairo sees first snow in 112 years… global cooling.

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/cairo-snow-egyptian-capital-sees-2923418

  63. egg permalink
    December 14, 2013 9:51 pm

    ‘The global warming scientists — with their models defunct and now acting on hope rather than science — assert that temperatures will soon renew their climb. The global cooling scientists assert the opposite – that temperatures on Earth have peaked, as they have peaked countless times before in following nature’s cycles. And that consistent with Earth’s history, and with the laws of physics, temperatures on Earth will now be falling.’

    Solomon / Huffpo

  64. December 14, 2013 10:34 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘I reAlly don’t think its about political persuasion by the masses, egg, more like the morons who pretend they can run the show’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘

    Particularly east-coast morons. l tend to agree with TB here, you may notice l`ve been trying to show Dumpty that the junk-science `war` and denial has run its course a while ago, and really only exists to enrich the megaphones like bolt, and amuse his `useful`idiot following. Those in positions of industry power to `take`action HAS, and have been ignoring the junk-science trolls and their noise. You won`t learn about it thru our timid embedded-media tho.

  65. egg permalink
    December 14, 2013 11:07 pm

    CO2 Causes Global Cooling (apparently)

    ‘New research on the effect of atmospheric CO2 caused by human emissions, shows that the change from global warming to cooling observed since the mid 1990s, can be explained by very basic physics of the CO2 molecule, which upon doubling from preindustrial level of 280 ppm will increase the outgoing longwave radiation by 4 W/m2 and thereby cause a cooling of more than 2 C threatening to trigger a runaway climate change into a new Ice Age.

    ‘The world community led by Sweden and Germany is now preparing for the Great Transformation required to reduce CO2 emissions to zero by 2020 to avoid a New Ice Age with even more far-reaching transformation covering Sweden and Germany under 1000 m of ice, threatening German automotive industry and Facebook servers in the north of Sweden.’

    Claes Johnson

  66. egg permalink
    December 14, 2013 11:22 pm

    Drudge Confirms Our Worst Fears

    http://dailycaller.com/2013/12/13/study-earth-was-warmer-in-roman-medieval-times/

  67. December 15, 2013 12:33 am

    Egg….

    I always found that rather obvious fact a bit of a conundrum for the AGW Church. Simply put the basic question or logical deduction which calls into question AGW Theory…

    1. We know the Earth has been much warmer in the past, long before there was ever any human activity, so what caused it?

    Nobody knows, many theories proposed but nothing else…

    2. If we know that the planet has warmed and cooled many times before in the past 4.5 billion years why is not possible to assume it doing so again, without the input of man?

    Answer, we can’t…We are just suppose to “accept” that despite the large volume of evidence that we have supporting natural factors we don’t understand, all such evidence must be discounted; certainly not discussed.

    Sorry, very “unscientific” if you ask me…Just got to have a bit of “faith” I suppose or in the case of the IPCC, a monthly check to the developing world since the concept of “empire” being the cause of all world strife in these same places is not holding up anymore…

    Another question, if the debate is over and there is a consensus, why are we still pumping millions in tax revenue into research grants for academics to prove what they say is already been proved? Just saying…

  68. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:21 am

    ‘Nobody knows, many theories proposed but nothing else…’

    The null hypothesis leans towards that big shiny orb.

  69. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 10:20 am

    ‘The climate is always changing, always has, always will. There is absolutely no evidence that modern climate changes are exceeding the pre-human range of variability.

    ‘There are anthropogenic influences which modify the climate’s natural oscillations. Very few scientists in the oil industry doubt that anthropogenic activities affect the climate. We just know for a fact that those effects are not causing the climate to change in ways that exceed the normal variability of the Holocene and that such effects are likely to be so small that they can’t be differentiated.

    ‘Otherwise, the Warmists would have long ago clearly differentiated the anthropogenic from the natural. Furthermore, none of the proposed solutions are economically feasible, nor would they mitigate climate change in any measurable way.’

  70. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 10:22 am

    That quote was from David Middleton in a guest post at Watts, putting the oil industry’s point of view.

  71. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 10:42 am

    Global Cooling Impacts US

    http://local.msn.com/snowstorm-expands-to-impact-more-than-110-million-3

  72. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 12:09 pm

    ‘Other industries would stand accused of damning conflicts of interest but when it comes to global warming, anything goes…

    ‘The Mail on Sunday today reveals the extraordinary web of political and financial interests creating dozens of eco-millionaires from green levies on household energy bills.

    ‘A three-month investigation shows that some of the most outspoken campaigners who demand that consumers pay the colossal price of shifting to renewable energy are also getting rich from their efforts.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2523726/Web-green-politicians-tycoons-power-brokers-help-benefit-billions-raised-bills.html#ixzz2nV8QJeDw
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  73. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 1:11 pm

    Syrian refugees dying of cold in Lebanon

  74. TB Queensland permalink
    December 15, 2013 1:48 pm

    Snowing in Cairo … last time was 112 years ago … so it DID snow then?

    Nothing is new …

  75. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 1:51 pm

    Exactly, global warming is a fraud.

  76. December 15, 2013 4:31 pm

    “Toilet has criticised any connection between AGW supporters and faith, but I can say for certain the left have swallowed this scam hook line and sinker.”

    Way to misinterpret a point I’ve made, many times now, which has been predictably avoided by those of ‘faith’.

    Not to labour a theme, but what I’ve said is it never ceases to amuse me that, the lion’s share of anti-AGW ranters, who like to use ‘faith’ as a smear & are especially cynical about AGW, have absolutely no compulsion to apply the same standards of cynicism & critical attack upon (their own, or that of others) religious ‘faith’ (a phenomenon which, incidentally, requires absolute blind faith to maintain the self deception)…

    So, I haven’t really made a statement about the veracity, or otherwise, of AGW by my position.

    It kinda wreaks havoc with the strange (hypocritical) narrative which they’re trying to construct to align themselves with their aversion to all things AGW.

    * as I’ve said before, I recognise that you (and others) are an exception to this, el manbearpig.

    ** lucky I bothered to check this propaganda thread, lest I never had the chance to correct the spurious misinterpretation.

  77. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 4:51 pm

    ** chuckle **

    ‘So, I haven’t really made a statement about the veracity, or otherwise, of AGW by my position.’

    No, being agnostic is safe but this issue is black and white, and like religion it requires faith in the proponents of AGW.

    In the same way we can criticise IPA for not coming out on one side or other of the dog bothering debate, the left are pleading ignorance as defence on CC, it won’t wash.

  78. December 15, 2013 5:03 pm

    Ah, but IPA (who wasn’t called that at the time) has , in the past, come out on a side of that.

    I wasn’t referring to him anyway. He is far too shrewd to overcommit to things which are gonna be virtually impossible to defend.

    My observation is a general one about the tendency of many anti-AGW ranters to be conservative & religious (I see the politicising of the issue as extremely ideological…for the most part)…yet utterly hypocritical in the way they (stupidly, or at least obliviously) use ‘faith’ as some kind of negative connotation (for some things…but not the elephant in the room [made up magic men in the sky]).

  79. December 15, 2013 5:06 pm

    Climate, weather, geography, meteorology & other facets of the earth sciences are at least measurable & physically observable

    Fairies, leprechauns & ‘god’ are not, and by their very nature never will be…coz the game is up once they start to require substantiable evidence.

    I can see why you’d dispute AGW science…but at least there is something tangible to dispute. 🙄

    Not even the same arguments.

  80. December 15, 2013 5:26 pm

    Actually Dunny, l agree, but with a reverse outlook,

    #dog cannot be proven to exist by `botherers`, atheists cannot prove dog doesn`t, (not_100%) so this could be called `grey`

    #science has proven several factors of `white`, is actually `white`, while junk-science tries to sell `white-is-black` or inject `grey-into-white`

    #conclusion, junk-science is willfully dishonest, most dog-botherers actually DO believe in dog

    So for me, l rank the junk-science shills as worse than team-dog

  81. December 15, 2013 5:53 pm

    While we’re on tyne subject of so-called “religion” and THE AFTERLIFE, we here at The Gutter Trash have been working on a new religious order to satisfy the enquiring minds of people “just like you.”

    It’s called SPACEOLOGY, and with just a few practical mindfulness techniques, you too can go on to live a life full of wisdom and meaning.

    YES IT REALLY IS TRUE!

    But don’t just take my word for it, here’s our religion correspondent Douglas Renholm to explain its MIRACULOUS BENEFITS…!!!

  82. December 15, 2013 5:56 pm

    And if that doesn’t convince you, maybe you just don’t deserve to get what you want.

  83. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 6:12 pm

    I can tell you this about IPA: He was partly-indoctrinated in Roman Catholicism via various Catholic schools, most particularly his latter years boarding at a Marist Brothers all-male secondary college.

    His mother converted from Anglicanism in order to marry his non-church-going father. Yet he was obliged to attend Mass every single morning while at that institution.

    He was also obliged to do an hour’s sport every weeknight, and play competetive sport on the weekends (which he loved – particularly football and swimming – and wouldn’t change a bit of it).

    He was further obliged to sit in a classroom – for an hour before dinner and an hour after, plus a third hour in the final couple of years – ostensibly to study, but more often than not it meant reading A Clockwork Orange, or Papillion, or something else – anything else – other than actual study.

    But he was lucky! He could remember nearly everything he heard in class, and always achieved high marks in exams. The cane was no stranger to his hands (or backside), however, after he was caught smoking, or for unauthorised absenteeism, or just for general boredom-induced jackassery in class.

    But I digress.

    Since then he has thought a lot – a lot(!) – about “the meaning of life”, and has reached a stage he will call ‘informed agnosticism’. He now thinks it is unlikely anything exists beyond the grave – and hence has lost all fear of death – but he CAN’T BE CERTAIN. There are still too many things he thinks can’t be explained by science: infinity of time and space, chief among them.

    That, briefly, is his journey from altar-boy, to lapsed Catholic, to agnostic. He can’t see atheism on the horizon, but you never can tell. 😉

  84. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 6:16 pm

    As for AGW, that is one religion I am proudly atheistic about.

  85. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 6:18 pm

    Also:

    GO THE MIGHTY FKN AUSSIES! OI!

  86. December 15, 2013 6:23 pm

    Nice job lpad`osy 🙂

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘Since then he has thought a lot – a lot(!) – about’ ‘ ‘ ‘
    .
    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘“the meaning of life”,’ ‘ ‘ ‘
    You were doing so well up to here.
    Or is it `sarc`.?
    .
    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘and has reached a stage he will call ‘informed agnosticism’. He now thinks it is unlikely anything exists beyond the grave – and hence has lost all fear of death – but he CAN’T BE CERTAIN.’ ‘ ‘ ‘

  87. December 15, 2013 6:56 pm

    I applaud the definitive answer!

    And must say that, the latter schooling was eerily identical to my own! 😯 …right down to the hour of sport on weeknights, sport on weekends (we weren’t allowed to go home on weekends- those that were were know [derisively] as ‘weaklies’…still, not as derided as ‘scrags’ [day students]) study for 3 hours every night (except Saturday) , compulsory mass (even for the non-believers) etc. etc…
    I was lucky too.

    As for…”There are still too many things he thinks can’t be explained by science: infinity of time and space, chief among them.” …well, I think the fact that such incomprehensible concepts can’t be explained by science is absolutely fine; certainly not a reason to substitute theism/deism as an explanation (although deism would be far more rational than theism).

    I’d have thought that a sensible person wouldn’t be CERTAIN that AGW is in no way possible. Yet remain agnostic about “the meaning of life” (why does it have to have some kind of narrative meaning btw?…is being demonstrably alive not enough?).
    Also, AGW isn’t a philosophical position, unlike religious faith…so I still think that it’s a bogus smear.
    To me, it’s like claiming that people having ‘faith’ in their doctor being correct (most of the time) is in some way a religion. 🙄

    I know why it gets coined & used…because, among ‘lay people’ (you see what I did there) I think the debate is ideological in nature, and those against have identified the discomfort which labelling those opposite as ‘religious’ causes; as they have used ‘faith’ as a smear (conventionally) against the actually religious (who are most likely to occupy the anti side of the debate).

    Or something like that. 😯

    Apologies for your having had to mention you in this context several times now, but el manbearpig insists upon using you as a yardstick.

  88. December 15, 2013 6:58 pm

    “#dog cannot be proven to exist by `botherers`, atheists cannot prove dog doesn`t, (not_100%) so this could be called `grey` ”

    I really loathe that type of reasoning.

    Doesn’t that just mean that I could claim all manner of obscure crap to be so…& it would therefore be implausibly valid, simply because no one can disprove something vague which has strings attached which are unverifiable by ‘the living’.

  89. December 15, 2013 7:01 pm

    I concede that (out of luck & flagsturbation on the part of the home crowd) England are pretty well rooted.

    Mitch Mitchell looks like a fuckwit with that thing growing under his nose. It isn’t scary.
    Super slo-mo makes them look like total morons when it lingers over their victory dances & all round egomanias.

  90. December 15, 2013 7:03 pm

    * Apologies for your having had to mention you in this context…

  91. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:05 pm

    “I think the fact that such incomprehensible concepts can’t be explained by science is absolutely fine; certainly not a reason to substitute theism/deism as an explanation (although deism would be far more rational than theism).”

    I think that’s the difference between you as an atheist and me as an agnostic: You deny theism as a possibility. I do not.

  92. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:09 pm

    And I think it’s fine to deride “believers” of AGW who substitute faith for facts when the whole concept (hypothesis, theory, whatever) is supposed to be purely about “the science”.

  93. December 15, 2013 7:14 pm

    Well Dunny, sorry to offend your `reasoning` knee-bone, just thought l would step you thru how l find team-junk-science is more `dishonest` than team-dog. 🙂

    “meaning of life` ` lsn`t that part of high-minded dog-theory.?

  94. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:15 pm

    ‘“the meaning of life” (why does it have to have some kind of narrative meaning btw?…is being demonstrably alive not enough?).’

    The very reason I put it in inverted commas. I could have said “Is there a God”, or “How did we get here” or something such. I blame Monty Python for ingraining the phrase in popular culture.

  95. December 15, 2013 7:16 pm

    Hmmmm, yes it is the difference, but deism is (as improbable as I consider it to be) a more logical conclusion than theism (which predicates itself upon an intrusive creator obsessed with the trivialities of individual humans day to day lives, and prides itself upon adherence to extremely dubious, obviously man made rituals & texts which claim to know the mind of ‘god’).

    At least deism has the ‘creator’ make shit & then just step away & ignore it, rather than being fixated upon humanity.
    I see no need to list umpteen examples of theists claiming positive happenings as acts of god, or negative ones as divine punishment; while ignoring the more ambiguous things which don’t fit their simplistic outlook. That’s just people talking shit.

    I also think that, although I concede that deism is (barely) logically defensible, I am still an atheist. I see no need to make a Pascal’s wager.

  96. December 15, 2013 7:19 pm

    It’s fine to deride each & everyone. Go your hardest. I just think the religion angle is misrepresentative.

    BTW, you know how you got here. It’s a little gory, and not the way most of us like to think of our mother…but entirely biological.

  97. December 15, 2013 7:20 pm

    So lpad`osy, you`re on team junk-science with el`manbearpig.?

    “meaning of life“ there is none, life is just a bunch of stuff that happens.

  98. December 15, 2013 7:23 pm

    I’m not offended, rebag. 🙂

    I’ve just encountered the ‘You Can’t Prove God Isn’t Real’ rearguard defense many times & I think it’s a deflective red herring.

    I understand that you were using it a different way & I didn’t mean to sound as abrupt as my words appear on reread.

  99. December 15, 2013 7:25 pm

    I thought the guys intestinal explosion in the restaurant was awesome (explicit gore is what I’ve always craved). Also, being chased off a cliff into a coffin in such a manner was splendid. Liked the angels at the end too.

  100. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:32 pm

    “So lpad`osy, you`re on team junk-science with el`manbearpig.? ”

    Yes, although I do concede that CO2 can influence temperatures (whereas I don’t think el gordo does), but where I differ with AGW zealots is on the degree of influence, and the prominence it is given in certain circles over all other natural influences. And I certainly do deny the catastrophism used to try and scare the population into submission. That’s where similarities to religion comes in.

  101. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:34 pm

    Mr Creosote.

  102. December 15, 2013 7:36 pm

    I think both sides tend to overstate their claims.

    It makes it difficult to take either seriously at times.

    I think AGW has done its cause harm by making wild, deliberately emotive claims as (what I imagine they see as) a means to an end.

    I am equally wary of the ideological polarity & suspected vested interests of the anti side.

  103. December 15, 2013 7:37 pm

    Haha, yes.

  104. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:45 pm

    Yes they are. By the way, Megyn Kelly is a white right-wing woman with her own (Fox) TV show. She must be Palinised by the left, immediately.

  105. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:48 pm

    ‘And I think it’s fine to deride “believers” of AGW who substitute faith for facts when the whole concept (hypothesis, theory, whatever) is supposed to be purely about “the science”.

    Hear Hear!

  106. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 7:55 pm

    ‘Yes, although I do concede that CO2 can influence temperatures (whereas I don’t think el gordo does)’

    That’s correct, its undetectable, so in my book there is a negligible association between temperatures and a particular harmless trace gas. I wouldn’t mind being proved wrong, as we are are heading into a mini ice age.

  107. December 15, 2013 7:57 pm

    The ignorant stupidity of Megyn Kelly’s assertions that Jesus was a white man (let alone the kind of thinking which making such assertions implies) is a great illustration of how little she has really thought about something which she presumably ‘believes’ in.
    It also shines a light on how white, rightwing muricans view the world they live in (ie. it doesn’t extend into the lands of the brown people beyond their borders). Hilarious, that they would deride Mormonism…when it’s just a progression of their own anglocentric revisionism.

    She should be Palinised by thinking people everywhere. Left, right or upside down.

  108. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:00 pm

    ‘Hmmmm, yes it is the difference, but deism is (as improbable as I consider it to be) a more logical conclusion than theism (which predicates itself upon an intrusive creator obsessed with the trivialities of individual humans day to day lives, and prides itself upon adherence to extremely dubious, obviously man made rituals & texts which claim to know the mind of ‘god’).’

    In my quiet moments of reflection, I usually don’t make the distinction. My quandry is usually about whether there is some (any) kind of supernatural force which might explain the inexplicable.

  109. December 15, 2013 8:00 pm

    l can`t be on team junk-science because, l would need to believe all the worlds shellfish industry`s are pouring acid by the tonne into their fisheries to prop-up team-gore while going broke too.

  110. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:01 pm

    “The ignorant stupidity of Megyn Kelly’s assertions that Jesus was a white man”

    What “colour” was he?

  111. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:05 pm

    “all the worlds shellfish industry`s are pouring acid by the tonne into their fisheries”

    Thanks for vindicating my decision to ignore most of your rants. (And I’m normally more polite. But that’s just irrelevant crap.)

  112. December 15, 2013 8:22 pm

    Well lpad`osy, team junk-science deny pollution causes acidification of the oceans. So if it isn`t happening by transfer from air to water, which you can do yourself, (litmus paper, beer-gas at pub) then it deduces the worlds fisheries are colluding and polluting (as_above) ls there another way.?

  113. December 15, 2013 8:23 pm

    ” I usually don’t make the distinction.”

    But there is a distinction. I get what you mean though.

    “What “colour” was he?”

    ‘Was’ he, at all? If he was , then wouldn’t it be most likely that he was found where supposed evidence of his existence claims he was from? Was that not the Middle East, or thereabouts? Was he not also immaculately conceived from the union of a magic sky wizard & a human virgin born there? If so, what ‘skin pigmentation’ would we expect from a native? Olive Drab? Alabaster? A couple of thousand years ago mind.

  114. TB Queensland permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:24 pm

    No, being agnostic is safe but this issue is black and white, and like religion it requires faith in the proponents of AGW.

    Not true … its NOT like religion (you see it that way) agnosticim in this case is a valid position … scientist have been wrong and they have been right … the world is actually a sphere …

    He now thinks it is unlikely anything exists beyond the grave – and hence has lost all fear of death – but he CAN’T BE CERTAIN. There are still too many things he thinks can’t be explained by science: infinity of time and space, chief among them.

    Well done, IPA … the third person amuses me tho’ … 😉

    Amazed at (and really admire) your candid post …

  115. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:33 pm

    “‘Was’ he, at all? If he was , then wouldn’t it be most likely that he was found where supposed evidence of his existence claims he was from? Was that not the Middle East, or thereabouts?”

    Yeah, stoopid Megyn Kelly being so sure about something we can’t really know for sure.

    Oh, wait … 😉

  116. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:34 pm

    Thanks TB. I think. 😕

  117. December 15, 2013 8:43 pm

    Yeah, I’m sure jesus was white. 🙄 …Megyn is sure too. The bible must be lying about the whereabouts of its happenstances; hey, maybe it isn’t even The Word Of God. 😯

    It’s all so confusing. How did I ever think that Jesus & Santa were anything other than ‘white’ men, that just wouldn’t make sense.

  118. TB Queensland permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:48 pm

    Thanks TB. I think.

    I think? … LOL … here’s a clue … (and really admire)

    You must have had a giggle at some of my posts … 😉

  119. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:49 pm

    It is usually “the left” (and I know there are no leftists here, because you non-rightists tell me so), that obsesses about an individual’s race and colour. It is collectivist tradition to classify someone as a member of a group rather than as an individual.

  120. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:51 pm

    ‘What “colour” was he?’

    Slightly swarthy.

  121. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:51 pm

    “You must have had a giggle at some of my posts …”

    Yep.

  122. December 15, 2013 8:51 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘Thanks for vindicating my decision to ignore most of your rants. (And I’m normally more polite. But that’s just irrelevant crap.)’ ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘

    The teabags are quite tetchy this time of year. Even stating an opinion to the thread and not directed at them seems to unhinge them.

  123. egg permalink
    December 15, 2013 8:59 pm

    The acidification thingy is just crap.

  124. December 15, 2013 9:05 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘It is usually “the left” (and I know there are no leftists here, because you non-rightists tell me so),’ ‘ ‘ ‘

    Guffaw. But can you accept that maybe many here are critical of both sides lpad`osy.? ls it more a reflection of `your` thought process only seeing left/right.?

  125. December 15, 2013 9:08 pm

    See lpad`osy, feed them, they will come.
    Feeding time was 8:59. 😆

  126. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:12 pm

    “But can you accept that maybe many here are critical of both sides lpad`osy.?”

    Many? No. Some, maybe. But definitely not you, Reheated Teabag. (I think your nom de plume is the giveaway, as well as your obsession with “teabags”.)

  127. December 15, 2013 9:16 pm

    So what Megyn Kelly said wasn’t borne by pure ignorance & self centred insularity? Ok then.

    Apart from strange attempts to make it about the left, I’m pretty sure you ‘get it’. And I doubt that you think jesus was ‘white’. Remembering of course that she actually said it, not me.

  128. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:24 pm

    Personally, I don’t know or care what “colour” Jesus was. Megyn Kelly was responding to a leftist writer in Slate who called for Santa to be black. So far, I’ve never seen a black Santa. Although I reckon I’ve seen a painting of a black Jesus.

  129. December 15, 2013 9:27 pm

    ‘ ‘ ‘ ‘your obsession with “teabags”’ ‘ ‘ ‘
    Fascinating.
    l am pretty sure, being obsessed with teabags and all, l didn`t bring up teabag-leader Palin, and l didn`t bring-up teabag-media goof-up Kelly either.

    Take a guess who did lpad`osy.

  130. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:29 pm

    “Take a guess who did lpad`osy.”

    I think it was toilet-somethingorother, as it happens.

  131. December 15, 2013 9:34 pm

    Hey Dunny, is the Fox crap Aussies subscribe to on `pay`tv the same as what teh-yanks get.? Or is it an `Aussie` version.?

  132. December 15, 2013 9:49 pm

    No, as it happens, it was the person who said this…”Yes they are. By the way, Megyn Kelly is a white right-wing woman with her own (Fox) TV show. She must be Palinised by the left, immediately.”

    I posted a link to Hannity (the loose unit), as it happens. 😉

    BTW, I couldn’t give two squirts about what colour a myth man from a couple of thousand years ago was either. But I wasn’t the FoxtardNews icon making ill considered, grandiose claims which would be extremely likely to be incorrect.

    * I may have commented on it on a different thread days ago (?)

  133. December 15, 2013 9:52 pm

    I haven’t had any subscription TV for a few years, but the FoxNews which comes with Foxtel/Austar was the same model of sensationalist partisan dogvomit that the muricans lap up in their droves.
    The Foxtard crew sure knows how to play to their base.

    They are slightly ‘left’ of Glenn Beck though, apparently.

  134. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:57 pm

    “*I may have commented on it on a different thread days ago (?)”

    Yes you did. If I responded on the wrong thread, then I apologise to the thread police. I brought it up on this thread (wrong one, as it turns out) because of your link/comment.

  135. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 9:59 pm

    “The Foxtard crew sure knows how to play to their base.”

    About half the US population, as it turns out. Stoopid Rupert!

  136. December 15, 2013 10:13 pm

    Very shrewd, Rupert.

    And all I meant was that I didn’t bring up Kelly today. 😉 I’m not thread police, by any stretch.
    None of it surprises me, when it comes to FoxNews. I am familiar with what level of ‘analysis’ to expect from it.
    O’Reilly is another one of their notorious loose units. They love yelling people down & putting words into the mouths of their targets ‘special guests’.

    I never said it wasn’t a great business strategy, perfect for the targeted demographic in fact. I also don’t doubt that a vast majority of its loyal viewers are even more sure than Megyn that jeebus was a white man. They’ve probably never had call to think beyond the pictures of white jesus they grew up with. Doesn’t make it any less ignorant though.

  137. December 15, 2013 10:16 pm

    And I’m not a fkn collectivist! 😆

  138. IPA permalink
    December 15, 2013 10:23 pm

    I’d still like to know whether people of Semite ancestory (which is what Jesus supposedly was) consider themselves to be “white” or something else.

  139. December 15, 2013 10:28 pm

    Limited-News in print or moving pictures is very underwhelming. lpad`osy is over-stating Foxtards numbers big-time, l don`t have them at hand at the moment, but l will re-feed him the correct numbers in the not too distant future. From the Foxtard clips l`ve seen on other shows and the web, it just not to my taste, hysteric screeching, overpaid buffoons, they are just too Left-wing for me.

  140. December 15, 2013 10:29 pm

    Jeeeeeez…

    Pretty sure the semites of 2000+ years ago didn’t appear, errrrrr…anglo. But it depends upon how you want to twist the definition of ‘white’.

    I better go to bed. I hate early starts. спокойной ночи

  141. Meta permalink
    December 16, 2013 1:30 am

    (Um, Jesus was a Red. Or, was that Judas?)

  142. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 7:46 am

    Jesus was a Jewish Liberal and the religious establishment thought he was telling porkies and should be put down.

    On another thread I mentioned the Christian gospels were written around 70 AD and relied on word of mouth up to that point. It was a bit of a stretch and you can imagine over that time that exaggeration may have crept in, but on further reading i discovered that jesus was crucified in 33 AD, so its feasible that the oral history had validity.

    Its generally believed Jesus looked like Alexander the Great, at least thats who the artists supposedly modelled him on.

  143. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 9:03 am

    Half the US covered in snow, authorities blame an increase in carbon dioxide.

  144. Jherek Jagged permalink
    December 16, 2013 9:18 am

    authorities blame an increase in carbon dioxide.

    Can you explain your issue with that?

  145. Splatterbottom permalink
    December 16, 2013 10:16 am

    One way to test a theory is to make predictions based on that theory and check the results.

    In the last 15 years there has been a significant in crease in CO2 but no increase in temperature. Clearly the climate models which predicted a temperature rise got it wrong.
    Also, it has been significantly hotter in the past at times when the CO2 levels were much lower. Clearly there are other forces at work. A little scepticism is warranted.

    The fact that the methods adopted by many climate “scientists” are not scientific doesn’t instill much confidence either.

  146. Jherek Jagged permalink
    December 16, 2013 10:23 am

    Splatterbottom, some reading for you. You are welcome.

    http://www.skepticalscience.com/no-warming-in-16-years.htm

  147. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 10:39 am

    JJ reaches for his bible.

  148. Jherek Jagged permalink
    December 16, 2013 10:44 am

    JJ reaches for his bible.

    Be fair egg, that “bible” is at least written by scientists. Your Bible is cherry picked by a weatherman.

  149. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 10:46 am

    ** chuckle **

    Welcome back JJ.

  150. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 11:33 am

    A wayward jet stream produces extremes in weather, which is what we would expect sliding into a mini ice age.

    http://arctic-news.blogspot.com.au/2012/12/polar-jet-stream-appears-hugely-deformed.html

  151. Splatterbottom permalink
    December 16, 2013 1:18 pm

    “Be fair egg, that “bible” is at least written by scientists.”

    John “97%” Cook, the owner of that website is a considerable idiot, especially after his role in the Lewenadowsky scam, not to mention his discredited paper purporting to show a 97% consensus of scientists supporting the AGW hypothesis. See here for an analysis of Cook’s statistical acumen.

    As to the particular SkS link – “the ocean ate my homework” does not really cut it, nor does any of the other special pleading. The fact is that the climate models (which are supposed to take all factors into account) have failed utterly to explain the last 15 years.

    A truly sceptical website would show some curiosity about that fact, and many other issues in the climate science debate. Skeptical Science is not in the least bit sceptical. It is completely doctrinaire. You can easily predict the view it will take on any issue – the IPCC party line.

    Surely after years of idiotic predictions from “scientists” like Flannery, the fact that English children still know what snow looks like, or that there is ice at the North Pole, or that polar bears have not gone extinct (in fact there are more of them now), or that the dams are full, not empty, might give even the most rabid alarmist pause for thought. Sadly any form of rational thought seems to be completely beyond them.

  152. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 4:38 pm

    Splatter is correct.

  153. December 16, 2013 5:07 pm

    Enter the Ginger was awesome, meta. Great find!

  154. December 16, 2013 5:11 pm

    Was lucky enough to see Minchin’s Judas, live in the flesh, earlier in the year.

    I get where you’re coming from with the ommmmmm, too. I understand that plenty is ‘unknowable’…I just wouldn’t fill the gaps in the framework of ‘knowable’ stuff with spirituality; that’s just me.

  155. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 7:23 pm

    There is a theory going around that Jesus was an avatar and Mary (the mother of dog) was a breeder of the right age.

    Not sure why they would want to start a new religion, Christianity brought nothing but misery.

    Googling around, it was roughly 40 years from the time of his death to when the gospels were being written. Its not a long time, so some of the anecdotal evidence maybe sound.

    We could start with walking on water.

  156. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 7:28 pm

    Or the star of Bethlehem.

  157. egg permalink
    December 16, 2013 8:10 pm

    ‘… the star was a pious fiction created by the author of the Gospel of Matthew.’

    Wiki

  158. egg permalink
    December 17, 2013 7:47 am

    ‘Fox News’ Megyn Kelly was roundly trashed this week for insisting that both Santa and Jesus are white. On Friday, Kelly defended herself at length, saying that she had fallen victim to a bunch of “race-baiting” Fox News haters who couldn’t take a joke.

    ‘She said that her telling “kids” that Santa “just is white” was a “tongue-in-cheek” attempt at humor, though many regarded it as a bizarre effort to negate the fact that Santa is not, in fact, “just” white, but is often depicted as one of a variety of different races.’

    Huffpo

  159. IPA permalink
    December 17, 2013 9:52 am

    Bill Gates on The Bet

  160. IPA permalink
    December 17, 2013 10:06 am

    Irrefutable Proof that Santa is Odin.

  161. egg permalink
    December 17, 2013 10:55 am

    ‘It’s a shame that extreme views get more attention and more of a following than nuanced views. We see this dynamic clearly when the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change does its best to be clear and impartial in conveying what is known on the key issues, but both liberals and conservatives make it hard for the public to understand the panel’s nuanced conclusions.’

    Bill Gates has faith in the IPCC.

  162. egg permalink
    December 17, 2013 7:14 pm

    Luedecke and Weiss reckon they have found the mechanisms which explain climate change. If its confirmed then we should get a good idea of what’s coming.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/12/17/solar-amo-pdo-cycles-combined-reproduce-the-global-climate-of-the-past/#more-99397

  163. egg permalink
    December 18, 2013 7:23 am

    ‘Despite the new forecasts downgrading economic growth from the figures revealed in the pre-election fiscal outlook, Hockey said a repeal would be a boost to economic activity. “Abolishing the carbon tax is going to increase economic growth, no doubt about it,” the treasurer said.

    He said the costs associated with the repeal of the clean energy package were fully offset. “It won’t cost anything in the short term because it is fully offset with other savings,’ he said.’

    Murphy / Guardian

  164. egg permalink
    December 18, 2013 7:04 pm

    You may have heard that human induced CO2 hangs around for a couple of hundred years, its crap put out by the Klimatariat to increase the alarmism. In fact CO2 is swallowed up by the oceans within 20 years… peer reviewed.

  165. egg permalink
    December 18, 2013 8:54 pm

    Alarm has abated in the north, Arctic sea ice back to average.

  166. egg permalink
    December 19, 2013 9:23 pm

    Uh Oh, we are in trouble again according to this NOAA press release.

    ‘November 2013 global temperature highest on record

    ‘Year-to-date global temperature ties for fourth highest on record

    ‘The globally-averaged temperature for November 2013 was the highest for November since record keeping began in 1880. November 2013 also marks the 37th consecutive November and 345th consecutive month with a global temperature above the 20th century average.

    ‘Many areas of the world experienced higher-than-average monthly temperatures, including: much of Eurasia, coastal Africa, Central America, central South America, parts of the North Atlantic Ocean, the south west Pacific Ocean, and the Indian Ocean. Much of southern Russia, northwest Kazakhstan, south India, southern Madagascar, parts of the central and south Indian Ocean, and sections of the Pacific Ocean were record warm.

    ‘Meanwhile, northern Australia, parts of North America, south west Greenland, and parts of the Southern Ocean near South America were cooler than average. No regions of the globe were record cold.’

  167. egg permalink
    December 20, 2013 3:42 pm

    Discussions on the NOAA press release is mixed, but it appears this large warm spot close to the magnetic north pole is only natural.

  168. Walrus permalink
    December 20, 2013 4:29 pm

    “Alarm has abated in the north, Arctic sea ice back to average.”

    Well thank deity for that………………..deliveries can recommence immediately……….

    http://www.examiner.com/article/greenpeace-santa-tells-kids-he-s-canceling-christmas-shocking-video

  169. egg permalink
    December 20, 2013 5:43 pm

    Discovered this real time weather, which should give us a good view of the tipping point.

    http://earth.nullschool.net/

  170. egg permalink
    December 20, 2013 10:20 pm

    ‘2013 was the best of years for climate skeptics; the worst of years for climate change enthusiasts for whom any change – or absence of change — in the weather served as irrefutable proof of climate change.

    ‘The enthusiasts fell into disbelief that everyone didn’t pooh-pooh the failure of the climate models to perform as advertised. That governments and the public would abandon the duty to stop climate change was in their minds no more thinkable than Hell freezing over. Which the way things are going for them, may happen in 2014.’

    Lawrence Solomon / Financial Post

  171. December 20, 2013 11:14 pm

    Here we go Dumpty,

    Dustin was admitted to Baylor Grapevine on Nov. 25, placed on life support in the ICU, and strapped into a rotating bed that helps break up fluid in the lungs from pneumonia. At first, flu tests were inconclusive. “The second time they checked him, he came back positive for Influenza A, Influenza B,” Wright said. Dustin suffered kidney failure, which has been associated with severe cases of H1N1 Type A, or swine flu. He had no known underlying medical conditions. His case has many similarities to cases in Montgomery County that puzzled doctors this week. Of eight cases in that county, four patients have died. Wednesday afternoon, Montgomery County health officials said one surviving patient tested positive for H1N1.

    http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2013/12/19/north-texas-man-dies-from-progressive-type-of-swine-flu/

    The ol` junk-science hasn`t even dented the population of texas, still remaining irrelevant.

  172. egg permalink
    December 21, 2013 7:00 am

    Interview with Randy Olson in Spiegel.

    ‘The major problem with climate science, Olson seems to say, is that it is so damn boring: In the interview he describes papers on tree rings as “boredom so purified and crystalized it’s in an unadulterated form that could make even a robot want to commit suicide.”

    ‘Overall Olson thinks it’s over and it’s too late: “the brand has been ruined” and tha the only thing that could resuce it is that the story be told by “media people, professional storytellers, actors, etc.”

    ‘Not sure what Olson is getting at here. Haven’t movie distributors just made it clear that no one is interested in climate stories?

    ‘In summary the climate issue is boring people to death. As a result it’s going to be awfully damn tough to get people to listen to a dead-boring story for the hundredth time.’

    – See more at: http://notrickszone.com/#sthash.hgCGkUQw.dpuf

  173. egg permalink
    December 21, 2013 7:54 am

    ‘THE woes of Australia’s manufacturing operations are set to contribute to the nation meeting its commitment to cut greenhouse emissions by 5 per cent.

    ‘Analysis by The Weekend Australian suggests the move to suspend alumina production at the Northern Territory’s Gove refinery would add further to a trend for structural change to reduce the emissions intensity of the economy, while moves to abandon carmaking would be a small contributor.’

    Hepworth / Oz

  174. December 21, 2013 10:16 am

    1)Studies show that the world was warmer than it is today during the Roman Empire and when the Vikings were plundering Europe and North America. In fact, even in the 19th Century, there were discussions surrounding the fact that the Vikings could settle the northernmost reaches of Greenland and North America because there was less ice coverage.

    2)During the second week in December, the U.S. saw more than 2000 record low temperatures and record snowfalls, according to the National Weather Service and HamWeather records center. There were 606 record low temperatures, 1,234 low maximum temperatures and 285 record snowfalls across the country. In the meantime there were only 98 high temperature records and 141 high minimum temperature records.

    3)Satellite data shows that the polar bears have at least one reason to be happy this year – Arctic sea ice coverage was up 50 percent over last year’s record low coverage. Contrary to Al Gore’s prediction that there would be no polar ice cap by this year, sea ice coverage spanned nearly 2,100 cubic miles by the end of this year’s melting season, up from about 1,400 cubic last year

    4) Global cooling is on the way, according to an increasing number of scientists. German scientists have predicted that based on declining sunspot activity and natural climate oscillation the world will cool over the next century. Temperatures will eventually drop to levels corresponding with the “little ice age” of 1870.

    5) Other scientists have also been coming around to the global cooling side of things. The BBC reported that Professor Mike Lockwood of the Reading University predicts that at the current rate of decline in solar activity, another “Little Ice Age” could envelope Northern Europe.

    6) The United Nations climate bureaucracy’s latest global warming report was called “hilarious” by a leading scientist from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Dr. Richard Lindzen said the UN’s report “has truly sunk to level of hilarious incoherence” because they continue to proclaim with ever greater certainty that mankind is causing global warming, despite their models continually being wrong.
    “Their excuse for the absence of warming over the past 17 years is that the heat is hiding in the deep ocean,” Lindzen said. “However, this is simply an admission that the models fail to simulate the exchanges of heat between the surface layers and the deeper oceans.”

    7) The Senate testimony of Dr. Roger Pielke of the University of Colorado completely undercut environmentalists and Democrats trying to claim that global warming was causing “extreme weather.”

    “It is misleading and just plain incorrect to claim that disasters associated with hurricanes, tornadoes, floods or droughts have increased on climate timescales either in the United States or globally,” Pielke said. “It is further incorrect to associate the increasing costs of disasters with the emission of greenhouse gases.”

    The other witnesses on the panel did not refute Pielke’s data.

    http://dailycaller.com/2013/12/20/the-top-seven-global-warming-alarmist-setbacks-in-2013/#ixzz2o3lgzx14

  175. egg permalink
    December 21, 2013 10:52 am

    Global cooling causes extreme weather because the jet stream is naturally out of kilter. The mini ice age is not to be feared.

  176. egg permalink
    December 21, 2013 1:47 pm

    The wheels are falling off in the UK

    ‘By about 2020 it was assumed that expensive technologies such as wind farms and solar panels would be competitive against what would by then be much more expensive fossil fuels. Add in a bit of energy efficiency, and ministers could confidently predict that household energy bills would be 8 per cent lower by 2020 than they would have without their policies.

    ‘Almost everything that could be wrong with this is in fact wrong, and it explains the mess that British energy policy has got itself into. There is no shortage of oil, gas or coal. We are not running out of any of them. There is enough to fry the planet many times over. There is no reason to assume that oil and gas prices will go on ever upwards, and it is at least possible that they will fall, joining the sharp fall in world coal prices. If so, renewables are unlikely to become cost-competitive by 2020. The subsidies will not then wither away. They would be permanent. Therefore, bills would be higher than they would have been as a result of government policies, not lower as Mr Davey claims.’

    Dieter Helm / The Times (paywalled) via Bishop Hill

  177. egg permalink
    December 21, 2013 11:14 pm

    FIRST WORLD PROBLEM

    ‘Factories and businesses will be paid to turn out their lights between 4pm and 8pm under emergency measures designed to head off the threat of blackouts next winter.

    ‘They will be asked to save energy by halting production during the peak period for households if high demand caused by unusually harsh weather puts families at risk of being plunged into darkness.I

    ‘Industry watchdog Ofgem has decided the plan is necessary to ensure an adequate supply of electricity and prevent the lights going out in homes.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2526772/Firms-paid-turn-lights-Four-hour-curfew-save-Britain-blackouts.html#ixzz2o6vqo6iZ
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  178. December 22, 2013 12:36 am

    If only I wasn’t bound by a confidentiality agreement…I could tell a story about the spot market electricity price around the country in the last several days of temperature (& price) extremes- both ways…we’ve had from 40c to 16 in 24 hrs (+ 3/4 of an inch of rain).

    It’s enough to make a man extremely cynical.

  179. December 22, 2013 12:38 am

    * a preemptive FUCK YOU to those who think I’d have to be the CEO or a hereditary beneficiary to be privy to such information… (don’t know the emoticon for a middle finger salute)…

  180. December 22, 2013 1:19 am

    Guy gets a bad rap…

  181. December 22, 2013 1:20 am

    * about 8 mins onward…then go back & watch the start…

    ** If you dare… 😆

  182. December 23, 2013 8:45 pm

    thank-you for your pre-emptive mlm dunny, 🙂

  183. egg permalink
    December 23, 2013 9:19 pm

    ‘…we’ve had from 40c to 16 in 24 hrs (+ 3/4 of an inch of rain).’

    Global cooling is accompanied by extremes in weather because of the wayward jet stream. There is nothing we can do about climate change, being a natural phenomenon.

  184. egg permalink
    December 24, 2013 9:40 pm

    Damn! We missed the tipping point.

    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/12/22/england-temperatures-dropping-like-a-rock/

  185. egg permalink
    December 24, 2013 9:45 pm

    Same in the US.

    http://nextgrandminimum.wordpress.com/2013/12/22/us-temperatures-plummeting-over-the-last-15-years/

    It has all the excitement of being in a science fiction movie.

  186. egg permalink
    December 25, 2013 8:27 am

    First World Problem

    ‘It is absolutely choc-a-bloc and in the check-in room upstairs there are 50 people queuing for the one toilet that is working.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2528791/UK-weather-Nightmare-Christmas-flood-risk-families-told-flee-homes.html#ixzz2oQih2auI
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  187. egg permalink
    December 25, 2013 11:40 am

    ‘To those of us who have dared to question on scientific and economic grounds the official story on global warming, it is a continuing surprise that there is so little concern about whether or not that story is objectively true among the many who have swallowed it hook, Party Line and sinker.

    ‘For the true-believers, the Party Line is socially convenient, politically expedient, and financially profitable. Above all, it is the Party Line. For those who think as herds or hives, it is safe. It is a grimy security blanket. It is the dismal safety in numbers that is the hallmark of the unreasoning mob.

    ‘But is it true? The herd and the hive do not care. Or, rather, they do care. They care very much if anyone dares to ask the question “But is it true?” They are offended, shocked, outraged. They vent their venom and their spleen and their fury on those of us who ask, however politely, “But is it true?”

    Christopher Monckton of Brenchley at WUWT

  188. egg permalink
    December 25, 2013 6:37 pm

    ‘The central reason why what Professor Niklas Mörner has called “the greatest lie ever told” is damaging to civilization arises not from the staggering cost, soon to be $1 billion a day worldwide.

    ‘Not from the direct threat to the West posed by the avowedly anti-democratic, anti-libertarian policies of the UN, the IPCC, and the costly alphabet-soup of unelected busybody agencies of predatory government that live off the taxpayer’s involuntary generosity. Not from the dire environmental damage caused by windmills and other equally medieval measures intended to make non-existent global warming go away.

    ‘The damage caused by the Great Lie arises from the fact that just about the entire global governing class has found it expedient or convenient or profitable to adopt the Great Lie, to peddle it, to parade it, to parrot it, to pass it on, regardless of whether anything that it says on the subject of the climate has any truth in it whatsoever.’

    Christopher Monckton

  189. egg permalink
    December 25, 2013 6:54 pm

    Some of you may think this is just weather, but in fact its a climate change signal.

    ‘Across north and northwest France, about 90,000 homes lost electricity, said French utility ERDF, and air and rail traffic was disrupted in the Brittany and Normandy regions.

    ‘The Met Office, Britain’s national forecaster, issued amber warnings for rain – the second-most-severe level – for much of the southern half of England and Wales.

    ‘In all, the French weather service has put 23 departments on orange alert – its second-highest level – for high winds and waves.’

    Oz

  190. egg permalink
    December 26, 2013 11:44 am

    A witty intelligent friend is visiting and I respect his views, like my comrades here. We talk politics and laugh a lot, but then the subject of climate change raised its ugly head and he’s certain Abbott won’t risk a double D election because the government would lose.

    I made the point that it would be better for Abbott to die on his feet with a double D than be slaughtered on his knees a little later.

  191. egg permalink
    December 26, 2013 7:22 pm

    Science Ship Stuck

    South Pole Getting Colder

    http://c3headlines.typepad.com/.a/6a010536b58035970c019b034e608b970c-pi

    CO2 Fails to Lift Temps

  192. egg permalink
    December 27, 2013 10:15 am

    ** chuckle **

  193. egg permalink
    December 27, 2013 12:06 pm

    ‘More than 100,000 families are bracing for severe flooding today as downpours and violent winds cause chaos across the country.

    ‘Torrential conditions have ruined Christmas for many – and the rain is set to continue into the new year.

    ‘A fresh storm hit last night and experts expect 90mph winds, rain, snow and temperatures below freezing today.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2529433/More-Christmas-misery-ANOTHER-storm-set-batter-Britain-tonight-thousands-remain-without-power.html#ixzz2odIUAqt7
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  194. egg permalink
    December 27, 2013 5:17 pm

    ‘So whatever excuses or wordsmithing Spiegel tries to employ to save face from having been a grand believer of the AGW dogma since the very start, two things are clear: 1) the warming has definitely stopped, and 2) natural factors are really much more important than assumed and that the skeptics were right all along.

    It’s time to completely revamp the models so that they start to resemble reality. It’s also time for the media to rethink their position on the issue rather than trying to hopelessly prop it up.’

    – See more at: http://notrickszone.com/#sthash.guxTt0x3.dpuf

  195. egg permalink
    December 27, 2013 9:15 pm

    ‘In 1901, the year of Federation, Australia was the richest country in the world per capita.
    The Pioneer generations, with freedom to explore and invest, had developed valuable mineral assets – gold, silver, lead, zinc, copper, coal, tin and iron. And they had bred up large numbers of sheep and cattle on our native grasslands.

    ‘Energy was abundant – wood, horse power, kerosene, gas, hydro and coal powered electricity – we were among world leaders in cheap energy. Sydney had gas lights in its streets as far back as 1820.’

    Viv Forbes / WUWT

  196. egg permalink
    December 28, 2013 9:02 am

    ‘VOTER support for Tony Abbott’s Coalition has slumped in Western Australia since the election and a dramatic rise for Labor and independents will threaten the Liberal hold on three Senate seats and the ability to repeal the carbon tax if the High Court orders a new Senate election in the state next year.

    ‘According to the latest Newspoll analysis of state-by-state and demographic voting support in the past three months, conducted exclusively for The Weekend Australian, the Abbott government’s first 100 days have ended with a drop in Western Australia of 10 percentage points from its election primary vote of 51.2 per cent to 41 per cent.’

    Shanahan / Oz

  197. egg permalink
    December 28, 2013 1:59 pm

    ‘The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) set climate research back thirty years, mostly by focusing world attention on CO2 and higher temperature. It was a classic misdirection that required planning. The IPCC was created for this purpose and pursued it relentlessly. Through the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) they controlled national weather offices so global climate policies and research funding were similarly directed.’

    Dr Tim Ball / WUWT

  198. egg permalink
    December 28, 2013 6:42 pm

    Chinese Airlift Mooted for Deluded Scientists

    ‘Professor Turney says the hundreds of thousands of measurements made by Mawson have become critical to charting signs of global warming.’

    ABC

  199. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 12:28 pm

    From a 2001 paper by Shindell et al, including Mike Mann and Gavin Schmidt, bloody turncoats.

    ‘We examine the climate response to solar irradiance changes between the late 17th-century Maunder Minimum and the late 18th century. Global average temperature changes are small (about 0.3° to 0.4°C) in both a climate model and empirical reconstructions. However, regional temperature changes are quite large.

    ‘In the model, these occur primarily through a forced shift toward the low index state of the Arctic Oscillation/North Atlantic Oscillation as solar irradiance decreases. This leads to colder temperatures over the Northern Hemisphere continents, especially in winter (1° to 2°C), in agreement with historical records and proxy data for surface temperatures.’

  200. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 12:35 pm

    Yep, the North Atlantic Oscilliation (NAO) is directly influenced by the sun’s behaviour and when it dips below the line in winter …. snow can be expected.

    http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/nao_index.html

  201. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 2:49 pm

    Chinese rescue ship now stuck in ice.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2013/12/27/world/antarctica-ship-stuck/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

  202. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 2:58 pm

    Not exactly …

    ‘China’s Snow Dragon icebreaker, which came within six-and-a-half nautical miles of the stuck ship before turning back out of safety fears, is standing by in case its helicopter will be needed.’

    AAP

  203. December 29, 2013 5:07 pm

    The Global Cooling has kicked in, and Queensland is `snowed-in` today.

  204. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 5:49 pm

    Its summer in Antarctica and the sea ice is 3 meters thick, which should eventually lead to increasing glacial mass balance and icebergs.

  205. December 29, 2013 6:50 pm

    Antarctica has nothing to worry about.
    Icebergs are forming off Brisbane.
    Penguins arriving in plague proportions.

  206. TB Queensland permalink
    December 29, 2013 7:12 pm

    The teabag has definitely got the “bags” mixed up ….

  207. egg permalink
    December 29, 2013 7:40 pm

    The lad’s smokin’ tea.

  208. TB Queensland permalink
    December 29, 2013 8:09 pm

    So WTF’s he drinkin’?

    Just slurrin’ …

  209. egg permalink
    December 30, 2013 8:11 am

    ‘The NSW government will order councils to study the scientific evidence for sea-level rise on a beach-by-beach basis, amid fears that many local authorities may be undermining property values by imposing punitive planning conditions based on predictions contained in reports of the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

    ‘The Great Lakes Council on the mid-north coast has told one home owner who wants to extend his house that, while it may be approved, he may have to demolish it in coming decades and restore the whole site to its natural state pre-settlement.

    ‘The council is relying on the IPCC model that predicts sea-level rise at nearly 10 times the actual rate recorded in recent decades – 40cm by 2050 – compared with just more than 4cm, based on a projection of the recent historical record.’

    Higgins / Oz

  210. egg permalink
    December 30, 2013 12:53 pm

    Aurora Australis to the rescue.

    http://www.antarctica.gov.au/webcams/aurora

    The bay was ice free when Mawson was there in 1912 and these clowns are out to prove global warming is real. The irony burns.

  211. egg permalink
    December 30, 2013 5:31 pm

    ‘The Aurora Australis has abandoned its first attempt to cut through the ice surrounding the stranded Akademik Shokalskiy in Antarctica after moving just two nautical miles.

    ‘About 6am, the Aurora’s captain, Murray Doyle, began to manoeuvre the icebreaker through thick wedges of consolidated sea ice.

    ‘But by 9am [midday Sydney time], the master made the call to turn the ship around and move back into open water.’

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/aurora-australis-abandons-attempt-to-save-akademik-shokalskiy-in-antarctica-20131230-302na.html#ixzz2owADORe6

  212. egg permalink
    December 30, 2013 9:11 pm

    NOOZE BEFORE IT HAPPENS

    There is more than a distinct possibility that the old Russian ship will be abandoned unless there is a change in the weather.

    Its a hull construction of carbon steel, which becomes brittle and collapses like ceramics if its too cold for too long.

    Also the Australian ship can only break through 1.5 meters and its 4m around the Russian vessel. The prognosis looks grim, yet the MSM fails to see the irony in this folly.

  213. egg permalink
    December 30, 2013 9:41 pm

    guffaw

  214. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 7:30 am

    ‘THE unprecedented cost of energy driven by the renewable energy target and the carbon tax had destroyed the nation’s competitiveness, Tony Abbott’s chief business adviser has declared. Maurice Newman also says climate change policies driven by “scientific delusion” have been a major factor in the collapse of Australia’s manufacturing sector.

    “The Australian dollar and industrial relations policies are blamed,” Mr Newman said. “But, for some manufacturers, the strong dollar has been a benefit, while high relative wages have long been a feature of the Australian industrial landscape.”

    Graham Lloyd / Oz

  215. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 8:07 am

    Antarctic Folly

    ‘… with such a fantastic failure in full world view, questions are going to start being asked. For example, with advanced tools at their disposal (that Mawson never had) such as near real-time satellite imaging of Antarctic sea ice, GPS navigation, on-board Internet, radar, and satellite communications, one wonders how these folks managed to get themselves stuck at all.

    ‘Was it simple incompetence of ignoring the signs and data at their disposal combined with “full steam ahead” fever? Even the captain of the Aurora Australis had the good sense to turn back knowing he’d reached the limits of the ship on his rescue attempt. Or, was it some sort of publicity stunt to draw attention? If it was the latter, it has backfired mightily.’

    Anthony watts

  216. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 10:27 am

    Maurice Newman will point to Rio Tinto refinery (going to Vietnam) as a good example of how Julia distorted the free market.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-12-19/rio-tinto-gove-refinery-to-close-in-july/5167992

  217. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 12:28 pm

    Snowmageddon Beckons

    http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/nao_index.html

    The UK should brace itself for another bout of freezing wintery weather, like in days of yore.

  218. Splatterbottom permalink
    December 31, 2013 1:51 pm

    This is too funny for words, egg. Another climate change publicity stunt gone wrong. Nature seems to love making fools of these retards. Remember this lunatic?

    Sooner or later these idiot “scientists” will admit that their models completely failed and that there is no catastrophic warming. At the same time they will claim credit for averting the disaster by encouraging people to do enough to stave off the calamity with things like the Australian carbon tax. Julia Gillard will be acknowledged as the saviour of the planet.

  219. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 2:01 pm

    The MSM don’t see the irony.

  220. Dianne permalink
    December 31, 2013 2:17 pm

    Egg when are we going to see a White Christmas in Oz?

    You seem to combat the idea of global warming by predicting global cooling. Brrrrr.

    You can’t argue against climate change if you keep pointing to the world cooling. Isn’t that climate change on a different thermostat setting?

    You must be pleased with all this attention.

    Anyway I have been convinced. Climate change is happening.

    The denialists seem quite nutty. I wouldn’t approach one without a stick.

  221. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 3:09 pm

    My global cooling meme has legs, while global warming is so last century.

    Climate change on this blue planet has been operating successfully for a long time and was a major factor in turning apes into homo sapiens.

  222. Dianne permalink
    December 31, 2013 3:16 pm

    Some of us are still in transition I have observed.

  223. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 3:25 pm

    At last the MSM is onto the irony.

    ‘The website Newsbusters said much of the media has bent over backward to avoid linking the ship’s current fate with its mission.

    “Somewhere far, far to the south where it is summer, a group of global warming scientists are trapped in the Antarctic ice,” read a post on the site. “If you missed the irony of that situation, it is because much of the mainstream media has glossed over that rather inconvenient bit of hilarity.”

    FoxNews

    Enjoy your transition, but you’ll miss all the fun.

  224. Dianne permalink
    December 31, 2013 3:40 pm

    egg – I have made the crossing. I am talking about the ape-to-human journey. Some of us are yet to reach our destination according to my cruel eye.

    On that note an excellent segue opportunity has presented itself…..

    I read in one of the London papers this very day that Republicans in the US are more inclined than ever before to reject the theory of evolution. There is a fair chance that they would deny climate change as well.

    I would ask a question but you would probably respond.

  225. Dianne permalink
    December 31, 2013 3:43 pm

    Btw – a comment from Fox News. Really!

  226. December 31, 2013 5:20 pm

    ””””””””””I am talking about the ape-to-human journey. Some of us are yet to reach our destination according to my cruel eye.””””””””

    l would go further Dianne, since we tumbled out of the tree-tops, as a species we have failed to truly move to a higher/better culture, but still at our core, we operate under primitive primate culture, where `might-is-right` and the most strong beat-up the less strong. The strongest then get to eat first, the better fruit, decides who eats next, and shag the local females. This is still our culture at the core, no matter how much we surround it with distractions and technology.

  227. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 6:09 pm

    ‘I would ask a question but you would probably respond.’

    I’m starved of intelligent questioning.

  228. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 7:34 pm

    ‘Republicans in the US are more inclined than ever before to reject the theory of evolution. There is a fair chance that they would deny climate change as well.’

    Darwin’s theory of evolution is the null hypothesis, until a better idea comes along. There is an outside chance that we have been intelligently designed.

    Conservatives in the US and Australia are more inclined to see global warming as a monstrous left wing scam and, on the available evidence, they are correct in their assumption.

  229. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 7:49 pm

    ‘The passengers are expected to be rescued by helicopter in groups of 12 and will be initially transported to the Xue Long. The Aurora Australis will then use its barge to transfer all 52 passengers on board their vessel. The barge can take up to 22 people at a time.

    ‘RCC Australia continues to coordinate the incident and is in regular contact with all vessels involved and continues to monitor the situation. The vessels involved are also in close contact with each other via VHF radio.’

    ASMA (press release)

  230. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 7:58 pm

    ‘All 52 passengers will be evacuated, but the crew on the Akademik Shokalskiy will stay behind with the ship and wait for the ice to break up naturally, expedition spokesman Alvin Stone said.’

    AP

  231. Dianne permalink
    December 31, 2013 8:32 pm

    Happy new year Primate. Alas you are correct. Without the assistance of all the waxing studios which abound these days, some of us would more closely approximate what we are.

    Egg – Conservatives, who are increasingly nutty these days, see everything as degenerately left-wing. Peppa Pig, teachers, our ABC, plain packaging, public anything, the Pope, red ties, Nemo, farmers, lattes, Chardonnay, cafes.

    The right-wing have become the neo-Maoists waging cultural war.

    The Liberal Party is the party of choice for radicals.

  232. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 8:59 pm

    The right has become radicalised, never thought I would see the day, but its true.

    The Culture Wars is just a meme and should pass into history fairly quickly. Its too broad a brush to look at Conservatives as a block, anymore than the left is a complete unit. There are factions.

    My colleagues here already know I’m from Labor’s left wing, told them often enough, so finding myself hanging out with a radical Coalition is rather refreshing. They are not neo-Marxists, but will probably move towards an agrarian socialism while maintaining a free market.

    Ultimately, the real cultures of Australia and China (neo-Lenists) need to gel and how that will turn out is anyone’s guess.

  233. egg permalink
    December 31, 2013 10:11 pm

    Antarctic sea ice continues to grow.

    http://www.thegwpf.org/antarctic-sea-ice-26-normal/

  234. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 7:29 am

    ‘Climate predictions ‘wrong’. There’s not much in the new predictions, but they’re potentially catastrophic.’

    Peter Hannam / SMH

  235. Dianne permalink
    January 1, 2014 7:46 am

    ‘Wrong’ because report says it is going to be much worse than thought.

    But we will be alright down here because we have M Newman guiding TA.

    Their position seems to be to cover your ears, screw your eyes right up tight, no peeking and just wish, wish upon a star and all will be well. Dream the dream. Sleep tight. Happy new year Egg.

  236. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 11:01 am

    Yeah, same to you comrade.

    Did you know that global warming stopped in 2001?

  237. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 12:34 pm

    In fact it stopped last century.

  238. Dianne permalink
    January 1, 2014 12:43 pm

    On 26 March at 5 pm I believe.

  239. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 1:18 pm

    I put this link up earlier, which shows clearly there has been global cooling in England all this century.

    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/12/22/england-temperatures-dropping-like-a-rock/

    The data comes from the UK Met office and can be counted as reliable.

  240. Dianne permalink
    January 1, 2014 1:21 pm

    Well I am longing to be snowed in Egg. I love the cold and all that goes with it. Soup making, knittin’, fires, ice, not being able to go out, nobody being able to call. Bring on global cooing.

  241. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 2:51 pm

    Its a well known fact that cold kills more readily that warming, as evidenced by the growth in humanity during the Medieval and Roman periods. In the same way our Modern Climate Optimum has produced large numbers of people.

    What we see in the UK is a timely example of what we can expect in the future, weather wise, while at the same time there will probably be increasing migration from that quarter.

    In the old days they died in their millions across Europe from cold and disease brought on by cooling, but we won’t see any of that this time around.

  242. Dianne permalink
    January 1, 2014 3:02 pm

    Yes but will we see snow in Longreach Oracle Egg.

    I will survive. I find igloos charming. A couple of red geraniums out front. Perfect.

  243. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 1, 2014 3:56 pm

    The AGW hypothesis cannot explain previous warming and cooling episodes whereas the sunspot activity hypothesis has some credibility in providing an explanation. More interestingly the AGW hypothesis has utterly failed when it comes to the last 15 years where large increases in CO2 have not seen any increase in temperature. The fact that the climate models failed so badly suggests that the theory on which they are constructed needs, at the very least, serious revision. On the other hand the current absence of warming is consistent with the sunspot activity hypothesis.

    The AGW hypothesis has everything to do with political opportunism, grant-grabbing and the pursuit of fame, money and power for the likes of Flannery and Gore. It has nothing to do with science.

    Professor Chris Turney and his “Spirit of Mawson” publicity stunt are at least giving us plenty of laughs. Whereas Mawson lost two companions, had to eat his dogs and suffered severe frostbite, his spirit is reflected by the current pampered passengers on their ship of fools as follows:

    It is quite stressful… I miss banana and peanut butter milkshakes… I’ve got this really thin, small bed… I’ve hurt my back… I jammed my leg in the door last night… And it’s only going to get worse… Stranded in ice. Oh, God I’m going mad.

    In this interview with HGNelson, Turney commented wryly on the post-enlightenment view that humans believed that they control nature. He seems oblivious to the fact that both the AGW hypothesis and the solution which he proposes is premised on exactly that.

  244. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 5:29 pm

    All that splatter said is true and while we are on the Antarctic folly, there is a rumour going around that….

    ‘This propaganda exercise was funded by the BBC, Australia’s ABC and the Guardian newspaper; since the scientists and activists got stuck on Christmas Eve, it has been hardly mentioned in these media sources or in other mainstream media. All reference to the real reason for the expedition has been deleted and it has now been re-badged as a ‘cruise’.

    This is not entirely accurate, the Murdocracy is on to it.

  245. egg permalink
    January 1, 2014 9:12 pm

    ‘The University of New South Wales research team focussed on how increased levels of carbon dioxide affect storm clouds… and how, in return, those changes are affecting climate change.

    ‘While the scientists aren’t forecasting temperatures will go past the long-talked about upper level of five degrees by the year 2100, they do say the lower predicted level of a two-degree increase can now be discounted.’

    Radio Australia (ABC)

  246. Meta permalink
    January 2, 2014 1:16 am

    (Yes, (im)media(te) agenda-setting is a fascinating topic, el g.)

  247. egg permalink
    January 2, 2014 7:30 am

    Agenda setting extraordinaire.

  248. egg permalink
    January 2, 2014 7:38 am

    Aunty sets her own left wing agenda.

    ‘FOREIGN Minister Julie Bishop has expressed concerns that the ABC is not meeting the terms of its $223 million Australia Network contract, after receiving negative feedback from its target audience. Ms Bishop’s comments come as one of her most senior bureaucrats has admitted the department was “closely monitoring” the ABC’s management of the overseas network.’

    Kerr / Oz

  249. egg permalink
    January 2, 2014 1:20 pm

    So intelligent design has nothing to do with a universal dog, but a lot to do with a deity or two.

    The theory goes that 4.5 million years ago a terrific drought in Africa saw the apes adapt by walking upright on the savannah, at the mercy of horrible beasts. The galactic bruvverhood noticed this creature and thought it had distinct possibilities and did some genetic engineering…. believe it or not.

    ‘Scientists believe the formation of the Isthmus of Panama is one of the most important geologic events in the last 60 million years. Though only a small sliver of land relative to the sizes of continents, the Isthmus of Panama had an enormous impact on the earth’s climate and environment. By shutting down the flow of water between the two oceans, the land bridge rerouted ocean currents in both the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.

    ‘Evidence also suggests that the creation of this land mass and the subsequent warm, wet weather over northern Europe resulted in the formation of a large Arctic ice cap and contributed to the current ice age. That warm currents can lead to glacier formation may seem counterintuitive, but heated air flowing over the warm Gulf Stream can hold more moisture. The result is increased precipitation that contributes to snow pack.’

    wiki

  250. egg permalink
    January 2, 2014 4:13 pm

    ‘Contrary to some of the more outlandish claims made by climate change deniers, the ship was not suddenly enveloped by ice due to rapidly plummeting temperatures. It was pinned by ice carved off from the Mertz glacier, a well-established ice formation.

    “In the last few years the ice near where the ship is bogged has become less accessible,” Press said.

    Oliver Milman / Guardian

  251. egg permalink
    January 2, 2014 4:26 pm

    ‘If human emissions continue under a BAU scenario for 85 more years to 2100 (~800 ppm at 2100 under BAU) it would be eventually all over Red Rover for humans and a huge swathe of the biosphere.

    ‘I doubt that such a point would actually be reached (there are too many points of failure to navigate in our socioeconomic system before that time), but even going half-way to there from where we are now would put the kibosh on future Western civilisation and at least 75-90% of the current human population.

    ‘Alarming? Yes. Alarmist? No – unless one refuses to consider the numbers and the lessons of science.’

    Bernard J / Deltoid

  252. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 7:18 am

    “Climate sceptics like to criticise climate models for getting things wrong, and we are the first to admit they are not perfect,” said Sherwood. “But what we are finding is that the mistakes are being made by the models which predict less warming, not those that predict more.”

    ‘He added: “Sceptics may also point to the ‘hiatus’ of temperatures since the end of the 20th century, but there is increasing evidence that this inaptly named hiatus is not seen in other measures of the climate system, and is almost certainly temporary.”

    Carrington / Guardian

  253. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 9:08 am

    Last year was hottest on record Egg.

    Strange way to cool.

  254. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 9:43 am

    That’s only 100 years, but I’ll spread the word that we have found Trenberth’s missing heat.

  255. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 9:53 am

    Anyway, worldwide its a different story. A cooling trend is the reality.

  256. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:00 am

    Apparently Egg. The warming here is part of a worldwide trend.

  257. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:01 am

    Apparently NOT . I am being sabotaged.

  258. Walrus permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:17 am

    Ya know in an age of Digital everything it concerns me that thermometers of today are far more accurate to those of even 20 years ago when a traditional mercury thermometer was read by some guy or gal brandishing a clipboard reading the temperature by bringing their eyes in line with the top of the red vertical bar trying to work out if it was 25.2 or 25.3 degrees using just line of sight.

    And now we suddenly believe they were always dead accurate to a tenth of a degree ?

    What a joke that is.

    The reality is nothing read from back then can bolster either side of the case

  259. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:38 am

    The US is heading for a deep freeze.

  260. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:52 am

    That website you provided Egg has an arteekle by Dr Tim Ball. I have heard tell that he says approving things about Creationism and seems to use nutty sources. But you would know more than I would about his credentials.

    The trouble with a lot of the absolute denialists is that they appear a bit batty. I saw a fellow quoted recently and checked him out. He is dead now and I have forgotten his name but as well as being a well-known denialist he had formerly led a pro-tobacco campaign.

    You guffawed when I mentioned Ross Garnaut and Ian Chubb. Unqualified! Unqualified! Well what about Maurice Newman getting a gig in the Oz the other day? Newman is an investment banker and stockbroker.

  261. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 2:09 pm

    The Australis struggles to reach open water.

    http://www.antarctica.gov.au/webcams/aurora

  262. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 2:21 pm

    Newman was also head of the ABC for awhile, where he saw first hand the propaganda aunty was pumping out.

    Not sure about Ball, but well known luke warmer Roy Spencer is said to be into that sort of thing. NTTIAWWT if its alien induced.

    And this vague connection between the Denialati and tobacco is a Watermelon meme. Its been around for years and not to be taken seriously.

  263. Phil permalink
    January 3, 2014 3:02 pm

    I will never be cease to be amazed that people respond to global warming denialists.
    As posted further up the post, they don’t only appear a bit batty, but are in reality, stark raving mad. They should be told in no uncertain terms, to fuck off back to the funny farm from whence they came.

  264. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 3:16 pm

    LOL

    For dog’s sake man, ask me an intelligent question.

  265. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 3:49 pm

    How funny is this, the debacle is in the travel section at SMH.

    http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/antarctic-expedition-leader-relieved-but-sad-to-leave-russian-ship-20140103-308wx.html

  266. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 4:21 pm

    Phil – they are indeed insane.

    Humour them. Do not raise your voice. No sudden movements. Carry a stick.

  267. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 4:31 pm

    ** chuckle **

    Phil won’t be back, doesn’t have the bottle and he’s humourless.

  268. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 4:51 pm

    ‘The reality is nothing read from back then can bolster either side of the case’

    Its all we have to go on, even if BoM has massaged the figures, so I’m keeping an open mind. One year is not a trend, its just typical alarmism from the Klimatariat and left wing media.

    Keep your eyes on this northern hemisphere winter and buy wheat futures.

  269. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 4:55 pm

    The trend has been measured since 1950.

  270. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 6:50 pm

    Show me your graph and I’ll show you mine.

  271. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:03 pm

    I heard it on my ABC

  272. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:08 pm

    The propaganda arm of the Klimatariat.

    I’ll need a graph, otherwise how can we compare and contrast?

  273. Dianne permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:09 pm

    Egg – read article by Oliver Milman in Guardian about 2013 being hottest year in Oz.

    Includes 1950 trend ref.

    Sorry vintage I pad won’t do links.

  274. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:38 pm

    That’s OK, I’ll check it out.

    Meanwhile, the heat is on in Moscow….. vagaries of the jet stream.

    http://themoscownews.com/news/20131226/192130841/Moscow-temperature-breaks-century-old-record.html

  275. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:43 pm

    ‘Labor and the Greens used the latest Bureau of Meteorology records to demand the Abbott government rethink its policies on climate change. The acting Greens leader, Richard Di Natale, branded Abbott a “reckless ideologue who ignores the science and is intent on listening to people who are part of the tinfoil hat brigade”.

    Hurst / Guardian

  276. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:46 pm

    Here’s the original press release from BoM …. on the hottest year.

    http://www.bom.gov.au/announcements/media_releases/ho/20140103.shtml

  277. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 8:55 pm

    “Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Environment Minister Greg Hunt can no longer pretend climate change is not real and is not affecting Australia’s environment and economy,” said Acting Opposition Leader Penny Wong.

    Xinhua

  278. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 9:06 pm

    Frozen Out: 98% of Stories Ignore That Ice-bound Ship Was On Global Warming Mission

    Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/mike-ciandella/2014/01/02/frozen-out-98-stories-ignore-ice-bound-ship-was-global-warming-missi#ixzz2pKQkeal8

  279. Walrus permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:17 pm

    “I will never be cease to be amazed that people respond to global warming denialists.”

    Few deny climate change

    Rusted on Noddies like you simply agree with rubbish because you were never taught to properly look at evidence and whether it is truly “independent”

    So don’t blame the “denialists” for your lack of Education as unfortunate as it obviously is.

    “Denialist” ain’t that a lovely term . Paint a dissenter as almost Nazi Holocaust Denier to get your point across

    It just proves ya full of shit in the first place.

  280. egg permalink
    January 3, 2014 10:58 pm

    Its a sad state of affairs seeing so many brainwashed people, friends and family included, nevertheless its going to be fun watching AGW collapse.

  281. Walrus permalink
    January 4, 2014 12:26 am

    Agreed egg

    I don’t doubt that the climate is changing but that’s happened since the fucking Garden of Eden stopped growing Apples

    Now I want a Noddy to prove me wrong by selling me an edible apple

  282. Walrus permalink
    January 4, 2014 12:27 am

    From the garden of Eden

  283. Dianne permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:32 am

    Apples originated in Central Asia. Afghanistan produces a fine variety apparently.

    It is the speed at which climate change is occurring which rings alarm bells. That is very unusual and disturbing.

    Fossil fuels took millions and millions of years to form and accumulate. We have pumped a lot of it back into the atmosphere in 250 or so years. Mmm.

  284. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 7:43 am

    Climate is changing at a natural pace, nothing untoward is happening, CO2 does not cause global warming. D its plain to see aunty has sold you a porky.

    Friends have just told me they are returning to NZ after spending most of their lives in Oz, because of global warming. The propaganda has been so intense that even bright people are snared.

  285. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 7:55 am

    Its important that we separate weather from climate by looking at long term trends.

    Winnipeg experienced ‘the 6th coldest December on record, coldest since 1933 and New Years Eve hit -48 with the wind chill.’

  286. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 8:03 am

    Yep, been warm.

  287. phill permalink
    January 4, 2014 9:15 am

    I am the Ape man I am the Walrus coo coo ca choo.

    Go away moron how do you know what education I have?

    Global warming is a reality and governments around the world are coming to terms with it.

    You are the same people that said years ago lead wasn’t a problem in paint or petroleum.That CFC’s were not affecting the ozone.

    Ditto for smoking is harmless, and yes I paint denialists the same as the Germans, who maintained they were not gassing the Jews. You people are just as stupid and more dangerous. The same people who covered up the dangers of asbestos.

    It is just not about global warming, it is about the dangerous ideology of the conservative mind set. Most of the worlds scientists by a country mile know there is a problem, Monkton and a gaggle of other assorted paid off morons will not change the science.

    If I am full of shit, you are a sewage farm.

  288. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 9:39 am

    ‘That CFC’s were not affecting the ozone.’

    That’s true, it was a monstrous scam.

    Phil the expression ‘you people’ is old hat and strongly suggest we avoid such characterisations going forward.

    The problem for you sunshine is that you don’t have a clue about climate change, but lucky for you I have infinite patience.

  289. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 10:34 am

    We didn’t know about ozone depletion in the Antarctic until the advent of satellites and then Dupont latched onto it.

    The Montreal Protocol was a stepping stone for the IPCC, two of the biggest hoaxes of the modern era.

  290. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 10:42 am

    The ozone hole is refusing to go away.

    It now appears there is a strong correlation between cosmic rays and ozone depletion, a natural phenomenon.

  291. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 10:46 am

    ‘Go away moron how do you know what education I have?’

    Hang around Phil, I like your robust style. Unlike the cafe crowd, all of us here are university educated … except for Inane

  292. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 11:27 am

    ‘Ditto for smoking is harmless’

    Passive smoking is harmless, but it makes your clothes stink, read it in the Mail.

    ‘…and yes I paint denialists the same as the Germans, who maintained they were not gassing the Jews. You people are just as stupid and more dangerous. The same people who covered up the dangers of asbestos.’

    I may be a little nutty or eccentric in my thinking, but you are truly delusional and suggest you seek professional help.

  293. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 11:55 am

    ‘Fossil fuels took millions and millions of years to form and accumulate. We have pumped a lot of it back into the atmosphere in 250 or so years. Mmm.’

    A tenuous connection, little more than a coincidence. Whereas our star has been extremely active over last century and clearly accounts for the modest increase in warming.

    With the aid of satellites we can also detect its influence on other planets in our solar system.

  294. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 12:43 pm

    There is a lot of talk on geoengineering to stop the earth warming.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/01/02/one-problem-with-geoengineering-once-you-start-you-cant-ever-stop/

    As the world is going to get cooler over the next 30 years it may be necessary to breach the Panama Isthmus to turn off the ice age clock.

  295. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 12:49 pm

    The Holocene has reached its ‘used by’ date.

    http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greenland_Gisp2_Temperature.svg

  296. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 3:29 pm

    ‘A winter storm has blanketed parts of Canada and the north-eastern US with up to 2ft (61cm) of snow.

    ‘The storm has been blamed for 11 deaths and forced the cancellation of more than 4,000 flights since Wednesday.

    ‘With the wind chill, the temperature dropped as low as -29C (-20F) in Toronto and -38C in Quebec City, the lowest seen in two decades.

    ‘Authorities warned residents to remain indoors, both for their own safety and to keep roads clear for snow removal.’

    BBC

  297. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 4, 2014 4:32 pm

    Climate is changing at a natural pace

    You haven’t worked out Google yet, have you?

    The main, stunning conclusion we can draw from the paper is that the rate of warming since 1900 is 50 times greater than the rate of cooling in the previous 5000 years, which undermines the whole notion of adaptation.

    http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/03/31/1800881/recent-warming-is-still-unprecedented-in-speed-scale-and-cause-a-marcott-et-al-faq/

    CO2 does not cause global warming

    Again, I’ll side with the scientists, you can follow your weatherman

    Also good to see you highlighting the recent Extremes in weather that we are experiencing, which, as you will no doubt recall, has long been forecast by those scientists I prefer to trust.

  298. January 4, 2014 4:53 pm

    “I’ll side with the scientists…”

    Me too…

  299. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:02 pm

    The scientists thank you reb 😉

    I haven’t read too far back up this thread, but I assume there has been much hilarity about the scientists marooned in the ice.

    This was a fairly good article on it.

    In fact, the local weather patterns that brought about the rapid build up of ice that trapped the Academik Shokalskiy tell us very little about global warming. This is weather, not climate.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jan/03/antarctica-ice-trapped-academik-shokalskiy-climate-change

    BTW, I hope all had a good Christmas and New Year. And that they got through safely.

  300. TB Queensland permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:19 pm

    So Brissy cracked the 41°C … thank goodness we have an A/C … hasn’t been run for two years … 27° inside right now …

    Was 39° yesterday …

    However, I was always reminded by the climate change experts that a spike in weather patterns has nothing to do with climate … 😉

  301. TB Queensland permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:20 pm

    Apologies JJ I just see you saying the same thing …

  302. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:46 pm

    Gosh, Joe Romm.

  303. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 5:49 pm

    ‘Also good to see you highlighting the recent Extremes in weather that we are experiencing, which, as you will no doubt recall, has long been forecast by those scientists I prefer to trust.’

    The wayward jet streams in both hemispheres is a global cooling signal and is not human induced.

  304. January 4, 2014 5:56 pm

    Brisbane river frozen over.
    Penguins sliding everywhere.

  305. TB Queensland permalink
    January 4, 2014 6:11 pm

    The wayward jet streams in both hemispheres is a global cooling signal and is not human induced.

    See this is the problem I have with both “sides” of the argument … always so fkn sure they are right … can you actally prove or disprove the statement above?*

    *my position is still agnostic BTW

  306. January 4, 2014 6:31 pm

    Fair enough TB…

    I tend to side with the scientists, and also the fact that we are witnessing escalating patterns of extreme weather conditions worldwide.

    I don’t think humans are 100% to blame, but when you consider how fragile the atmosphere is, I hardly think that 100 years of pumping shit into the atmosphere is helping.

    I do find it suspicious that those who insist that climate change is crap, tend to be those who subscribe to intelligent design aka the “dog will provide” mob.

    It’s part of christian dogma to believe that mankind has dominion over everything else on Earth.

    Previously they insisted that the Sun revolved around the Earth. They’re insistence that climate change is crap will similarly be found to be amongst the same BS as “:creationism”.

  307. January 4, 2014 7:21 pm

    l tend to agree with reb. The dog-botherers of the armageddon flavor, are unconditionally backing corporate polluters to hasten their beliefs becoming reality.

    #about 300 years of industrial pollution reb.

  308. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 7:57 pm

    ‘…can you actally prove or disprove the statement above?*

    Finally, an intelligent question.

    Both sides cherry pick weather extremes, to prove their point, so I can appreciate its not easy to grasp the significance of particular events.

    The wayward jet stream explains the extremes, for example Moscow is experiencing record breaking warm weather at the moment and haven’t seen temps like this since 1910.

    On the downside the US is taking a battering and this gives me the clue to connect the wayward jet stream to eventual worldwide cooling. Its a stadium wave which drags colder air from the poles and closer to the equator, but I’ll have to check whether it locks into a fixed patten.

    From memory, Siberia was unusually warm during the Little Ice Age, prior to the Industrial Revolution.

  309. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 4, 2014 8:00 pm

    can you actally prove or disprove the statement above?

    Which is why so many are able to easily obfuscate. What is interesting though, is the regularity that posters such as egg and his ilk (ie, septics) are so often proven to be inaccurate in their assertions. Yet they continue to repeat these assertions regardless.

    I am pretty sure sometime in the future egg will repeat the Climate is changing at a natural pace statement either here or another haunt. Regardless of the accuracy.

  310. January 4, 2014 8:13 pm

    el`dodo still clings to points of confected conjecture of denier junk-science, but when you hit him between the eyes with ocean acidification complaints, by the worlds shellfish industries and worlds fisheries departments, then he will be lost for conversation.

  311. January 4, 2014 8:20 pm

    “Finally, an intelligent question.”

    I won’t hold my breath for an intelligent answer…

  312. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 8:27 pm

    *chuckle*

    JJ let’s discuss the science and forget the political bias which colours your mind.

  313. egg permalink
    January 4, 2014 9:07 pm

    I was wrong in thinking Siberia was warm during the LIA, indicating the stadium wave doesn’t stand still.

    http://www.co2science.org/articles/V3/N10/C2.php

  314. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:45 am

    “If I am full of shit, you are a sewage farm.”

    I don’t need to prove anything when you do it for me.

    Your education lacks so badly you don’t know the difference between the term “sewage” and “sewerage.”

    As I stated before What an uneducated dickhead you are.

    I don’t need your grades to understand you spent your summer school hours on a beach with a towel draped over you from the waist down and winter holed up in a room with a mag and a jar and tweezers.

    LOL

    I don’t follow the opinions of morons like you

    You are just another Noddy who suffers anal leakage at every weather report.

  315. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:59 am

    “In fact, the local weather patterns that brought about the rapid build up of ice that trapped the Academik Shokalskiy tell us very little about global warming. This is weather, not climate.”

    And therefore you can also say the same about a hot day in Brisbane

    Oh hang on its Summer.

    Perhaps that’s why it’s hot ?

  316. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 1:06 am

    “I paint denialists the same as the Germans, who maintained they were not gassing the Jews. You people are just as stupid and more dangerous”

    Why don’t you read a few books assuming you can read as that statement basically proves what a totally disgusting piece of filth you are.

  317. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 1:07 am

    Perth is quite nice these days by the way

  318. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:43 am

    Lots of laughs, worth every penny.

    ‘TAXPAYERS will foot a $400,000 bill for the rescue of a group of climate scientists, tourists and journalists from a stranded Russian research vessel – an operation that has blown the contingency budget of Australia’s Antarctic program and disrupted its scientific work.

    ‘The Antarctic Division in Hobart said it was revising plans and considering airlifting urgently needed scientific equipment that could not be unloaded from Aurora Australis before the ship was diverted from the Casey base to rescue the novice ice explorers just before Christmas.’

    Graham Lloyd / Oz

  319. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:58 am

    ‘Get ready for it to feel as cold as MINUS SIXTY! Nation braces for the coldest temperatures in 40 YEARS as ‘polar vortex’ crosses US’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2533458/Flood-Hercules-grip-Northeast-Canada-records-temperatures-cold-MARS.html#ixzz2pTAM9hh7
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  320. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 11:19 am

    Antarctic sea ice trending above average.

  321. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 11:24 am

    JJ let’s discuss the science and forget the political bias which colours your mind.

    Actually egg, considering that I am simply repeating what scientists are stating, and you are regurgitating dot points from conservative based denial sites, perhaps the political bias lies closer to home than you would like to think?

    novice ice explorers ,/i>

    A fine example of the political bias of your ‘source’. Try this instead

    Antarctic expedition: ‘This wasn’t a tourist trip. It was all about science – and it was worth it’
    ……….
    Inspired by Mawson’s efforts, friend and colleague Chris Fogwill and I decided to attempt a similar venture on a smaller scale. In spite of a century of work, huge gaps in knowledge remain across the region investigated by the original expedition. To tackle these questions we spent the last two years building a team of experts keen to work with individuals outside their area of expertise.

    http://www.theguardian.com/science/antarctica-live/2014/jan/04/antarctic-expedition-was-worth-it-chris-turney

    That’s the Australian’s ‘novices’ for you

  322. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 11:29 am

    Should the Denialati get a say in the workings of climate change on this planet?

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/southern-crossroads/2014/jan/04/climate-change-climate-change-scepticism#comment-30444741

  323. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 11:36 am

    Seemed like a good idea at the time, essentially it was a propaganda mission which went belly up.

    ‘The aim of the Australasian Antarctic Expedition (AAE) is to lead a multidisciplinary research programme in one of the most scientifically exciting regions of our planet, straddling the Southern Ocean and East Antarctic. Using the latest in satellite technology, we are beaming images, movies and text in an attempt to excite the public about science and exploration, inspired by one of the most scientifically successful efforts in the Antarctic: the Australasian Antarctic Expedition of 1911-1914, led by British-born Sir Douglas Mawson.’

    Turney

  324. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:30 pm

    propaganda mission ……..from………excite the public about science and exploration,

    Yes, because science and exploration is all about ‘propaganda’, unless it is from a weatherman or a big oil funded think tank, then it is ‘ challenging the science’ with debunked soundbites from the same sources who brought us the “tobacco doesn’t hurt” and “Asbestos is safe” campaigns.

    Really egg, has anyone ever taken you seriously?

  325. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:37 pm

    From eggs own link, I couldn’t have painted a better picture myself of his blogging

    These people were true believers, blind to the fact that their arguments were hopelessly flawed, the result of cherry-picked data and conspiratorial thinking. They had no idea that the smart-sounding talking points from their preferred climate blog were, even to a casual climate science observer, plainly wrong. They were completely enamored by the emotionally charged and rhetoric-based arguments of pundits on talk radio and Fox News

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/southern-crossroads/2014/jan/04/climate-change-climate-change-scepticism#comment-30444741

    Is the responsibility of major media publishers on honesty, accuracy and objectivity?

    Well obviously it is, by their own charter. And by the overriding charter of journalists who in turn provide them with access denied to other organisations.

    http://www.independentaustralia.net/business/business-display/how-the-canberra-press-gallery-shut-out-ia,5270

  326. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:48 pm

    ‘Really egg, has anyone ever taken you seriously?’

    Splatter.

  327. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 12:51 pm

    Pot meet kettle.

    ‘These people were true believers, blind to the fact that their arguments were hopelessly flawed, the result of cherry-picked data and conspiratorial thinking.’

  328. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 3:32 pm

    Pot meet kettle.

    You mentioned global cooling.

    You have a source for that?

  329. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 4:42 pm

    ‘You have a source for that?’

    Yeah.

  330. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 4:44 pm

    Yeah.

    But perhaps too embarrassed to reveal it?

  331. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 4:52 pm

    No, my sources are forever changing.

    ————

    ‘The head of France’s polar science institute has voiced fury at the misadventures of a Russian ship trapped in Antarctic ice, deriding what he called a tourists’ trip that had diverted resources from real science.

    ‘In an interview with AFP, Yves Frenot, director of the French Polar Institute, said he had no issue at all with rescuing those aboard the stricken vessel.

    ‘He said the trip itself was a ‘pseudo-scientific expedition’ that, because it had run into difficulties, had drained resources from the French, Chinese and Australian scientific missions in Antarctica.

    ‘There’s no reason to place Antarctica off-limits and to keep it just for scientists, but this tourism has to be monitored and regulated so that operators can be sure of getting help if need be,’ he said.

    Hate Media

  332. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 5:00 pm

    No, my sources are forever changing.

    In other words, too embarrassed

    I should have known. Never trust the word of someone unable to back up their claims. Guess getting facts thrown back at you every time you do would become tedious. I have been reading back in the C02 threads reb put up seemingly for your benefit, and it’s a pretty embarrassing resume you have there eggordo. Reminds me of Mickey Rourke in the Barfly

  333. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 5:50 pm

    ‘In other words, too embarrassed’

    No, I’m a reporter in the 5th Estate and one day I hope to revive my career as a journalist.

  334. TB Queensland permalink
    January 5, 2014 7:18 pm

    sreb and I have been accused, in the not too distant past, of destroying the “career” of a blog commenter* … so I’d be very, very, careful, scrambles … 😈

    *whatever that is …

  335. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 7:29 pm

    You don’t frighten me old man. I’m well aware of my precarious situation, having already been banned from warmist and sceptic blogs in my search for the troof.

    What I don’t understand is that you, as the master of irony around here, can’t see CC as a joke.

  336. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 7:34 pm

    a journalist.

    Well, with the current crop, you’d fit right in.

    So, you have nothing to support your statement about global cooling then. OK, we can right that one off as the fabrication I had assumed it to be

    While we are at it, you can politely withdraw the remark about pot and kettle, as I am not in the habit of making up stories to try and support an argument. That appears to be your domain. The only ‘true believers’ in this debate are those who trust the words of weathermen who will not even accept their own findings and fake Lords who get shown for fools in their own skewed debates by unknown Computer Scientists

  337. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 7:53 pm

    ‘So, you have nothing to support your statement about global cooling then.’

    Its more than a gut feeling, if you read through my links you can see the sources.

  338. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:05 pm

    ‘While we are at it, you can politely withdraw the remark about pot and kettle, as I am not in the habit of making up stories to try and support an argument.’

    No, you just believe what the scientists say.

  339. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:06 pm

    if you read through my links you can see the sources.

    Truly, I have better things to do than trawl sites that are filled with misinformation and outright lies. If the section you claim is there, I’m sure pointing me directly to it will be no trouble for such a learned character as yourself. I’m interested because there was this denial article that was well and truly put in it place when it came out a while ago that claimed the same. I was interested if you were still using this as your source is all? I have seen or heard of no other claim since, so you can understand how I can be lead to believe that this might be your (already debunked) source.

    In which case, I would be most let down, you know, with you claiming to be searching for the ‘troof’ and all.

  340. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:09 pm

    Would that be David Archibald?

  341. TB Queensland permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:09 pm

    What I don’t understand is that you, as the master of irony around here, can’t see CC as a joke.

    You understand too little and assume too much, fluffy duck!

    No-one fears an old man … but think about this … age is just a number – and some men are old at 20 and some are still children at 80 …

    ‘Tis not what you know but how you use your knowledge that is important …

  342. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:09 pm

    No, you just believe what the scientists say.

    I assume you then are calling the scientists liars?

    Can you support that, as that would surely make news. And please, none of this rubbish from the emails the conservatives trawled through for months searching for that elusive ‘conspiracy’. I’m sure you can do better than that

  343. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:10 pm

    We are only a month apart, so I don’t take it too seriously.

  344. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:11 pm

    ‘Tis not what you know but how you use your knowledge that is important …

    Ahh, wisdom and knowledge, interesting how some can have so much of one, and yet so little of the other.

    I’m not specifically ruling myself out here either 😉

  345. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:12 pm

    Would that be David Archibald?

    You are the one telling the tale

  346. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:13 pm

    ‘I assume you then are calling the scientists liars?’

    No, enlightened self interest and the scramble for grants has made a mockery of peer review. The Klimatariat is all powerful.

  347. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:13 pm

    We are only a month apart

    After looking at your ‘graphs’ (and more importantly, your interpretation), that could still mean that TB is 60, and you are still 13

  348. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:14 pm

    lol

  349. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:17 pm

    No, enlightened self interest and the scramble for grants has made a mockery of peer review.

    Again, an unfounded claim. Simply an opinion echoed across the conservative sphere. With all of these dodgy grants and dubious peer reviews, we somehow still manage to be making huge advances in sciences, not just Climate Science. Scarcely believable if you take your accusation at face value.

  350. TB Queensland permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:36 pm

    Why thanx, JJ on both counts! 😛

  351. TB Queensland permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:36 pm

    Oh, on second thoughts … 😯

  352. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:41 pm

    I’m focussed only on CC peer review, which is completely lopsided.

    ———–

    Temperatures in the UK back to the 1980s.

    http://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2014/01/02/central-england-temperature-stats-for-2013/

  353. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:53 pm

    Michael Mann coauthored an excellent paper on how global cooling begins, but I don’t have it to hand. His argument was that it started in a regional way, which makes a lot of sense.

    CET made be falling to 1980s levels, but this is not reflected on a global scale.

  354. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 5, 2014 8:56 pm

    I’m focussed only on CC peer review, which is completely lopsided.

    And my argument above still remains

    It appears you have one thing at hand, a list of denial talking points, not much more though.

  355. January 5, 2014 9:04 pm

    ”””You understand too little and assume too much, fluffy duck!”””

    ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆

    `Tis not ONLY what you know,
    but how you use your knowledge that is important

  356. phil permalink
    January 5, 2014 9:39 pm

    Walrus if you had a brain you would be dangerous. Your opinion on global warming is nothing short of absolute horse shit. Most of the worlds scientists by a country mile have a consensus on the subject, and global warming is a reality. I don’t have to prove anything you fuck wit, the science is already in. It is only loons like your good self that are not yet convinced.

    I stand by what I said shit for brains. Thankfully the only input from tools like you, will be at the ballot box, voting in from time to time aberrations like Abbott. Which incidentally was for all the conservative rhetoric, still a close race. He and his excuse for an environment minister will be gone next election, and the on going push for a solution to the problem will resume.

    As for books start your good self by taking out the one under your bed. I have no doubt it has nice pictures of naked women in it.

  357. egg permalink
    January 5, 2014 10:17 pm

    DENIAL TALKING POINT … TIPPING POINT HAS ARRIVED

    ‘Astrophysicist Chabibullo Abdussamatov claims that the sun will radiate significantly less warmth in the coming years. “Consequently a ‘little ice age’ lies ahead.”

    ‘Bild adds that Abdussamatov says the Earth has had a negative energy budget since 1990, but that the oceans have been able to compensate with its stored energy. But the Russian scientist now says that’s over. Bild writes:

    ‘Beginning around 2014 the average annual temperature will begin to drop, and by 2050 it will be about 1.5°C cooler than today when the low point is reached. Also the water temperature in the world’s oceans will fall about 1°C.”

    – See more at: http://notrickszone.com/2013/04/05/russian-scientist-warns-global-temperatures-to-fall-1-5c-by-2050-and-global-cooling-refuges/#sthash.KwP2LPxw.dpuf

  358. January 5, 2014 10:37 pm

    `Tis not ONLY what you know,
    (and clearly in your case, what you don`t fluffy duck)
    as your denier gibberish is all over the place and doesn`t explain anything at all

  359. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 10:43 pm

    “…..and global warming is a reality. I don’t have to prove anything you fuck wit, the science is already in. ”

    And there is that arrogant phrase again.

    “The science is already in”

    I must admit I do like hearing it as it pisses off more and more people everyday

    You really are just a moron Phool

    You think your blind arrogant ways will carry the case. Obviously dick masseurs like you have never travelled to the third world to see how they live.

    You are such a flying drop kick wanker you think you can change the world with taxes.

    You are simply just the worst leftist scum

    But you make me laugh

    If you thing Abbott will be beaten next election you truly are deluded

    Go away and grease it up dickhead

  360. Walrus permalink
    January 5, 2014 10:53 pm

    Ya gotta laugh when dickheads like Phool have to bring Abbott into all posts about Climate Change.

    No mention of their heroes like Obama or whoever the Chinese Prezz is.

    No mention of Putin their great hero

    The best they can do is utter “Nazi” then “Denialists” and the “Science is in”

    Everyday Phool obviously turns on the TV and suffers anal leakage at the weather report.

    And everyday the public becomes less interested in the crap they espouse.

    Does anyone know of a single prediction that Tim Flannery has made that has come true. After all he made them when the science was already in.

  361. phil permalink
    January 5, 2014 11:12 pm

    Jesus Walrus I don’t what it is about you, your rapier wit or delusions of grandeur. Yes, the science is in and has been for a long time. A moron I may be, however that still makes me smarter than you by an order of magnitude. Your contention that people are losing interest in this debate is risible. Tell that crap to the people that live some of the islands to our north that are already being flooded out by sea water.

    As for Putin, that would have to be the most childish remark I have read today, what the f*&^ has Putin got to do with global warming?

    Now go back to tugging yourself over that book from under your bed.

  362. January 5, 2014 11:21 pm

    Don`t worry Phil, the blubbering walrus and dodo egg become hysteric when people point out
    https://theguttertrash.com/2013/12/04/new-report-paints-terrifying-picture-of-global-warming-future/#comment-40929

  363. phil permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:28 am

    Indeed. Yes, people like Walrus dodo egg and others who sprout the denialist line, are truly just abject morons. Any scientists that take a contrary view to the over whelming evidence that btw increases exponentially at a pace, are on the payroll of the polluters. Failing that their so called credentials are suspect, take Monkton as a case in point.

    Of course this is not really about global warming for Tories, this is about curbing their capacity to rape and pillage the planet. The system demands growth, and nothing must get in the way of that quest. Of course as you know, global warming is just one of the problems facing mankind. Water shortages the destruction of forests and arable land to name a few.

    Yep, Walrus, dodo, egg and Inane Hall thank God and others of their ilk who live in a parallel universe some where, are not taken serious by anyone. Good sport is all.

  364. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 7:51 am

    ‘Does anyone know of a single prediction that Tim Flannery has made that has come true.’

    No.

  365. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 7:53 am

    ‘your denier gibberish is all over the place and doesn`t explain anything at all’

    Its the big shining orb sunshine, humanity is innocent of the charge laid against it.

  366. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 8:22 am

    Its the big shining orb sunshine, humanity is innocent of the charge laid against it.

    How do you conclude that it is the sun when we have just experienced the longest solar cycle minimum in a nearly century while at the same time the earth warmed faster than any time in thousands of years?

  367. phil permalink
    January 6, 2014 8:29 am

    ‘your denier gibberish is all over the place and doesn`t explain anything at all’

    Yawn!!!!

  368. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 8:42 am

    JJ what do you think of the hiatus? Before you answer its important to understand that ALL scientists recognise it.

  369. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 9:00 am

    JJ what do you think of the hiatus?

    You mean the natural variabilty that ALL scientists predicted would/could occur, but can not predict exactly when? That one. Yes, it is clear that climate changes with varying rates, steep ups and downs, periods of stability, but one thing is clear, the overall trend is upwards, ever upwards.

    Will you answer my last question, or ignore it like you did my previous one?

  370. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 9:03 am

    Yawn!!!!

    Yes, please don’t highlight that all the deniers have is gibberish, it bores us so. Keep on doing the Funky Gibbering. It’s only the future you are wrecking.

  371. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:33 pm

    ‘Will you answer my last question, or ignore it like you did my previous one?’

    I’ll tackle this first… ‘How do you conclude that it is the sun when we have just experienced the longest solar cycle minimum in a nearly century while at the same time the earth warmed faster than any time in thousands of years?’

    They know the NAO is directly connected to the sun, whereas ENSO is not, so there are lags in the oscillations depending on the cycles. As you are probably aware the PDO is in its cool phase and ENSO is predominantly cool to neutral.

    Natural variability is all and CO2 is a non driver. You are selling snake oil to innocents, it hasn’t been ‘thousands of years’, just a thousand.

  372. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:40 pm

    I’ll put this up again in case you missed it.

    ‘but one thing is clear, the overall trend is upwards, ever upwards.’

    The trend in fact is flat.

  373. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:50 pm

    Natural variability is all

    Hang on, didn’t you just say it was the sun?

    Natural variability is not all, as previous temperature changes have shown. Outside influences can and have driven changes. What is missing from the recent change is an outside influence, except of course the rapid rise in C02 concentration, which has long been accepted as a major influence in the greenhouse cycle.

    Your abbreviations above, while maybe correct, or maybe not (your graph, as alluded to previously, means nothing in this context without further explanation, and is the real snake oil being peddled here), mean nothing to the GLOBAL range, in fact, they are simply results, not causes. You said the sun caused it, yet the sun has been at a minimum. How you bring PDO into that is anyone’s guess, but, regardless, even ‘oscillations’ will be reflected over 100 years of a solar minimum, yet you talk of weather patterns as if they mean anything to a solar event, which, maybe, you still claim is driving it, perhaps.

    It is just bizarre. First it is the sun driving the change, now it is apparently just the weather doing what it does.

    I agree with the last bit, the weather will do what it does but, the question remains, what is driving this weather to be doing what it is?

  374. phil permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:54 pm

    egg knows all about oscillations. He feels it in his bell end when having a masturbation cycle.

  375. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:54 pm

    The trend in fact is flat.

    No, the ‘trend’ is still up. The recent measurement is flattish (but still up)

  376. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 1:55 pm

    egg knows all about oscillations.

    Well, he uses the word a lot, but I wonder if he really knows what it means

  377. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 2:25 pm

    The sun is natural and has an effect, but to what degree is still hotly debated. If we think of the NAO as a switch and when the sun goes quiet for too long it flicks to another phase.

    The mechanism involved maybe simple, more cosmic rays bombard earth, increasing low cloud cover. You will be familiar with the CERN experiments?

    ‘The recent measurement is flattish (but still up)’

    Do you have that handy?

  378. phil permalink
    January 6, 2014 2:27 pm

    ” Well, he uses the word a lot, but I wonder if he really knows what it means ”

    I doubt it. Still it is good sport, I mean, entertainment like this is usually reserved for the comedy theatre. I find if you don’t take anything they say serious, and just take the piss out of them, it is quite therapeutic.

    .

  379. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 2:52 pm

    Do you have that handy?

    Oh, I see, two questions you have not been able to provide any (useful) link to back up your assertions, and now want one of me? Well, since I actually read before I state, the yes, no problems.

    In reality, global surface temperatures have warmed over the past 15 years, albeit more slowly than during the previous 15 years.

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2013/sep/09/climate-change-arctic-sea-ice-delusions

    And, since you haven’t been able to supply ANYTHING to support your claim about it being “the Sun”, I’ll add salt to your wounds, cos the scientists have agreed

    While evidence suggests fluctuations in solar activity can affect climate on Earth, and that it has done so in the past, the majority of climate scientists and astrophysicists agree that the sun is not to blame for the current and historically sudden uptick in global temperatures on Earth

    http://www.livescience.com/1349-sun-blamed-warming-earth-worlds.html

    Now, what about the ‘it’s cooling’ tale, or do want to concede that too? Although, I get the feeling you won’t be conceding ‘it’s the sun’ in face of all evidence in the face of it.

  380. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 3:10 pm

    ‘Judith Curry claiming that the anticipated IPCC statement of 95 percent confidence that humans are the main cause of the current global warming is unjustified.’

    Not bad for a luke warmer.

    You are arguing that climate change in the 21st century is not effected by our star’s behaviour? Humans, those beastly ape like creatures, are now the sole arbiters of our earthly climate?

  381. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 3:16 pm

    ‘Global Warming was just one issue The Club of Rome (TCOR) targeted in its campaign to reduce world population. In 1993 the Club’s co-founder, Alexander King with Bertrand Schneider wrote The First Global Revolution stating,

    “The common enemy of humanity is man. In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through changed attitudes and behavior that they can be overcome. The real enemy then, is humanity itself.”

    Channelling Watts

  382. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 3:20 pm

    Humans, those beastly ape like creatures, are now the sole arbiters of our earthly climate?

    You are free to point me to where I said that.

    What I did say was that the only outside influence that could have caused such a rapid rise in temperature that can be found is the the additional C02 in the atmosphere.

    The suns impact has been examined, and found not to be a major influence in the climate variation at this time. You are free to find another culprit. Good luck with that. Better charlatans than you have been trying for well over a decade now, with nothing but suckers like you to show for it.

  383. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 6, 2014 3:24 pm

    Channelling Watts

    And therein lies the true tragedy

  384. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 4:16 pm

    ‘What I did say was that the only outside influence that could have caused such a rapid rise in temperature that can be found is the the additional C02 in the atmosphere.’

    We’ll have to agree to disagree, from my standpoint CO2 is innocent of he charge laid against it. Not that it particularly matters at this late stage of the game, we should see the tipping point by year’s end.

  385. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 5:41 pm

    Global cooling tipping points are not uncommon.

  386. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 8:23 pm

    ‘In Chicago, temperatures were expected to fall throughout Sunday to about minus 11.5C “and from there it will be a free fall for the rest of the night,” with temperatures bottoming out around minus 26C overnight and likely setting a daily record, Mr Fenelon said.’

    AP

  387. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 9:32 pm

    SIOUX FALLS, S.D. (AP) — ‘The weather warnings are dire: Life threatening wind chills. Historic cold outbreak. Bitter cold temperatures.

    ‘Winter is normally cold, but starting Sunday tundra-like temperatures are poised to deliver a rare and potentially dangerous sledgehammer blow to much of the Midwest, driving temperatures so far below zero that records will shatter.

    ‘One reason? A “polar vortex,” as one meteorologist calls it, which will send cold air piled up at the North Pole down to the U.S., funneling it as far south as the Gulf Coast.’

    Huffpo

  388. egg permalink
    January 6, 2014 10:12 pm

    Snow Trolling Fashionable Again

    http://www.drroyspencer.com/2014/01/snow-trolling-by-drudge-or-journalistic-equal-time/ Fashionable Again

  389. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:13 am

    from my standpoint CO2 is innocent of he charge laid against it.

    Well, considering your standpoint is coming from a position of ignorance and blind abstinence, it hardly matters WHAT your standpoint is. The simple fact of the matter is the large majority of the worlds scientists agree that global warming IS happening, and the WE are causing it. Your Faeries that attempt to explain it away have ALL been considered, checked, and refuted by not only the leaders in the field, but every hack and wannabe that wants to make a name. The science remains intact, against the storm of denial. You have no science to support your argument, only well funded charlatans. Charlatans who have previously argued that Cigarettes cause no harm, and that Asbestos is safe. It’s a rarefied crowd you hang with egg.

    Not that it particularly matters at this late stage of the game, we should see the tipping point by year’s end.

    Again, the science disagrees, which seems to happen a lot with you.

    http://phys.org/news/2013-11-two-degree-global-limit-elusive.html

  390. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 9:55 am

    You must be joking, Jherk.

    Climate “scientists” fail the most basic test – they don’t practice science. This political rabble goes to great lengths to prevent their “science” from scrutiny. Typical is Professor Phil Jones: “Why should I make the data available to you, when your aim is to try and find something wrong with it?”. That is the opposite of science and it is typical of the climate science cabal rather than an isolated example.

    There you have an idiot masquerading as a scientist.

  391. Walrus permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:02 am

    That’s right Splatter. They refuse to offer themselves up to scrutiny.

    The remarkable thing is that people like JJ still deliver all this crap with a straight face after all this time.

  392. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:08 am

    Climate “scientists” fail the most basic test – they don’t practice science.

    Well, numerous examinations into their practices have shown otherwise.

    Typical is Professor Phil Jones:

    Actually, no, that wasn’t typical, it was an exasperated response to what has now been recognised as a systematic attempt by persons to inundate the research team with FOI requests that simply wasted their time, after it had been spelt out that either they no longer had the data, or that the data did not belong to them.

    Not really typical.

  393. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:10 am

    Just an anecdote …

    I’ve got to know a few environmental scientists through my work. They work in mining and manufacturing, and generally they (try to) do a good job in assisting companies mitigate adverse environmental impact.

    One I know has progressed to a high level executive position – running a mining services company.

    These highly paid professionals don’t deny climate change, but they don’t have a particularly high regard for their former colleagues who have never sought to expand their expertise outside the academic world. They see the outcomes of research as predetermined, those environmental scientists who remained as academics were more generally the climate activists.

  394. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:17 am

    They refuse to offer themselves up to scrutiny.

    Climate scientists have come under far more scrutiny than any other field in recent times. And still the science stands the test

  395. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:22 am

    but they don’t have a particularly high regard for their former colleagues who have never sought to expand their expertise outside the academic world. ,/i>

    read: to make more money

  396. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:40 am

    blind abstinence from above should of course read blind obstinance. Spell checker gone wild.

  397. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:42 am

    I see.

    No doubt you prefer the opinions of lowly paid people.

  398. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 10:49 am

    No doubt you prefer the opinions of lowly paid people.

    I prefer the opinions of a wide range of people, academic or not.

    Didn’t you mention that they don’t deny climate change?

  399. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:05 am

    “Not really typical.” In fact FOI requests have been resisted from the outset.

    Bottom line is that no public money should be spent on the basis of theories where the authors will not allow their work to be subjected to critical scrutiny.

    “The two MMs have been after the CRU station data for years. If they ever hear there is a Freedom of Information Act now in the UK, I think I’ll delete the file rather than send to anyone.

    We also have a data protection act, which I will hide behind.

    Tom Wigley has sent me a worried email when he heard about it – thought people could ask him for his model code. He has retired officially from UEA so he can hide behind that.”

    I can’t see either of these papers being in the next IPCC report. Kevin (Trenberth?) and I will keep them out somehow – even if we have to redefine what the peer-review literature is!

    Can you delete any emails you may have had with Keith re AR4? Keith will do likewise.

    PS Re CR, I do not know the best way to handle the specifics of the editoring. Hans Von Storch is partly to blame—he encourages the publication of crap science ‘in order to stimulate debate’. One approach is to go direct to the publishers ….. Mike’s idea to get editorial board members to resign will probably not work—must get rid of von Storch too

    We need to get some broad based support, to capture the public’s imagination… So we have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements and make little mention of any doubts… Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest.”

    Former Canadian Environment Minister Christine Stewart:
    “No matter if the science is all phony, there are collateral environmental benefits…. Climate change [provides] the greatest chance to bring about justice and equality in the world.” Source: Calgary Herald, 14 December 1998.

    I’ve just completed Mike’s Nature trick of adding in the real temps
    to each series for the last 20 years (ie from 1981 onwards) amd from
    1961 for Keith’s to hide the decline.

    And here is a quote from Judith Curry which accurately describes the problem:

    What has been noticeably absent so far in the ClimateGate discussion is a public reaffirmation by climate researchers of our basic research values: the rigors of the scientific method (including reproducibility), research integrity and ethics, open minds, and critical thinking. Under no circumstances should we ever sacrifice any of these values; the CRU emails, however, appear to violate them.

    “well funded charlatans”

    The well-funded charlatans are the climate “scientists” who monopolise university research funding. Their most effective critic is Steve McIntyre who works on his own dime.

  400. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:16 am

    It really is denial central here isn’t it. Going through the CRU saga again. talk about lala land.

    The review gave scientific processes at CRU “a clean bill of health” but did raise some issues of concern. Record-keeping was patchy, it said, while the scientists did not use the best possible statistical techniques to analyse their data.
    ……
    Did the enquiry agree?

    No. It said that the scientists acted honestly and with a genuine desire to report the truth. They were not perfect, but their failure to keep all paperwork for decades-old studies did not influence the findings.

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/apr/14/oxburgh-uea-cleared-malpractice

    That seems to contradict Judith Curry and her opinion.

  401. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:31 am

    As I said, Jones is not the exception but the rule in the weird world of climate “science”.

    “That seems to contradict Judith Curry and her opinion.”

    It does indeed. But not for any logical reason.

    The bottom line is that if the climate “scientists” will not allow their work to subject to critical scrutiny it should be ignored. Richard Feynman described how real science works:

    In summary, the idea is to give all of the information to help others to judge the value of your contribution; not just the information that leads to judgement in one particular direction or another.

    Climate “scientists” generally do the opposite. Which is precisely why climate “science” is not science at all.

  402. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:40 am

    But not for any logical reason.

    Did you read the link


    Oxburgh said sustained requests to CRU scientists for data and computer codes from McIntyre and others could have amounted to a campaign of harassment, and that the affair left several unresolved questions about how Freedom of Information laws should be applied in an academic context.

    ….

    The report also said it was “unfortunate” that the UK government had introduced widely copied policies to charge for environmental data sets, such as those used by the CRU scientists and requested by critics. The move impeded the flow of data between researchers, it added.

    Those were the ‘logical’ reasons. Oh, and the bit I highlighted in bold in my previous post, You know, about them not having it from decades ago.

  403. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:52 am

    It doesn’t matter what excuse the “scientists” have for not properly archiving their data. If their work can’t be checked it should be ignored.

    Both Oxburgh’s and Muir-Russell’s enquiry were farcical. They didn’t even bother to interview critics. They only took evidence from the shonks and then repeated their excuses as findings.

  404. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 11:59 am

    ‘It really is denial central here isn’t it.’

    Honestly I’m just as surprised as you, but have no fear I have it on good authority that the editor is preparing a satirical post on the 2014 Tipping Point.

  405. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 12:07 pm

    If their work can’t be checked it should be ignored.

    It could be checked, and it was checked.

    As was detailed above, a lot of the data had to be paid for, yet others just wanted them to hand over their copy. If they wanted it, they could have fronted up and paid as well. There was nothing stopping them. Instead, they spammed the CRU with FOI requests.

    The data is now available freely, yet I am still waiting for someone to disprove the findings.

  406. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 12:33 pm

    By and large, neither the code for the models nor the raw data has been released. Adjusted data has been made available, but not the methodology of the adjustments.

    What we do know is that the Hockey Stick has been discredited. Clearly the authors did not have a good grasp of statistics. The Yamal studies have been discredited, mainly for cherry-picking. The use of an upside down graph from the Tjander paper, accompanied by the excuse that the error doesn’t matter, is a standing joke. The ‘hide the decline’ farce should result in all papers by the “scientists” who employed the ‘trick’ without disclosing in their papers what they were doing and why. Steig’s Antarctic paper got the statistical method wrong. The attempts to deal with increases in CO2 without any increase in temperature in the latest IPCC Report represents a descent into madness and hysteria.

    The phenomenon we are dealing with here is political groupthink, not science.

  407. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 12:47 pm

    What we do know is that the Hockey Stick has been discredited.

    So repetitive, so inaccurate

    In their renewed criticism, McIntyre & McKitrick 2005 (MM05) reported a technical statistical error in the Mann, Bradley & Hughes 1998 (MBH98) method, which they said would produce hockey stick shapes from random data. This claim was given widespread publicity and political spin, enabling the George W. Bush administration to assert that the 1997 Kyoto Protocol was discredited. Scientists found that the issues raised by McIntyre and McKitrick were minor and did not affect the main conclusions of MBH98 or Mann, Bradley & Hughes 1999.[77][116] Reconstructions using different statistical methods had produced similar “hockey stick” graphs. Mann himself had already stopped using the criticised statistical method in 2001, when he changed over to the RegEM climate field reconstruction method.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hockey_stick_controversy

    Clearly the authors did not have a good grasp of statistics.

    That has been admitted, and rectified.

    The phenomenon we are dealing with here is political groupthink

    Yes, but as with egg, the groupthink lies closer to home than you would like to admit. I mean, this was all cleared up years ago, yet here you go, rehashing it all, just as it becomes clear that egg cannot answer straight forward questions.

  408. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 1:28 pm

    ‘just as it becomes clear that egg cannot answer straight forward questions.’

    Now you’re making shit up.

  409. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 1:35 pm

    Being tight arse Tuesday I’ll bring this across from the other fred, for your edification.

    ‘The doomsters’ favourite subject today is climate change. This has a number of attractions for them. First, the science is extremely obscure so they cannot easily be proved wrong. Second, we all have ideas about the weather: traditionally, the English on first acquaintance talk about little else. Third, since no plan to alter climate could be considered on anything but a global scale, it provides a marvellous excuse for worldwide, supra-national socialism.’

    Margaret Thatcher

  410. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 1:39 pm

    Now you’re making shit up.

    So, can you support your statement that “it is the sun”, or “we are entering a cooling phase”

    Thought not. So, I am not “making shit up”. It appears that you are.

  411. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 1:41 pm

    The Hockey Stick was all about “getting rid of the Medieval Warm Period” which the alarmist scientist Overpeck identified as a key problem with the AGW narrative. He said that it had to be eliminated.

    Before MGH, the MWP was widely supported in the scientific literature. The IPCC accepted it and presented it in graphical form in figure 7.1 of the WG1 First Assessment Report. In addition to incompetent statistics, MGH relied on the use of bristlecone pine proxies which are unreliable as temperature proxies. This methodology is one major reason the decline had to be hidden – there is a serious divergence problem with bristlecones which the authors of the faulty studies did not want to address. Other studies purporting to support the HS elimination of the MWP such as the Yamal studies were even more obvious in their cherry-picking. They have done little to displace the pre-MGH orthodoxy that the MWP was warmer than today and that it was followed by the Little Ice Age from which we were, until recently, still emerging. For the last 15 years global temperature has flat-lined notwithstanding a large increase in CO2.

  412. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 1:55 pm

    See above Splatterbottom

    Reconstructions using different statistical methods had produced similar “hockey stick” graphs.

  413. Walrus permalink
    January 7, 2014 2:01 pm

    I always like this bit from Wiki about the IPCC

    “Its mission is to provide comprehensive scientific assessments of current scientific, technical and socio-economic information worldwide about the risk of climate change caused by human activity,………………”

    So we have a UN funded bureaucracy wholly dependent for its existence on proving humans are causing climate change.

    No conflict of interest there ………of course not

  414. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 7, 2014 2:11 pm

    Indeed Walrus. The IPCC is an agenda-driven political organisation.

    Jherek, did you read my last comment? The subsequent studies are deeply flawed.

  415. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 2:20 pm

    The IPCC is an agenda-driven political organisation.

    There is no denying that. It was set up specifically to guide Governments on international action.

    The subsequent studies are deeply flawed.

    Or not

    The 2k results highlighted non-uniform temperature variations in different locations around the world. They do observe a ‘Medieval Warm Period’ between the years 800 and 1400, but different regions warmed at different times, consistent with the findings of previous research.

    http://www.skepticalscience.com/pages2k-confirms-hockey-stick.html

  416. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 3:45 pm

    ‘So, can you support your statement that “it is the sun”, or “we are entering a cooling phase”

    Assuming CO2 doesn’t cause global warming, we fall back to the null hypothesis. When the sun is active (lots of spots) the solar wind deflects cosmic rays from bombarding earth.
    This means less low cloud cover and a warmer earth, as experienced late last century, but now the situation has dramatically changed for the worst because Sol is crook.

    The solar wind has dropped off, which means earth has been receiving a higher dose of cosmic rays and (according to the CERN experiments) an increase in low cloud cover, leading to cooler temperatures.

    Its a simple mechanism and the key is amplification, particularly in Antarctica, but clearly having an impact on the North Atlantic Oscillation.

    We are entering a cooler phase this year, so there is little point in seeking out academic literature when we can observe the whole thing happening in real time.

  417. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 5:44 pm

    Sorry egg, try again

    http://www.skepticalscience.com/cosmic-rays-and-global-warming-advanced.htm

  418. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 5:57 pm

    A couple of years ago the CLOUD experiment at CERN proved conclusively that cosmic rays cause low cloud.

  419. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 6:19 pm

    I reach for the bible….

    http://www.skepticalscience.com/cern-cloud-proves-cosmic-rays-causing-global-warming.htm

    … so that we can discuss the pivotal points.

  420. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 6:33 pm

    … so that we can discuss the pivotal points.

    The pivotal points appear to be that “At the moment, it actually says nothing about a possible cosmic-ray effect on clouds and climate, but it’s a very important first step”

    Well, that’s what the CERN scientist said anyway

  421. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 6:51 pm

    Yep, Kirby has backed away from his 1998 comments that it could account for half the warming. I’ll have to concede for the moment, but I’m leaving the gate open because there maybe a coincidental correlation.

  422. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 7:11 pm

    ‘Better to check the relationship between Jetstream zonality and meridionality, the effect of that on the length of the lines of air mass mixing around the globe and then in turn the effect on global cloudiness and albedo.’

    Stephen Wilde

  423. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:03 pm

    I’ll have to concede for the moment, but I’m leaving the gate open because there maybe a coincidental correlation.

    Meanwhile, the rest of us will just get on with the available science and plan from that, rather than hoping and praying it is something else 😉

  424. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:04 pm

    But Kudos for actually conceding the point egg, I didn’t think ou had it in you. Well done.

  425. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:04 pm

    Ay least we can agree it has nothing to do with a harmless trace gas.

  426. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:17 pm

    Ay least we can agree it has nothing to do with a harmless trace gas.

    True. C02, on the other, not being a harmless gas, is another story

  427. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:28 pm

    Surely the hiatus proves its a harmless trace gas? Putting the CLOUD thingy behind us for now, what about observational amplification. I put it up earlier and deserves another airing.

    http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com.au/2014/01/paper-finds-solar-amplification.html

  428. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:49 pm

    Surely the hiatus proves its a harmless trace gas?

    You haven’t been following this thread very closely have you

  429. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 8:57 pm

    Its a steep learning curve. So what do you make of the Frederick et al paper?

  430. egg permalink
    January 7, 2014 9:48 pm

    The first par is correct.

    ‘Just why the polar vortex has proved to be too weak to contain the cold air this winter will be a matter for intense scientific study and debate for some time to come. The phenomenon might in large part be explained by the natural changes in climate that occur in the Arctic in winter, including the North Atlantic Oscillation that has a dominant impact on wind patterns and storm tracks in the region.

    ‘But Noaa, a federal agency, has also floated the possibility that a reduction in summer sea ice cover caused by climate change could be a factor behind the weakening of the polar vortex. That would have the paradoxical effect that while Arctic waters are getting warmer, North America experiences much colder snaps such as the present severe weather as a result of Arctic air spilling out from the North Pole and moving south.’

    Guardian

  431. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 8:37 am

    ‘A “weather whiplash” sent temperatures in New York plunging 50 degrees fahrenheit. At lunchtime on Monday, it was 55F (13C) in Central Park; on Tuesday morning it was 5F (-15C).

    ‘It was so cold in Kentucky on Monday that an escaped prisoner turned himself in. Robert Vick, 42, escaped from a minimum-security prison on Sunday, the Associated Press reported, but as temperatures dropped through the floor on Monday he walked into a motel and asked the clerk to call the police so he could escape the freezing air.’

    Guardian

  432. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 9:14 am

    egg, thank you for continuing to highlight that the weather is also experiencing extremes at both ends of the scale just as the global average continues its implacable upward climb, just as the models predicted. Predictions which are becoming a frightening reality in front of our very eyes.

  433. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 9:50 am

    ‘just as the global average continues its implacable upward climb’

    That will require a graph, otherwise your comment has no credibility. My argument has been consistent, regional cooling (according to Michael Mann) is on the road to LIA.

  434. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 10:05 am

    That will require a graph, otherwise your comment has no credibility.

    What is it with you and graphs? Is it because you cannot read?

    https://theguttertrash.com/2013/12/04/new-report-paints-terrifying-picture-of-global-warming-future/#comment-41068

    regional cooling has nothing to do with your claim about global cooling. Still an unfounded and undefended claim that I have shown to be incorrect.

  435. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 10:44 am

    Why does that graph there go down, but the one created here for the same time period go up?

    http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/cag/

  436. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 10:51 am

    Its the Klimatariat fudge factor. I’ll look for a CET graph, in the meantime.

    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2014/01/07/time-magazine-goes-both-ways-on-the-polar-vortex/

  437. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 10:55 am

    Regional cooling has begun in the UK.

    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2013/12/22/england-temperatures-dropping-like-a-rock/

  438. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 10:59 am

    Regional cooling has begun in the UK.

    Did you mean Seasonal Cooling?

    Its the Klimatariat fudge factor.

    Back in the real world, some might just call them “lies”

  439. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 11:04 am

    If you take a close look at the graphs there appears to be no warming signal. Show me your graphs to prove you are up to speed in the real world.

  440. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 12:01 pm

    If you take a close look at the graphs there appears to be no warming signal.

    You mean the ones you just admitted were ‘fudged’?

    Really, my last two links have supplied you with what you are now requesting, again. Read please egg. Your ignorance is beginning to swamp you.

  441. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 12:33 pm

    Oops, no graph here

  442. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 1:04 pm

    ‘You mean the ones you just admitted were ‘fudged’?’

    I meant NOAA.

    Stewart is good, but he’s on the wrong side of history when it comes to CC.

  443. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 1:06 pm

    So its been flat in the US for more than 100 years, where’s the hockey stick?

  444. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 1:13 pm

    guffaw

    From your link, lack of credibility.

    ‘Based on current estimates, even if another Maunder Minimum were to occur, it might result in an average temperature decrease of about 2 degrees Fahrenheit, Rind said.

    ‘This would still not be enough to counteract warming of between 2 to 12 degrees Fahrenheit from greenhouse gases by 2100, as predicted by the latest Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) report.’

    LiveScience staff writer Andrea Thompson contributed to this article.

  445. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 1:29 pm

    guffaw

    From your link, lack of credibility.

    guffaw

    From the guy who links to Steve Goddard. Mind you, you could elaborate just why you don’t think the article is credible?

  446. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 2:54 pm

    ‘This would still not be enough to counteract warming of between 2 to 12 degrees Fahrenheit from greenhouse gases by 2100, as predicted by the latest Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) report.’

    Fantasy Land from flawed models.

  447. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 3:06 pm

    Fantasy Land from flawed models.

    Your fantasy land perhaps.

    The percentage of the worlds scientists disagree with you. Again.

  448. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 5:27 pm

    Its no concern of mine, the models are flawed and that’s the end of the matter.

  449. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 6:50 pm

    ‘Jennifer Francis, a researcher at Rutgers University and the most prominent proponent of the hypothesis that Arctic warming is altering the jet stream around the Northern Hemisphere, told Climate Central that while the cold snap is brief in duration, it fits with patterns observed this year and in other recent years.

    “The persistence of the pattern seems consistent with an amplified jet stream configuration that we expect to see occur more frequently as the Arctic continues to warm disproportionately,” Francis said in an email.

    Freedman / Guardian

  450. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 7:15 pm

    After the Copenhagen conference the UK media distanced itself from the idea that floods had anything to do with global warming.

    http://www.noiseofthecrowd.com/has-the-media-stopped-linking-floods-to-climate-change/

  451. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 7:33 pm

    ‘The Midwest and the East were colder than much of Antarctica on Tuesday’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2535029/Coldest-morning-decades-Millions-wake-record-low-temperatures-final-blast-POLAR-VORTEX-barreling-U-S-creating-coldest-temperatures-recorded-20-years.html#ixzz2pnHvg81f
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  452. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 8:08 pm

    Here we glimpse the polar vortex …

    http://earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/isobaric/1000hPa/orthographic=-81.76,55.30,409

  453. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 8, 2014 8:15 pm

    the models are flawed and that’s the end of the matter.

    [stamps foot]

    At least you are open minded. Well, in “septical” way anyway

  454. egg permalink
    January 8, 2014 8:28 pm

    If they can’t predict a decade in advance then they have failed, whereas I can say with certainty that we are experiencing a ‘break point’ similar to the period after WW2 until 1976.

    This is essentially a sceptic view, while the denialati think the Modern Climate Optimum has come to an end. Our furtive crew of kitchen table scientists are searching for signs from the tail of the MWP.

    I draw your attention to the large sea storms lashing the UK and Portugal, is bound to generate much discussion.

  455. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 7:57 am

    ‘Hunt and the responsible minister, resources minister Ian Macfarlane, are understood to be determined to keep the election promise to keep the RET, but several MPs are pushing that it be scrapped altogether.

    ‘The prime minister, Tony Abbott, signalled before Christmas that the target could be wound back or the scheme scrapped, saying lower power prices are the government’s primary goal and the rationale for the RET no longer exists.’

    Taylor / Guardian

  456. Jherek Jagged permalink
    January 9, 2014 8:06 am

    is bound to generate much discussion.

    And most of it, unfortunately, will be dominated by blathering idiocy, as your postings here have indicated.

  457. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 8:31 am

    Mann channels Jennifer Francis on the vortex.

    http://www.cbc.ca/player/News/World/ID/2428739814/

  458. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 8:35 am

    ‘The devastating floods which have devastated large parts of Britain are linked to climate change, David Cameron suggested today.

    ‘The Prime Minister told MPs he ‘suspects’ the storms, 60mph winds and torrential rain are the result of global warning.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2535883/Britain-risk-flooding-heavy-rain-looms.html#ixzz2pqSlbw4G
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  459. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 10:34 am

    Cold Air Outbreak (CAO) explained in two minutes by Obama’s right hand.

  460. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 9, 2014 10:39 am

    Mark Steyn writes well and with a sense of humour:

    I confess I was hoping it might all drag on a bit longer and the cultists of the ecopalypse would find themselves drawing straws as to which of their number would be first on the roasting spit. On Douglas Mawson’s original voyage, he and his surviving comrade wound up having to eat their dogs. I’m not sure there were any on this expedition, so they’d probably have to make do with the Guardian reporters. Forced to wait a year to be rescued, Sir Douglas later recalled, ‘Several of my toes commenced to blacken and fester near the tips.’ Now there’s a man who’s serious about reducing his footprint.

    But alas, eating one’s shipmates and watching one’s extremities drop off one by one is not a part of today’s high-end eco-doom tourism. Instead, the ice-locked warmists uploaded chipper selfies to YouTube, as well as a self-composed New Year singalong of such hearty un-self-awareness that it enraged even such party-line climate alarmists as Andrew Revkin, the plonkingly earnest enviro-blogger of the New York Times.

  461. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 12:19 pm

    ‘Just as I’ve been saying since 2007/8 I first noticed the jet streams turning more meridional again around 2000.

    ‘The sun shifts the jet streams and climate zones.

    ‘The jets change the cloud amounts.

    ‘The clouds affect ocean heat content.

    ‘The oceans regulate the air temperatures.

    ‘New papers are coming out almost daily that support that hypothesis.

    ‘Exactly as proposed in my New Climate Model.

    ‘So far the increase in clouds has only been enough to stabilise global air temperatures. Note that cloud amounts were higher than at present in the early 80s following the effects of less active solar cycle 20.

    ‘If the sun stays quiet, cloud amounts should increase further then, after a while due to oceanic lag, global air temperatures should begin to fall.’

    Stephen Wilde

  462. egg permalink
    January 9, 2014 3:23 pm

    That appears to be the mechanism and wonderfully simple, even JJ would have to agree.

  463. January 13, 2014 11:32 pm

    Dumpty, the `Bat Rescue` folks are claiming `thousands` of bats are dying in Queensland. The bats are suffering from `frost-bite` and their wings become `iced-up` (just like aircraft do) and the bats fall to earth,

    and the penguins eat them.

    Southern Queensland is being gripped by furnace-like temperatures, said the local RSPCA. The has in turn caused mass deaths at least 25 separate colonies have been reported since the weekend, including at Mt Ommaney, Redbank, Boonah, Palmwoods, Laidley and Gatton. RSPCA spokesman Michael Beatty says the heatwave was a significant hit to the population of bats across the state, reports the ABC news station. “The heatwave was basically a catastrophe for all the bat colonies in south-east Queensland,” he said. “That’s obviously going to have a pretty disturbing impact on those colonies and those colonies are vital to our ecosystem.” The smell of bat carcasses has caused problems for locals. The Scenic Rim Regional Council, west of Brisbane, has organized rubbish collectors to clear up the carcasses of about 2,000 bats. Residents near Boonah’s Athol Terrace lookout say they have been putting up with the stench of the dead animals for four days. Hundreds of bats also lie dead in trees and nearby bushes, and are being eaten by maggots.
    The council today advised local residents it will not send workers into nearby bushland to collect the remaining bat carcasses, as it could cause further disruption to the nearby colony. One resident has told the ABC she is receiving anti-viral treatment after being scratched by a baby bat while clearing the dead animals out of her tree with a rake. Further north, Lockyer Valley Regional Council says it also faces a massive task of cleaning up thousands of dead bats from around Laidley and Gatton. Sunshine Coast Regional Council has sent workers out to collect thousands more dead bats near Palmwoods. At least 16 people across south-east Queensland are receiving anti-viral treatment after coming into close contact with a bat. Queensland Health is advising people not to touch the animals and to call authorities for help in clearing them away. Sammy Ringer from Bat Rescue echoed those concerns, saying it was best to call a wildlife volunteer or a vet. “Don’t touch them, they’re stressed,” she said. “If they do bite or scratch you and break the skin you can get a vaccination, you can get a shot for the lyssavirus.”

    http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2014/01/09/heatwave-causes-100000-dead-bats-to-fall-from-the-sky-in-australia/

  464. TB Queensland permalink
    April 4, 2014 7:03 pm

    S989 so sad about your pad …

    Did you say iPad … chuckle .. 83 views … could you link us to just one?

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