Let’s Bomb Russia!
Russia is on the brink of invading its nearest neighbour the Ukraine as the Ukraine itself plunges into political turmoil.
With thanks to or EXCLUSIVE SOURCES, we bring you this in-depth analysis of the current crisis that threatens to bring about World War Three!!
Who does Russian President Vladimir Putin think he is?
From an outsider’s perspective, you might think there’s no way Putin would invade Crimea right now. Russia’s economy is in dire financial straits, Crimea is close to succeeding from Ukraine anyways, and by invading Crimea, Russia could easily isolate itself politically and diplomatically from the rest of the world. But we think that Putin might not even care…!
The outcome of almost any actions by Russia at this point don’t look good. Georgia’s membership to NATO seems to have been fast-tracked, which would give the military alliance an extremely useful military outpost close to Russia that could house advanced weapons which could threaten Russia.
This is especially problematic for Russia, since it’s no longer the military superpower it once was.
The army is largely ill-equipped and made up of a rabble of motley conscripts. If the Russian military were to face any legitimate opponent in a military clash, they’d likely lose. But, no sane country would want to start a legitimate war with a nuclear-armed Russia, and Putin knows this.
It’s all going to hell in a basket!
Almost everyone in the West has turned on Putin and Russia. Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper strongly condemned Russian military intervention in Ukraine, recalled Canada’s ambassador from Moscow and plans to pull out of the upcoming G8 process in Russia.
Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott echoed the sentiment, calling Russia’s actions “unacceptable” and telling the country to “back off.”
NATO Secretary-General Anders Fogh Rasmussen released a statement saying that Russia has violated the principles of the United Nations Charter, threatening peace and security in Russia while disregarding Ukraine’s territorial integrity and sovereignty. And of course, President Barack Obama already held a press conference warning Russia of the potential and unspecified “costs” of any military intervention in Ukraine.
There’s Nothing Anyone Can Really Do!
Besides condemning the actions and warning against possible explicit and implicit embargoes, President Obama cannot really stop Russia from invading Crimea.
Russia’s military, though not a superpower, has enough power in the area to pose a real threat, but it’s highly unlikely any real firefighting would break out.
And while NATO, the US, Ukraine and a host of other international powers can warn Russia against its actions, as long as Putin is committed to an when it comes to invasion of the Ukraine, there’s little that will stop him.
The UN, on which Russia often relies when it wants to exercise its veto powers, could try to intervene, but as usual would most likely be ignored. Save an all-out war, there’s almost nothing standing in Russia’s way.
At This Point, Any Move is a Bad Move
While there’s a strong pro-Russian population in Crimea, there are also large swaths of the population, specifically the Crimean Tatars, with a deep hatred for Russia, who will resist any Russia encroachment in their land.
Sure, efforts might be futile at first, but Putin could be sowing the seeds for conflict for years to come.
If Russia steps back (which is almost guaranteed to not happen), the country will feel deflated, but more importantly, the damage will have already been done.
Russia’s basically already shown its cards, and back-pedaling at this point will be tough. If Russia keeps moving forward, things are going to turn out badly for almost everyone.
“Military intervention would be the beginning of war and the end of any relations between Ukraine and Russia,” Ukrainian Prime Minister Arseny Yatseniuk told The Gutter Trash.
Eastern Ukraine is Probably Next
Though Russia is usually a champion of non-interference, the diverse make-up of many eastern European countries means that people with Russian ethnicity and citizenship are scattered around various countries, and Russia believes that it has the right to trump a nation’s sovereignty if it means helping its own people.
That’s part of the reasoning for invading Crimea and that the same logic and path the country would pursue if it were to invade eastern Ukraine, which is a highly likely possibility depending on what happens next in Crimea.
We’re all doomed!
theguttertrash.com 
Well you can Crimea river….
Its great for Oil and Gold prices.
‘The threat of war in Europe cast a pall over global financial markets that saw the Australian currency and sharemarket fall in tandem, but bargain hunting and rallies in gold mining and energy stocks helped trim losses in the afternoon.’
afr
When the West intervened to remove the province of Kosovo from Serbia, Russia protested that it was illegal interference in the affairs of a sovereign nation. So much for the Treaty of Westphalia.
When Russia occupied South Osetiastan it used the Kosovo as a precedent for its actions.
Given that Russia would be significantly disadvantaged by the loss of its Crimean naval base, there is no prospect that it will not do something to maintain control over it.
Certainly the West did not give a shit about the Kosovan Serbs or their historic monasteries before invading Kosovo.
Putin will also be fortified in the knowledge that he is dealing with a pair of B-grade dilettantes in Obama and Kerry.
It is futile threatening Russia. It would have been better trying to negotiate an arrangement to let them keep their naval base, with some type of limited autonomy for the majority Russian areas of the Ukraine. Unfortunately the time for that has passed and we are well into the belligerent posturing phase, with the hawks criticising Obama for not being tough enough. Seriously, what credible threat could he make? Now it is quite possible that the Ukraine will return to being a virtual Russian satrapy.
An interesting side note is that Europe is in no position to threaten anyone, much less Russia. They couldn’t even deal with Libya without US help. That is a direct consequence of Europe’s decision to spend as little as possible on defence.
“dilettantes” + “satraphy”
Where’s the dictionary ?
Putin tells Merkel he moved because of the “threat of violence from ultranationalists”.
Not a bad line.
‘The Ultranationalists are a revolutionary political party and armed organization in Russia who wish to return the country back to what it was during the days of the Soviet Union.
‘They believe that the Russian Federation does not have the best interests of the Russian people at heart, siding with Western interests both philosophically and economically, and they perceive this to be destroying or weakening the Russian state.
‘The Ultranationalists idolize the Soviet Union out of a sense of national pride, though their actual commitment to Communist political and economic ideals are left ambiguous and unknown.’
Much squealing & condemnation of Obama from the predictable quarters of partisan media arsehats. But, as splatter has already noted, Russia won’t give up such a strategically vital bit of territory; and noone can, or will, make them.
Obama’s hands are tied & platitudes are to be expected.
Just keep in mind that Putin is the leftist…& Obama is the leftist too…both of them are copying Hitler who was A studied the leftist.
Sooooooooooooooo ……………………………..Hitler was a Leftie
A national socialist.
“While the US is threatening Russia with economic and diplomatic sanctions, Germany’s foreign minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier has undermined a US push for the cancellation of the G8 summit set for Sochi in June.
Mr Steinmeier told German radio, “The format of the G8 is actually the only one in which we, the West, can speak directly with Russia.”
Germany is heavily dependent on Russia for its natural gas needs and is the biggest export market for Russia’s state-controlled gas producer Gazprom.”
Putin said he wants to remain in the circle of world leaders and presumably he will get China’s support.
National Socialist…to be taken as literally as People’s Democratic Republic of North Korea. 🙄
It was a time of chaos in the 1920s, there were running street fights between different groupings and they swapped sides occasionally. Its hard to visualise the ferment at this distance, the anger at losing the war and the huge debt burden imposed by the victors.
Hitler rose to prominence in the beer halls because he had a louder voice, but like the rest of his cronies he blamed the jews and their perceived association with the socialists for the loss of the war.
———-
‘Zhao Huirong, a researcher of Central Asian studies with the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, said there is little chance that the West would get involved in a direct confrontation with Russia as Ukraine means less to the West than it does to Russia.
“Ukraine is almost a red line for Russia because of its strategic location and Moscow’s security interests there, while for the West, Ukraine mostly is leverage to contain Russia,” she said. “Plus, the West is facing many thorny problems at home.”
“It is difficult for Russia to reverse the trend in Ukraine. … But the future of Ukraine still depends on what kind of compromise the global powers, especially Russia and the United States, will reach.”
China Daily
National Socialist…to be taken literally.
I expect that the abbott has already offered the services of australia in whatever capacity the US requires of us. Goes without saying really, no need to bother the citizens about it. Do you think the abbott sees himself as a war PM? 😉
…to be taken literally by those prone to falling for opportunist misnomers.
Another dipshit tries earnestly to make it all about Obama & Teh Leftists.
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/obama_should_apologise_to_romney_and_the_us_public_over_ukraine/
Still..even with this type of polemic frotteurism under his belt, Bolt doesn’t go out of his way to join the US Conservative campaign to rebadge Hitler as Teh Leftist!!! …not that I recall, anyhow.
Still waiting for your references showing that Nazi(i)sm did not grow out of the socialist movements which prevailed in Germany at the time. (I’ve already given mine, which say it did.)
Dan Hannan understands the sibling rivalry between socialist sects:
Left and right, if they mean anything at all, are about economic differences. Both forms of socialism, communist and Nazi, support a high degree of state control of the economy – the very essence of socialism. Rightists prefer less government control of the economy. The differences between leftist sects are usually about how to control the economy.
Whatever the similarities between the “brotherhood” of extremists it is interesting the parallel of Hitler “rescuing” ethnic Germans from the Sudetenland etc during his “land grab” years leading upto the invasion of Poland and Putin’s annexation of Georgia ( Stalin’s place of birth) and the Crimea to protect ethnic Russians.
I think this whole problem will come down to threats to the supply of gas into the EU via the pipeline and the effect that has on influential Russian energy billionaires and whether they are facebook friends of Putin or not. Because he might find himself rapidly “defriended” by a few he really needs the support of
The energy threat also focuses the minds of the Europeans, which is why Germany seems reluctant to boycott the upcoming G8 meeting in Sochi.
It is pointless to assert that Nazis weren’t socialists because the Nazis and communists (after entering into a formal alliance) belatedly came to hate each other. That point is utterly irrelevant. By that score neither the Mensheviks nor the Trotskyists were socialists either.
Regardless of whether you believe the Nazis were socialists, the common factor which bound their authoritarianism with the leftist version is the need for greater government control to implement their economic agenda. Once a government assumes that much power, it is a short step to silencing critics and then persecuting them.
This is a question of degree. Free market governments and those with a Libertarian agenda are much less likely to aggregate power in the hands of a central government whereas leftists of any stripe just can’t help themselves. Underpants Conroy and Finkelfuckwit would have taken us down the path of press censorship if they had been able to get away with it.
Wish I could add more, but Splatter and Walrus pretty well covered everything perfectly.
‘TONY Abbott has cancelled a visit to Australia by Vladimir Putin’s chief national security adviser and former KGB colleague as Western allies vowed to punish Moscow over its military intervention in Ukraine’s Crimean region.
‘As Trade Minister Andrew Robb also cancelled a planned trade mission to Russia, the Prime Minister told parliament the Russian ambassador had been called in to the Department of Foreign Affairs yesterday morning “to be told in no uncertain terms of what Australia thinks about this aggression against an independent country”.
Owens and Solomon / Oz
‘Many Russia-watchers suspect a number of those who appear to be Ukraine’s most extreme nationalist protesters are working for the Kremlin.
‘For while it is true a handful of those who manned the barricades in Kiev were genuine extremists with neo-Nazi links, a whiff of fascism hanging over Ukraine’s new government suits the Russian propaganda machine all too well.’
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2572613/EDWARD-LUCAS-Appease-Putin-I-really-fear-stumble-war.html#ixzz2uxMcjZDf
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
I don’t know how this helps matters. I suppose Australia has to play its part as a supporter of the West.
Russia taking Crimea is the obvious and logical outcome. Not pretty, but not a total disaster. It will be much worse for the people of the Ukraine if Russia goes further and excises more of the country. Russia may well follow through on democratically elected President Yanukovych’s request for support to restore order after he was driven from office by mob riots.
Putin has played this well, co-opting China to his cause. For all the America haters, this is but a foretaste of the new world order with the US in decline.
Russia warns ‘surrender today or we will attack’…
http://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/russia-warns-surrender-today-or-we-will-attack-30058970.html
Regardless of whether you believe the Nazis were socialists, the common factor which bound their authoritarianism with the leftist version is the need for greater government control to implement their economic agenda. Once a government assumes that much power, it is a short step to silencing critics and then persecuting them.
Isn’t that what happens to us now sb? We have government control over everything. Every few years it changes from one team to the other but essentially we live under the dictate of our supposedly democratic government to do just as they please while in office.
…‘TONY Abbott has cancelled a visit to Australia by Vladimir Putin’s chief national security adviser’…
“…As Trade Minister Andrew Robb also cancelled a planned trade mission to Russia,…
tony abbott’s local audience version of “all the way with the USA” as if Russia cares what he says and does.
meanwhile we have our own state sanctioned murder and violence
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-04/g4s-employee-contradicts-png-police-report-into-manus-riot/5295740
“Isn’t that what happens to us now sb? We have government control over everything.”
We probably have too much government control now. The point is stop it getting worse. And yes big government conservatives are just as bad on this front. The fatal conceit is that government can solve all problems.
‘tony abbott’s local audience version’
Yes and it would also be Shorten’s stand if he was PM, the US alliance remains a bipartisan agreement.
‘…we live under the dictate of our supposedly democratic government to do just as they please while in office.’
The beauty of a genuine democracy is that we can throw the buggers out after one term, so the government of the day sways to the will of the people to stay in power. Labor might still be in power if they hadn’t gone to bed with the Greens.
so the government of the day sways to the will of the people to stay in power.
no, the people sway to the will of the government. There is no choice when both offer more of the same and the electoral system disproportionately favours two parties of identical policies. The system operates automatically and would hum along quite well without any government at all.
‘the electoral system disproportionately favours two parties of identical policies.’
Its amazingly stable.
‘the electoral system disproportionately favours two parties of identical policies.’
Yes thankfully its usually quite successful (it failed only in 2010) at “disenfranchising” the minority extremists of the Right and the Left.
Overall it is very well designed and caters to most tastes
I guess you could form a view of duopoly, collusion and manipulation as ‘stable’
“Overall it is very well designed and caters to most tastes”
Most tastes, really….?
“Most tastes, really….?”
Yes……Ever since childhood……..I never did like my “Greens”
There is no limit on the number of parties who could put their policies to the electorate and it is pointless for parties with extremist policies to deride the ‘duopoly’. In effect they are whining because most people reject their weirdo policies.
If a party wishes to win government it puts up policies it thinks will appeal to a majority of voters. Logically you would expect a fair amount of overlap between such parties.
Other parties may wish to put forward a less popular agenda notwithstanding that their views appeal to a minority of voters. Those parties cannot hope to be elected to government nor should they be. Their strategy is to publicise their pet causes and, in the case of the relatively larger minor parties, hope to be in a balance of power situation.
In 2010 the Greens and independents were able to use their positions to gain disproportionate influence over the Labor party, which needed them to form government. The result was an astonishingly unpopular government.
Fuck it Off with his head
‘I guess you could form a view of duopoly, collusion and manipulation as ‘stable’
Its still better than the one party state.
Its still better than the one party state.
In reality it is a one party state, think about it, if they both offer the same policies, which they do [with a small variation around the margins] it effectively is a one party state and no real choice for the voters [that is why there is so much dissatisfaction].
Other parties may wish to put forward a less popular agenda notwithstanding that their views appeal to a minority of voters. Those parties cannot hope to be elected to government nor should they be.
Actually they do, in the case of the extremist libertarians and teabaggers who have infiltrated the conservative parties [in the US and Australia] they do get elected to government and do influence policy.
And nobody votes for corporate rule, but that’s what we get from both major parties.
“no real choice for the voters”
The voters are spoiled for choice. And they choose to ignore the extremists (who then whine about the lack of choice, the duopoly etc). Sadly some loons do get through in the Senate. Which is precisely why proportional representation will never be imposed on the lower house.
“And nobody votes for corporate rule, but that’s what we get from both major parties.”
Unions are corporates??
‘no real choice for the voters [that is why there is so much dissatisfaction].’
As Splatter and Walrus have so eloquently pointed out, there was a lot of political instability during Julia’s reign because she formed a minority government and produced extremist policy on the run.
The aim of Abbott is to eliminate division and get reelected, no easy task.
Unions are corporates??
The unions and labor have embraced neoliberal economics just as much as the lnp coalition and business. Worker capitalists abound.
The aim of Abbott is to eliminate division and get reelected, no easy task.
especially as he’s the least popular leader ever to be elected and he epitomises division personally and in his politics and policies.
Abbott teh leftist appropriated his quasi-socialist PPL scheme from Mein Kampf.
‘he’s the least popular leader ever to be elected’
Do you have a link to back up that assertion?
More importantly, Plibersek is being groomed to become the new Labor leader after Bill falls on his sword.
‘DEPUTY Labor leader Tanya Plibersek has sent a letter to all Coalition MPs imploring them to co-sponsor a bill to allow gay marriage and lobby for their party to allow a conscience vote.
‘The letter, obtained by The Australian, follows a decision by the Labor caucus to support Ms Plibersek’s fresh attempt to change the law.’
Karvalas / Oz
Abbott does appear to be the most unpopular leader in a quarter of a century.
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2014/02/21/14/50/abbott-least-popular-pm-in-25-years-poll
Billy McMahon was more unpopular that Keating or Gillard.
“…..Abbott teh leftist appropriated his quasi-socialist PPL scheme………..”
But………..but……………..but……………….now I’m terribly confused as most extremists refer to him as a Nazi and you refer to him as a Leftist…………………………..
Hitler was a Commo…………………………….!
🙂
Qualification: I’m not refering to you as an Extremist………….No………..no………….no……………..no………sireee
‘As the rouble plunged and Russian stock markets crashed Monday amid fears of war, traders on the streets of Moscow were running out of foreign currency.
“There were enormous queues Monday after Putin announced there might be war with Ukraine,” said Benjamin, who was working at an exchange point and declined to give his surname. “We have no euros and only a few dollars.” The value of the Russian rouble, which has dropped steadily this year, fell sharply Monday to historic lows.’
UK Tele
realpolitik at work…not some pantomime between the (spectral & vaguely definable) Left & Right…
Perhaps realpolitik with a particular philosophical agenda:
Don’t worry, help is on the way, the problem has been solved.
http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/latest/a/21822844/to-russia-with-love-rudd/
“Former prime minister Kevin Rudd has dispatched himself on a one-man peace mission to Moscow as all-out war looms between Russia and Ukraine.
The West Australian can reveal that Mr Rudd arrived in the Russian capital on Monday with plans to meet Russian President Vladimir Putin’s top advisers.”
Neil, that is a piss-take, right?
No doubt he’ll be as popular and diplomatic in Moscoaw as he was at Copenhagen
We can all sleep better now that Rudd is there to solve the problem. I am sure Putin cannot wait to meet him.
“I’m Kevin I’m from Queensland and I’m here to help.”
He’ll probably have some meetings in one of these places.
sb @ 9:02
putin = abbott
I have it on good authority Captain Krudd is the new Organist in Pussy Riot and he will be joining tjem for a tour of Russian Strip clubs.
I do find it quite unsatisfactory that Putin puts girls in gaol for singing some protest songs in a church.
Add to that the anti-homosexual rights regime, it has all the makings of (religious) fundamentalism without the tell tale headgear.
————-
(Go Kev!)
Putin’s religious conservatism, his anti-gay stances & his nationalistic exceptionalist tendencies mean he is a teh leftist. Much like Hitler, sage of communism.
On rumour of war its a good time to buy.
“You’re going to invest your money in something over time. The one thing you can be quite sure of is if we went into some kind of very major war, the value of money would go down. That’s happened in virtually every war I’m aware of. The last thing you’d want to do is hold money during a war. You might want to own a farm, you might want to own an apartment house, you might want to own securities. During World War II the stock market advanced.”
Warren Buffett
Putin’s religious conservatism, his anti-gay stances & his nationalistic exceptionalist tendencies mean he is a teh leftist. Much like Hitler, sage of communism.
Abbott and his party espouse the same views, they must all be of teh left just like hitler and putin.
A couple of statesmen!
The Crimea area of the Ukraine is the site of a big chunk of the Russian Navy.
Russian nuke facilities and Chernobyl are also in Ukraine.
Vlad has the responsibility of Navy security and Nuke security, and duty of care to their staff. Vlad can`t just walk away from this situation. Which of course isn`t being told at all in out teabag-media.
#PantyWetting
Ukraine is a low priority for the US. John Kerry has directed US envoys to focus on something much more important!
Exactly what, apart from a bit of rhetorical condemnation of Red (guffaw) Putin, are they supposed to (realistically) do to change the situation in Ukraine?
Am I to assume that, if the Right was currently in power in the US, sabre rattling & nuclear brinkmanship would be the sensible approach?
ala Sarah Moron’s interjections into foreign policy…
http://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/sarah-palins-advice-to-barack-obama-stop-putin-with-nukes/story-fnh81jut-1226849448434
““Mr President, the only thing that stops a bad guy with a nuke is a good guy with a nuke.”
Because, of course, it would be perfectly acceptable for Russia to threaten the US with nuclear reprisal if say the US was gonna annex Diego Garcia or Guam to protect its strategic interests.
American Exceptionalism…it fucks itself in the hypocrisy hole at every turn.
* Obama is already ‘President’ of Guam, of course, but just suppose the natives decided they’d rather be independent or under Chinese rule.
””””’American Exceptionalism, it fucks itself in the hypocrisy hole at every turn.”””’
` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 ` 😆 doesn`t it always
teh-usa can`t fcuk with Vlad anyway, teh-usa selects candidates that are largely soft-cocks, that their masters can control, while they can be ruthless to the weak, even their own weak, they are NOT true tough-guys,
unlike the spook/military trained Vlad, who probably has `solved` problems in the past, Vlad is an actual tough-guy, you may recall how nervous Dubya looked when meeting with Vlad, after teh-usa struck the Kirsk(submarine),
Dubya had to forgive billions in loans, and write even more `loans`. You can bet, behind the scenes, Vlad was promising to `deal` with teh-usa/dubya for sinking the Kirsk.
Vladimir is indeed ‘The Real Deal’.
Glad as fuck that I don’t have to live under his stranglehold on power.
US politicians who ascend to the same heights as Putin do so with the backing of corporate wealth, PR machinery & ideological thinktanking. None of them came up through the KGB.
They are definitely cheap imitations of ‘strong
tyrantsleaders’.“Exactly what, apart from a bit of rhetorical condemnation of Red (guffaw) Putin, are they supposed to (realistically) do to change the situation in Ukraine?”
As I noted earlier, there is not now much use flexing and threatening armed intervention. The negotiations should have happened much earlier. Nevertheless, the US should prioritise negotiations on Ukraine and try to get the most democratic outcome available. Instead Kerry has other (utterly useless) priorities.
Obama has moved the US on from Kennedy’s approach of speaking softly while carrying a big stick to carrying a limp stick and talking platitudes. Much as the left may love this approach, the current crisis demonstrates the palpable stupidity of soft diplomacy against the likes of Russia and China. Soft diplomacy was never more than a leftist wet dream. The sort of stupidity that sees a thousand or so people drowning at sea while the moralising leftists feel virtuous and superior.
Obama has moved the US on from Kennedy’s approach of speaking softly while carrying a big stick to carrying a limp stick and talking platitudes.
If you look carefully, beyond the sweet words and into the actions, obama’s administration has changed little when it comes to US defence, foreign policy and warmongering. There is no softly, softly approach, the beast must always be fed.
‘carrying a limp stick and talking platitudes.’
That’s about the size of it, summed up perfectly.
“There is no softly, softly approach, the beast must always be fed.”
History is very clear on this – great civilisations are overrun by barbarians when they lose the ability or the will to defend themselves. Obama never had the will and is doing his level best to diminish the US’s ability to defend itself with his recent military cuts and his administration’s insane rumblings about unionising the military. You only need look to the Australian union movement’s history of treason to know where that will lead.
Sadly you may get your wish and live in a world dominated by the likes of Russia or China (not to mention Iran) where there is no credible threat of Western military retaliation. I hope you are ready to feed those beasts.
Kennedy really knew how to train Cubans and SS armed guards.
Vladimir is indeed ‘The Real Deal’.
Glad as fuck that I don’t have to live under his stranglehold on power.
US politicians who ascend to the same heights as Putin do so with the backing of corporate wealth, PR machinery & ideological thinktanking. None of them came up through the KGB.
They are definitely cheap imitations of ‘strong
tyrantsleaders’.US Hawks are only playing to their base. The type of people easily impressed by sabre rattling & numbskull nuclear platitudes from the likes of Sarah Palin & Co.
Unlike the US, you’ll rarely see China or Russia invading or occupying beyond their immediate borders…& I’m supposed to yearn for Uncle Sam’s role as World Police in perpetuity; GMAFB! 🙄
As for Iran, well, as I’ve said many times before here…the West is reaping what it sewed through airs of Imperial Interference half a century ago there.
l find the tough-talk `language` teh-west use when they flap-on about Korea, lran, or Vlad quite amusing. All the tough-talk does is make`em look stupid, teh-west can`t even stand-up to lsrael.
With Iran, the West is reaping what it sowed by not invading the country when it seized American hostages.
🙄
Yeah…invading non-compliant countries who behave contrary to Western interests has worked out so well for all involved.
You can’t subjugate entire populations. It just won’t work.
Perhaps they shouldn’t have interfered in the democratically elected government of Mossadegh, leading to the brutal reign of Shah Reza (The Western installed puppet) which in turn gave succour to what became (to the population) the more preferred (at the time) Islamic Revolution & the rise of the Mullahs in power? Mossadegh’s government was democratic, secular & only provoked the rancour of the West by not acceding to the Imperial extortions of British Petroleum.
“You can’t subjugate entire populations.”
The current regime is trying to do that at the moment. You are conflating the terrorist regime with the people.
The idiot leftist Carter stood back while a US ally was overthrown, basically because Khomeni allied with some leftists who joined his revolution. One of them even became president for a short while. Then they were all killed. No doubt Obama would have done the same thing. In fact he has done worse. And the Iranian leaders can hardly contain their mirth, already mocking him for being such a fool. His arrangement with Iran is a real “peace in our time” moment.
No acknowledgement of arrogant Western interference precipitating the timeline then. Not the first time I’ve struck that phenomenon, unsurprisingly.
GUFFAW!…of course! it was more leftist evil at work!
Because extreme RELIGIOUS conservatism is the very epitome of leftist thinking! 🙄
“No acknowledgement of arrogant Western interference precipitating the timeline then.”
“Precipitating” is where you have lost me. The current regime is not interested in democracy, so that can’t be it. They are interested in spreading their shi’iteful religion by war and terror, but you can’ pin that on the Yanks, so I guess the fact that the recent rise of Iran is part of a millennium old struggle within Islam will be swept under the carpet.
“Because extreme RELIGIOUS conservatism is the very epitome of leftist thinking!”
Exactly – who are the biggest supporters of the Islamist movements today? Not conservatives that is for sure. More like Obama. And virtually all of the Middle Eastern “scholars” teaching in universities today. Why do you think the feminists are so supine when it comes to the treatment of women in Islam? The number of leftists speaking out against the evils of Islamic regimes is minuscule. The left mostly spends its time labeling critics of these vile religious belief systems as Islamophobes and lobbying for laws that will shut the critics up.
Maybe you need to look back half a century to comprehend my comments.
Cause & effect.
When Hilary Clinton spoke to the families of the Americans killed in Beghazi she brazenly lied when she blamed their deaths on a US video, but accurately promised that the producer of the offending video would be locked up. She is just another contemptible leftist with too much power and too little integrity.
Leftist, my arse.
Anyone who’s not a Republican seems to be a ‘leftist’ these days. Probably a socialist/communist too by that measure.
What crap.
“Cause & effect.”
You haven’t demonstrated that by a long shot. No doubt it added to popular unrest, but that does not explain Iran’s descent into theocracy or the reasons it is an exporter of terror. Maybe you need to look back 1400 years to understand Iran’s recent rise to power and its regional and global ambitions.
Iran initiated the Lockerbie disaster, it was an eye for an eye.
None so fucking blind…
They felt justified.
””’Iran initiated the Lockerbie disaster”””
Fascinating, in the realm of makin`shit up.
Saber rattling and extortion was directed at Gaddaffi and Libya for Lockerbie, and as an excuse for Dubya to demand Libya disarming. Lock-steppers should note that since Libya has disarmed and Gadaffi sold out to teh-west/teh-usa, the place seems to have become more Afghan-like, as far as `law-less` and `training-grounds` are concerned.
That`s an interesting round of Lock-splattering. Ya`whole argument jumps all over the place,
”””’the West is reaping what it sowed by not invading the country when it seized American hostages””'(teh-usa embassy 1970`s).?
”’No acknowledgement of arrogant Western interference precipitating the timeline then.”’
”””””’Precipitating” is where you have lost me”””””’
#precipitating=before/earlier
.
””the democratically elected government of Mossadegh, leading to the brutal reign of Shah Reza (The Western installed puppet)””
#which basically caused lranians to revolt and capture teh-use embassy, but l don`t remember them claiming to be `leftists`, (which seems to be more of a concoction of teh-west anyway, the middle-east and north africa seem to have many, many ethnic groups and don`t seem to reduce everything down to a left/right goose-step from the foreign news l`ve seen)
Iran initiated the Lockerbie disaster after the US mistakenly shot down a one of their civil aircraft six months earlier.
“precipitating=before/earlier”
Really?
Once you’ve mastered the English language, use your newfound skills to read up on the relevant history.
ya`google link went nowhere splatter,
l thought dunny was meaning this,
Adj. 1. precipitating – bringing on suddenly or abruptly; “the completion of the railroad was the precipitating cause in the extinction of waterborne commerce”
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/precipitating
#bottom of page
precipitate/ing is a bit of a cnut of a word, splatter, many uses,
precipitating=raining,
precipitate, from a foundry, also known as `slag`
#but at the end of the day, punctuation police and spellcheck trolls are a bit lame, Yes. l know. 🙂
My link (which works on my browser) went to “precipitate verb prɪˈsɪpɪteɪt/- to cause (an event or situation, typically one that is undesirable) to happen suddenly, unexpectedly, or prematurely.”
Either way precipitate entails an element of causation totally lacking from your suggestion.
My point is that it suits some to tritely point to the overthrow of Mosaddegh as the sole or main cause of the revolution. That is a slogan not an argument.
”””’shot down a one of their civil aircraft”””
l am well aware teh-usa negligently and recklessly shot down a commercial aircraft that was flying out of lran and into one of the neighboring countries. This is, yet again, another example of teh-usa going out of its way to make a nuisance and bully of itself in other peoples part of the world.
Lockerby was blamed on Libya/Gadaffi and extorted for compensation.
`lran initiated`.?
prove it, while at the same time proving Libya correct, and teh-west falsified Lockerby investigation, as Libya has always claimed
”””element of causation”””agree
I thought Putin was a 21st century Neville Chamberlain. Perhaps Putin will even deny him the opportunity of claiming to have achieved peace in or time:
sreb, great post … again …
Left and right, if they mean anything at all, are about economic differences.
Nazi’s firmly believe(d) in a dog … as did that dickhead Churchill … so dog must have been on the side of the right … so to speak … not about economics – about control!
Quite frankly I despise them all … including the present, extreme, right wing government of Australia
I think this whole problem will come down to threats to the supply of gas into the EU via the pipeline and the effect that has on influential Russian energy billionaires and whether they are facebook friends of Putin or not.
The crux of the matter, Wally!
You’ve been around here for a while … do you recall my comments re Putin being a very dangerous man to watch over the years … ? Well here it is …
It is pointless to assert that Nazis weren’t socialists because the Nazis and communists (after entering into a formal alliance) belatedly came to hate each other. That point is utterly irrelevant. By that score neither the Mensheviks nor the Trotskyists were socialists either.
Quite frankly – WGAF … the only “relevance” is that Putin is a dictator at heart and playing the “democracy” game in the 21st Century … eg president – PM – president – PM, ad nauseam … ’tis all about power …
… that’s why we prefer ballots to bullets here, to settle our political differences … Putin don’t care … funny how Russia has naval bases in Syria AND Crimea …
Leftist, my arse.
Anyone who’s not a Republican seems to be a ‘leftist’ these days. Probably a socialist/communist too by that measure.
What crap.
Hear! Hear! I see an “obsession” here … living in the 1940’s/50’s …
With regard to “precipitating” – the colonial Poms were the “expert” twits in drawing stupid lines on a map in the sand, ignoring centuries of tradition and history – dog forbid you try that with the Pommies and their history and traditions … more hypocrites …
Try this potted history to understand “precipitating” in the Middle East …
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Middle_East#New_states_post-World_War_II
My advice – see the 82nd Airborne patch anywhere near the Ukraine … and duck for cover …
We’ll have a contingency plan in place, will you? ICBM’s can reach every city in the world …
We seem to generate a dickhead who wants to rule the world every generation!
Nostradamus tells us this Pope is the last – following a massive “conflagration” … then the golden age as the bear (Russia) lies down with the eagle (USA) …