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Medicare: Why You Can Trust Tony Abbott

January 15, 2015

tumblr_n5k001UjSl1s8c58yo1_500

A mere 12 months ago, Tony Abbott declared that his government would be “the best friend Medicare has ever had.”

It was a commitment he also guaranteed on national television as part of his final appeal to voters to elect an Abbott government on the pledge that there would be “no cuts to education, no cuts to health, no change to pensions, no change to the GST and no cuts to the ABC or SBS” under the Coalition.

In his defence, Mr Abbott has previously assured “all of Australia” that he can’t be trusted to tell the truth when his lips are moving, so if Australians insist on some sort of indication that he intends to honour his commitments, then well, we really ought to get it writing.

And by Abbott’s own admission, if we don’t get it in writing well then we’ve really only got ourselves to blame.

So understandably, voters might reasonably regard his verbal assurances that he would be “Medicare’s best friend,” and that there would be “no cuts to health care,” with a degree of scepticism – an indication in itself of how low politics has sunk in this country.

However when you stand in front of a fucken great big billboard with that commitment emblazoned all over it, accompanied by your personal signature as a “written guarantee,” and be proudly photographed by the media, then I think you can reasonably expect to cop some flack for breaking that commitment.

Only yesterday Tony Abbott was explaining why the Medicare rebate cut was necessary, but today he has ditched the unpopular proposal.

Now look, I can understand that some opponents of the Abbott government may look at this recent decision as a “policy backflip,” but as the government rightly states, it’s purely the result of what it calls a “mis-information campaign.”

You see, it’s not the fact that people have mistakenly reached the conclusion that they’re going to be worse off under the scheme,  it’s the fact that they haven’t realised that this is a “good thing.”

In fact, all you left wing cynics will probably argue that this latest decision is some sort of indication that the Abbott government is completely incompetent and an utter shambles, but the reality is this couldn’t be further from the truth.

When you look at the facts and ignore the hysteria emanating from the ranks of the Left, you will see that Mr Abbott is actually living up to his original commitment.  “There will be no changes to Medicare,” and he’s lived up to that commitment on several occasions now – once when he dumped plans to introduce a $7 co-payment, again when he dumped plans to change it to $5, and a third time when he dumped plans to make it $20.

How much more evidence do you people want that this is an honest and competent government…??

 

 

 

 

 

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358 Comments leave one →
  1. January 15, 2015 2:50 pm

  2. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 3:31 pm

    Why You Can Trust Tony Abbott

    Volume 12
    Chapter 5
    Part 3
    Section (c)
    (first revision)

    However when you stand in front of a fucken great big billboard with that commitment emblazoned all over it, accompanied by your personal signature as a “written guarantee,” and be proudly photographed by the media, then I think you can reasonably expect to cop some flack for breaking that commitment.

    Actually, I’m pretty sure that’s photoshopped reb. Although, in todays parlance, it is probably more honest than the real thing 😉

    How much more evidence do you people want that this is an honest and competent government…??

    And the worse part is, he keeps blaming the Senate for keeping him honest. Nioce one reb 🙂

  3. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 3:41 pm

    And, hopefully the Senate makes this explanation redundant, but, it is also needed that the grubmints desires are telgraphed as well.

    New “GP Fee” Explained

    which came from here

    http://senatorlambie.com.au/2015/01/thank-helping-australians-get-access-medical-care/

    It appears that Senator Lambie is maturing into her role (perhaps)

  4. January 15, 2015 4:35 pm

    “New “GP Fee” Explained”

    Would you believe that’s my GO in that video!

    Very surprisement!

  5. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 4:43 pm

    Would you believe that’s my GO in that video!

    Does that mean you might be running into Senator Lambie getting your flu shot this year reb 😉

    She was looking for a man, rich ‘n well hung. After that, she didn’t elaborate, so I guess the field is open to all cummers 🙂

  6. January 15, 2015 4:52 pm

    I did of course mean “”GP”” not “”GO””…

  7. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 5:21 pm

    I was going to ask, then saw where the O was located on the keyboard 😉

  8. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 6:40 pm

    And, hopefully the Senate makes this explanation redundant

    And I just realised how redundant that comment was :facepalm:

  9. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 15, 2015 7:35 pm

    They must be in a state of chaos to have 3 versions of an unimplemented policy then completely back down.

    Incompetent dills.

    (though I still think most people should make a payment contribution to see a GP, subject to an income test)

  10. Tom R permalink
    January 15, 2015 7:39 pm

    subject to an income test

    As I said earlier (actually, quite a while ago), I still cannot believe that some Drs Bulk Bill everyone. In our area, only those who are on Benefits(?) or kids are bulk-billed.

    Legislating that would be a fairer way of going imo

  11. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 15, 2015 8:54 pm

    ..I was going to ask, then saw where the O was located on the keyboard 😉

    I wondered what reb was going on about and what a GO was, pleased it’s been explained. He seems a nice doc, I liked the next vid where he wishes his friends a happy xmas and tells everyone he’s had a ‘fkn huge year’

    The govt backed down real quick once the AMA started a media campaign, did you see kerryn phelps?

    Glad they are the gatekeepers still and have declared medicare must be kept [such as it is].

    What a betrayal of national trust it would have been to have kept that legislation, something like that should be put to the voters pre-election [he did the opposite, he lied about no changes] gillard’s lie pales by comparison to this mob’s rampant deceits. What’s next on the IPA’s list?

  12. TB Queensland permalink
    January 15, 2015 9:04 pm

    (though I still think most people should make a payment contribution to see a GP, subject to an income test)

    That would make you an incompetent dill too then ToM … ??????

    Just sayin’ … 🙂

  13. January 15, 2015 11:02 pm

    ”””””'(though I still think most people should make a payment contribution to see a GP,””””

    #at least your short-sightedness is consistent and makes me giggle yomm

  14. Tom R permalink
    January 16, 2015 8:21 am

    We await with mounting trepidation just what the next volley in the ideological barrage on medicare will be

    But she said the Government remained committed to a GP co-payment as a price signal in the health system.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-15/medicare-government-shelves-propsosed-rebate-cut-changes/6018990

    “For we know that deep in the dark hearts of these poisoned ideological buscuits lie the politics of envy. Whenever someone in need gets something for nothing, it is a dollar that cannot be used to subsidise a mine or a magnate. And a money fairy dies.”

  15. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 16, 2015 9:32 am

  16. Tom R permalink
    January 16, 2015 9:43 am

    Medicare delivers one of the most cost effective health systems in the world

    That is where Labor needs to focus their attention AO. show the data that compares medicare type systems against private run ones like America.

    America spend the most of almost any country per capita, yet have a relatively low outcome for the money spent. Those with Universal health care consistently get the biggest “bang for the buck”

    And yet this mob are pushing for an American style system 😯

    I boggles the mind relly

  17. January 16, 2015 9:46 am

  18. January 16, 2015 9:48 am

    I see your Health Care comparison graph Tom and raise you this one:

  19. Tom R permalink
    January 16, 2015 9:51 am

    lol reb

    I see NZ there somewhere, I’m sure of it 🙂

  20. Tom R permalink
    January 16, 2015 10:30 am

  21. January 17, 2015 2:09 am

    ”””””Note: Medicare delivers one of the most cost effective health systems in the world. “Price signal” ideological code for dismantling it. (@PaulBongiorno)””””

    +

    #lt is interesting teabag-bongo is `clarifying` the teabags ideals so honestly armchair. Maybe the teabags are going too far for bongo.? He was always so pro-teabag on meet-teh-press, has bongo changed his spots.? Or does bongo just happen to approve of medicare and roam-free on this particular topic.?

  22. January 17, 2015 2:32 am

    ”””””””That is where Labor needs to focus their attention AO. show the data that compares medicare type systems against private run ones like America.””””

    +

    #Disagree TomR, the average punter is sick-to-death of data-dramas and will be rapidly turned-off anything that sounds or smells like `carbon-price` verses `carbon-tax` and will quickly change the channel or turn the page. l would suggest `KEEPING MEDICARE, NOT DESTROYING MEDICARE` would be much better, something easy to digest, with a small handful of TRUTHFUL examples and explainers. l`m not certain blib-shortman and teabag-lite could remain disciplined enough to pull this off tho.

  23. Tom R permalink
    January 17, 2015 2:18 pm

    the average punter is sick-to-death of data-dramas

    I AGREE. Although, at fault is the media’s propagation of irrational gibberish like “I see coloured packs” and the like, and presenting it as if it is relevant.

    No wonder the masses are punch drunk on numbers, they’ve been fed a diet of shit for so long it all looks the same to them now.

  24. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 3:45 pm

    ‘the average punter is sick-to-death of data-dramas’

    Only when its badly presented.

  25. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 4:25 pm

    …l would suggest `KEEPING MEDICARE, NOT DESTROYING MEDICARE` would be much better, something easy to digest, with a small handful of TRUTHFUL examples and explainers…

    Perhaps we can think of a three word slogan, something catchy that rhymes 🙂 And name abbott by association with his scheme, like they did with obamacare.

    ‘Say No to Abbottcare’

    ‘Medicare not Abbottcare’

    Only when its badly presented.

    Talking of data, I did say that 2014 would beat all.

    …Labor, Greens pressure Tony Abbott to act on climate change as 2014 named hottest year on record:
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-17/labor-greens-pressure-abbott-as-2014-named-hottest-on-record/6023162

    …The data from America’s space agency NASA shows that not only was 2014 the warmest year recorded since 1880, 10 of the hottest years on record have happened since 1998.

    Researchers said the long-term trend was being driven by human emissions of greenhouse gases, particularly the burning of fossil fuels…

  26. January 17, 2015 5:08 pm

    “Talking of data, I did say that 2014 would beat all.”

    Or not.

    “Numerically, our best estimate for the global temperature of 2014 puts it slightly above
    (by 0.01 C) that of the next warmest year (2010) but by much less than the margin of uncertainty (0.05 C). Therefore it is impossible to conclude from our analysis which of 2014, 2010, or 2005 was actually the warmest year.

    “The margin of uncertainty we achieved was remarkably small (0.05 C with 95% confidence). This was achieved, in part, by the inclusion of data from over 30,000 temperature stations, and by the use of optimized statistical methods. Even so, the highest year could not be distinguished. That is, of course, an indication that the Earth’s average temperature for the last decade has changed very little. Note that the ten warmest years all occur since 1998.”

    http://static.berkeleyearth.org/memos/Global-Warming-2014-Berkeley-Earth-Newsletter.pdf

    (For the record, I didn’t start the conversation on this ‘taboo’ topic.)

  27. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 5:39 pm

    ‘Researchers said the long-term trend …’

    That would be the 18 year plateau caused by natural variability. Also, I’m miffed that the cut- off date for data is 1880, there was this huge spike in temperatures at Nobby’s Head in the late 1870s.

    onova.s3.amazonaws.com/graphs/australia/nsw/newcastle-raw-temps.gif

  28. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 5:45 pm

  29. January 17, 2015 5:49 pm

    Dr David Whitehouse: ‘The addition of 2014 global temperature data confirms that the post-1997 standstill seen in global annual average surface temperature has continued for one more year making it now about 17 years in duration.

    ‘According to the Nasa global temperature database 2014 was technically a record “beating” 2010 by the small margin of 0.02 deg C. The NASA press release is highly misleading saying that 2014 is a record without giving the actual 2014 figure, or any other year, or its associated error.

    ‘In reality of course it is no record at all as the error of the measurements is about +/- 0.1 deg C showing NasaGiss’ statement to go against the normal treatment of observational data and its errors. Talk of a record is therefore scientifically and statistically meaningless.

    – See more at: http://www.thegwpf.com/2014-global-temperature-stalls-another-year/#sthash.bXA6lmre.dpuf

  30. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 6:03 pm

    hahaha, another one with that cherry picked 1998 graph. Just can’t get it through the little grey cells that weather does not equal climate.

    The deniers work hard to fool the easily fooled, why it’s almost an entire industry in itself!

    Try some real research, like Berkeley Earth

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/planet-oz/2014/aug/27/climate-sceptics-see-a-conspiracy-in-australias-record-breaking-heat

  31. January 17, 2015 6:13 pm

    “Try some real research, like Berkeley Earth”

    Heh.

    Berkeley Earth: “That is, of course, an indication that the Earth’s average temperature for the last decade has changed very little.”

    That is, Berkeley Earth acknowledges a ‘pause’, a ‘hiatus’, a ‘lack of warming’, for the past ten years. The models did not predict this.

    https://theguttertrash.com/2015/01/15/medicare-why-you-can-trust-tony-abbott/#comment-91419

  32. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:01 pm

    Why is it so hard for some?

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2015/jan/16/global-warming-made-2014-record-hot-year

    In fact, at any point over the past five decades we can find a period during which global surface warming “paused.” Yet each such period was hotter than the last.That’s because each is just a temporary effect caused by a period with a predominance of La Niña events and other short-term cooling temperature influences. As this figure shows (click here for an animated version), underneath the short-term noise, human-caused global warming continues unabated…

    …In short, global warming continues unabated, and claims of a “pause” are misguided. Because of human-caused global warming, average years today are hotter than El Niño years just a decade ago, and the Earth continues to accumulate immense amounts of heat. Despite short-term noise, that long-term trend will continue until we cut our carbon pollution and curb global warming…

  33. Tom R permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:20 pm

    Talk of a record is therefore scientifically and statistically meaningless.

    ROFL

    So, it can’t be the hottest, because 2010 might have been, but, 2010 can’t have been, because 2014 might have been.

    Oh, and egg

    fark off 🙂

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

    :clink: 😉

  34. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:22 pm

    Hmmm, as expected, no climate science quals, no peer reviewed papers, but is a board member of a denier organisation contributing to it’s ‘journal’

    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=David_Whitehouse

    David Whitehouse, who has no apparent expertise in climate science, serves on the Academic Advisory Committee for the contrarian Global Warming Policy Foundation.

    …And the use of the term “average” in Whitehouse’s statement was misleading, as the dataset referenced (CRU, through Oct 2010) actually shows every month in 2010 to be considerably warmer than the corresponding historic (1850+) average.[5] – a pattern evident visually in NASA’s GISS data.[6]. Whitehouse later explained (see Talk page) that he meant the “average” for just one decade – a timeframe statisticians consider too short to be meaningful[7] in seeing the underlying trend.[3]…

    http://www.desmogblog.com/david-whitehouse

    …According to Skeptical Science, as well as a search of Google Scholar, David Whitehouse has not published any peer-reviewed journals on the subject of climate change. [20]…

    [Sourcewatch] Global Warming Policy Foundation

    …Although founder Lawson claims to accept that anthropogenic global warming is occurring, this acceptance appears to be “considerably less than half-hearted;”[3] the GWPF webpage banner image sports a short-term (2001-2010) temperature graph (blue, below) giving the appearance that the world is not warming.

    …”900 papers” claim; subsequent analysis shows Exxon ties, Energy and Environment papers
    In mid-April 2011, the GWPF provided “900+ Peer-Reviewed Papers Supporting Skepticism Of “Man-Made” Global Warming (AGW) Alarm”.[19] The blog Carbon Brief analyzed them, and found that –

    9 of the top 10 authors had ties to ExxonMobil
    “prominent scientists featured on the list didn’t agree that their work supported skepticism about anthropogenic global warming – and had unsuccessfully asked for their work to be removed from similar lists in the past”, and
    the most-cited journal was Energy and Environment, a journal with a very low impact factor whose editors are AGW deniers.[20]…

  35. Tom R permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:22 pm

    Yes, but AO, that image has a Plateau. Obviously, that means …….. that 2014 carnt be the hottest ….. because garden fairies always end up with a unicorn :facepalm:

  36. Tom R permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:27 pm

    You don’t need scienty stuff to know that the sun is hot, and always has been, and is probably getting hotter or closer or bigger. And volcanoes explode into the sea, making it rise. And don’t forget, the weather has always changed, just like underpants do, and scientists are only in it for the free internet.

    I might sign up

    :clink:

  37. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:42 pm

    ‘In short, global warming continues unabated, and claims of a “pause” are misguided.’

    That is not true, 97% of scientists accept the plateau. Nobody knows for certain where it’s going from here, but my money is on the shiny orb as the main driver and global cooling should begin by 2019.

  38. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 7:44 pm

    Your apprenticeship at Deltoid was wasted.

  39. TB Queensland permalink
    January 17, 2015 8:14 pm

    Nobody knows for certain where it’s going from here …

    Probably the truest comment you’ve ever made, egg …

    But I can tell you that the WORLD would be better off with solar, hydro, wind, wave and any other energy source you can think of rather than coal …

  40. egg permalink
    January 17, 2015 8:28 pm

    Coal fired energy is cheap and clean (CO2 does not cause AGW) and we have an abundance of it. Better to exploit coal before fusion power becomes all the rage.

  41. TB Queensland permalink
    January 17, 2015 9:07 pm

    Better to exploit coal before fusion power becomes all the rage.

    Then you go and fk it up again …

  42. January 17, 2015 9:36 pm

    I drove past the open cut brown-coal mine in Traralgon today. (You can see it from the freeway. There’s a power station right alongside. Cheap, efficient, plentiful, almost beautiful in its simplicity. Burn coal to boil water to make steam to turn turbines to generate electricity.They say there is enough coal in the Latrobe valley to generate power for the next 500 years.

  43. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 9:36 pm

    Coal fired energy is cheap and clean (CO2 does not cause AGW) and we have an abundance of it. Better to exploit coal before fusion power becomes all the rage.

    tired of the lies now.

  44. January 17, 2015 9:45 pm

    Looks like they won’t be shutting down Loy Yang anytime soon:

    “In March 2010 it was announced that the operators of Loy Yang A (Loy Yang Power) signed a contract with Alcoa World Alumina and Chemicals Australia for the supply of electricity to power aluminium smelters at Portland and Point Henry until 2036.”

  45. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 17, 2015 9:54 pm

    Burn coal to boil water to make steam to turn turbines to generate electricity.They say there is enough coal in the Latrobe valley They say there is enough coal in the Latrobe valley to generate power for the next 500 years.

    Talk about living in fairyland.

    What gases are released when coal is burned?
    500 yrs?
    Keep burning coal, harming the environment and overpopulating the earth and humans will probably be close to extinction in 100 yrs, better start looking for a new planet to ruin.

  46. January 17, 2015 10:02 pm

    “better start looking for a new planet to ruin.”

    Some forward-thinkers are already working on that.

  47. public toilet permalink
    January 17, 2015 10:40 pm

    Heaven isn’t a new planet.

  48. egg permalink
    January 18, 2015 7:55 am

    ‘tired of the lies now.’

    You’re the one spreading them.

    ‘Keep burning coal, harming the environment and overpopulating the earth and humans will probably be close to extinction in 100 yrs, better start looking for a new planet to ruin.’

    As global cooling begins to bite and the planet slides into another Little Ice Age, it will be human induced CO2 keeping the planet green.

  49. January 18, 2015 10:11 am

    ”””’Although, at fault is the media’s propagation of irrational gibberish”””

    +

    ”””and presenting it as if it is relevant.”””’

    #agree TomR, it`s terrible that teabag-media merely accept crap-as-fact statements and regurgitate them unchallenged. Did you notice this week the Aust Burro of Surveys denied, doubted and was confused (yet-again) about its own un/employment numbers.? and teabag-media merely regurgitated them unchallenged again.?

    +

    ””like ”I see coloured packs””

    #To be fair that`s MY observation TomR, teabag-media couldn`t observe anything, they could be wading in colored packs up to their knees and not see them. (just like team-nanny-roxon)

  50. egg permalink
    January 18, 2015 10:15 am

    ‘Some forward-thinkers are already working on that.’

    The atmosphere of Mars is 95% CO2 and the race is on to introduce corrosive oxygen and make the place habitable.

  51. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 18, 2015 11:47 am

    …Some forward-thinkers are already working on that.

    And I would be the first one to say that the deniers and the polluters should be excluded or at the very bottom of the queue to get to it. Why let them carry on regardless and wreck another planet? I think they should stay here and go down with their ideology, bravely denying any climate change!
    Didn’t their parents ever tell them that they shouldn’t get new toys when they have not cared for the ones they already have. They shouldn’t be rewarded for ruining the planet that sustains the lives of all of us.

  52. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 18, 2015 11:54 am

    Heaven isn’t a new planet.

    😆 😆 😆

  53. egg permalink
    January 18, 2015 11:59 am

    Terraforming Venus would be like going to heaven, floating above the hell below.

    ‘Cooling could also be affected by placing reflectors in the atmosphere or on the surface. Reflective balloons floating in the upper atmosphere could create shade. The number and/or size of the balloons would necessarily be great.

    ‘Geoffrey A. Landis has suggested that if enough floating cities were built, they could form a solar shield around the planet, and could simultaneously be used to process the atmosphere into a more desirable form, thus combining the solar shield theory and the atmospheric processing theory with a scalable technology that would immediately provide living space in the Venusian atmosphere.’

    wiki

  54. egg permalink
    January 18, 2015 2:59 pm

    I’ think they should stay here and go down with their ideology, bravely denying any climate change!’

    We only deny man made global warming.

    Going back to your escalator graph, I’m prepared to concede it maybe a typical break point and that warming might take off again in a decade. We simply don’t know, all the models got it wrong so we are flying blind.

  55. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 18, 2015 3:44 pm

    …We only deny man made global warming.
    I’m prepared to concede it maybe a typical break point and that warming might take off again in a decade…

    A bet each way now? No, I’m holding you to the straight out denial that you’ve been obsessively stalking this blog about for years. Don’t you ‘concede’ anything, don’t do anything at all, because the little you ever will do will be too little, too late.

    We simply don’t know, all the models got it wrong so we are flying blind.

    🙄 rubbish

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-01-22/jericho-wasting-energy-on-climate-change-sceptics/5211098

    Wasting energy on climate change sceptics:

    …But no. We all know that won’t sway the “sceptical”.

    Far better instead to talk about how he really does “believe in climate change” (natural change that is).

    The deniers of the science always like to suggest the issue of climate change is too much like a religion – that it’s all about “belief”. In reality, they are the one most linking religion to the debate – usually by suggesting their opponents are “zealots”…

    …But no. We clearly need to wait another 20 years before we do anything – just to be sure. And best of all for those who think such things, if they’re wrong it’ll be too late to do anything anyway. At this point they might blame climate scientists and politicians for not being forceful enough in their advocacy.

    But more likely they’ll just say it’s all due to other factors – the sun perhaps – and then they’ll note that anyway it’s too early to tell, after all back in the 1970s all scientists thought the world was cooling…

  56. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 18, 2015 5:17 pm

    Not that you’ll take any notice, for you it’s eyes glued shut. Your ‘beliefs’ have been answered many times.

    The top ten global warming ‘skeptic’ arguments answered:

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2014/may/06/top-ten-global-warming-skeptic-arguments-debunked

    …The IPCC stated with 95% confidence that most of the global warming since 1950 is human-caused, with a best estimate that 100% is due to humans over the past 60 years. The IPCC was able to draw this conclusion with such high confidence because that’s what the scientific evidence and research clearly and consistently concludes…

    Don’t you worry though, marohasy or jonova the servants of mining millionaire funding and global conspiracy theorists say it’s flawed, but peer review, the bedrock of scientific inquiry, well they wouldn’t know it if they fell over it! Better to write your own articles for your own mining funded think tank/ journal.

    http://scienceblogs.com/stoat/2014/01/20/peer-review/

    http://www.readfearn.com/tag/jennifer-marohasy/

    …As I’ve explained before, Marohasy is a former free market think tank researcher who is now at Central Queensland University with her work paid for by the foundation of a climate science sceptic.
    None of the claims made by Marohasy have been published in a peer reviewed journal, despite the fact that since January she has found time to write repeatedly to government ministers, has spoken at the Sydney Institute and flown to a conference for climate sceptics in Las Vegas – all the while making the same accusations…

  57. January 18, 2015 6:03 pm

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/health-minister-sussan-ley-backs-away-from-plan-to-cut-medicare-rebate-20150115-12qp0n.html

    The no surprise government surprises its own ministers and is essentially dead in the water..

  58. Tom R permalink
    January 18, 2015 6:20 pm

    The no surprise government surprises its own ministers

    It’s glorious waching all the tools blame each other, and leak that they were the ones arguing against it.

    There seems to have been so much argument against the proposal, it really makes you wonder if ol’ rupe really IS implementing policy directly, and the hapless libs don’t find out until his spredsheets tell them?

    Or, their all just assholes, and all too afraid to own up

    Or, do they all just read the Independent Australian 😉


    Australia’s new health minister says Medicare spending is out of control and must be pegged back or we’ll all be ruined! Unfortunately for her, the hard numbers show her claim to be an absolute furphy.

    https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/medicares-growth-isnt-out-of-control–its-actually-slowing,7267

    Turns out, it’s actually been going down.

    Up is down, and down is up. Welcome to rupes’ world.

  59. egg permalink
    January 18, 2015 7:19 pm

    ‘A bet each way now?’

    No, I’m confident global cooling will begin before 2019.

    ‘But more likely they’ll just say it’s all due to other factors – the sun perhaps –’

    Yep, that’s about the size of it.

  60. January 18, 2015 7:56 pm

    ”””No, I’m confident global cooling will begin before 2019.”””

    #and l`m confident in the future, a crypt-worker listening carefully, will hear the cadavers murmmering,

    (denier-cadaver)”””Nobody knows for certain where it’s going from here”””

    (and an agnostic cadaver will reply)”””Probably the truest comment you’ve ever made, egg”””

    #as we all know there is no global warming, and therefore no heatwaves, and it is all just a global cash-con by the crypt-construction industry using `heatwave-terror` to hoover-up city dollars tricking them to expand their city-morgue crypts.

    ””””FRESNO, Calif. — Corpses piled up at the morgue Thursday, and aid workers went door-to-door, checking in on elderly people in hopes of keeping the death toll from California’s 12-day heat wave from rising.

    California coroners offices said the number of deaths possibly connected to the heat wave climbed to 90.

    In Fresno County’s morgue, the walk-in freezer was stuffed with bodies, with some piled on top of others, said Coroner Loralee Cervantes.””””’

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/14003245/ns/weather/t/california-heat-wave-blamed-deaths/

  61. Tom R permalink
    January 18, 2015 8:06 pm

    I’m confident global cooling will begin before 2019.

    You were confident it was imminent years ago.

    Unfortunately, it just keeps getting hotter.

    That link AO put up to Grog at the ABC is so pertinent to you. Wasting Energy

    The difficulty with responding to such amateur climate-change commentators is you have to parse every sentence for accuracy.

    Not so with our grodo. Its shit has been debunked so often and for so long, it’s just simply a matter of calling bullshit when it talks. Ridicule and disdain, that’s what years of denialist fuckwittery has got you

    Meanwhile, we await the next brainfart from the denialist grubmint on their attack on those not born to rool

  62. January 18, 2015 8:18 pm

    “It’s tough to make predictions, especially about the future.” ~ Yogi Berra

    No one knows whether there’ll be further warming or global cooling. (Plenty, like computer modellers, are willing to guess.) What we can say by observing the record is there’s been no warming for at least ten years.

  63. January 18, 2015 8:57 pm

    Berkeley Earth: “There have been a number of new papers that use recent atmospheric, ocean, and surface temperature observations to argue that climate sensitivity may be lower than previously estimated (e.g. closer to 2 C than 4 C). These studies tend to be rather sensitive to the time period chosen, and a future warm decade could considerably change the picture. As with many things in science, there is still significant uncertainty surrounding climate sensitivity, and different approaches can obtain fairly different results. However, the longer the pause continues the more people will begin to question whether GCMs are getting either multi-decadal variability or climate sensitivity wrong. What is clear is that there is still much we don’t understand about the many different factors impacting the Earth’s climate system, especially over periods as short as a decade.”

    http://static.berkeleyearth.org/memos/examining-the-pause.pdf

    pp. 16 – 17

  64. January 18, 2015 9:08 pm

    The only thing cooling Egg is our icy intolerance with your thread derailing troll talk denial bullshit.

    Lets see..
    Legalise racism? fail
    Promote free speech by criminalizing journalistic source and whistle blowers? Pass
    Save us from Tewwa? fail
    Not cut the ABC and SBS… fail
    Not introduce new taxes.. fail
    Balance the budget.. fail
    Create millions of jobs.. fail
    Spy on citizens and treat everyone like crims..pass
    Break a litany of promises..pass
    Cut government waste and spending…fail
    Dismantle Medicare..fail
    Save manufacturing…fail..
    Slow the economy…pass
    double the deficit..pass
    Improve foreign relations..fail
    Allow corporate tax evasion..pass
    Pay Murdoch 880 million dollars in tax evasion… pass
    create vindictive costly royal commissions to castigate political opponents….pass
    Destroy equality in education..fail
    Provide leadership and instill public confidence in government…magnanimous fail

    Fuck these guys are powering …look at all those monumental achievements for the benefit of a progressively egalitarian Australia.

  65. January 18, 2015 9:09 pm

    #the tired old denier lines are trotted out,

    ”””It’s tough to make predictions”””

    ”””No one knows whether”””

    ”””willing to guess.”””’

    #keep your eyes wide-shut Tinfoil`osy, l`m going to do some `guessing`

    1. l will guess world fishing industries will continue to scream about `ocean-acidification` reducing their `catch` of fish, shellfish, crabs and lobster.

    2. l will guess world fisherie Depts and/or marine-park Depts will scream about `ocean-acid` wrecking reefs and other fish-nurseries that stock their fishing industries.

    3. l will guess that cities around the globe will get to use their `heatwave-mass-fatality` incident/management plans on more and more regular basis.

    4. l will guess that cities will also get to fill those new crypts they bought, or/and `portable` crypts they provisioned for, while `using` those `heatwave-mass`fatality` plans.

    5. l will guess that there will be global `grain-shortages` on a more frequent basis.

    6. l will guess that there will be more bushfires on a more frequent basis.

    #but then of course, l`m only `guessing` #teabags

  66. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 18, 2015 9:14 pm

    Thanks for that tony

    You didn’t notice those trend lines, the black dashes through the diagrams, all slanting upwards?

    I’m starting to wonder if they are somehow invisible to deniers or perhaps that they can’t understand how to read a graph.

    Could tomR give it a go please? Maybe it’s just me!

  67. January 18, 2015 11:17 pm

    Better get your Woolies AO..

    All that deny’in has em fryin

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jan/16/2014-hottest-year-on-record-scientists-noaa-nasa?CMP=share_btn_fb

  68. January 19, 2015 12:11 am

  69. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 12:43 am

    Then, after the total backflip with twist, capt. courageous abbott sent the female out to cop the backdown flak – she did much better than he ever could.

  70. January 19, 2015 12:58 am
  71. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:25 am

    Could tomR give it a go please?

    I’m not getting sucked into that vortex of insanity AO. If you cannot persuade people with consensus of 97% of scientists, every credible scientific organization (who have been persuaded by the overwhelming weight of evidence) against a small band of dubiously financed individuals with a very long record of mistakes and out right lies, then there is no hope for them.

    Who really gives a shit about their dwindling supply of denialist points (which have all been debunked so many times before, more is just feeding the insanity). I’ll go with what hte world is doing. We, as a nation, threw away our opportunity to be world leaders. We will now be dragged kicking and screaming into the new reality, although, most unfortunately, at incredible cost our countries future.

    yabot backed coal, which has now turned on him and bit his hand

    Sucked shit to him, and all those who pushed his regressive barrow.

    Ricky @ 12:58 am

    If they didn’t learn after the lying rodent, there’s really nothing to convince me that they will learn now.

    Labor still have an uphill battle to win the next election. 2 years is still a long time in peoples memory cells. Especially when the shock and awe campaign begins in earnest. The libs haven’t finished trying to screw people, but, once they do, peoples memories will prove to be as fleeting as the legendary goldfish, imo. 😦

  72. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:33 am

    Will ley continue with her outright lies?

    Health minister Sussan Ley is sticking like a barnacle to the hull of the discredited and dishonest justification for the GP tax advanced by her failed predecessor, who took one year in the job to be declared Australia’s worst health minister for 40 years.

    …….

    Despite Ley being unable to produce any data to support her GP tax arguments on RN’s Breakfast program this morning, there is plenty of data out there. It just says the opposite.

    ……..

    The evidence is in and the figures do not lie. Medicare can continue as a strong, affordable universal health care system and it is perfectly possible to ensure that health spending is sustainable without punishing people with a GP tax version 1, 2 or 3.

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/16/the-facts-on-medicare-dont-lie-its-affordable-and-effective-without-a-gp-tax

  73. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:06 am

    ‘If you cannot persuade people with consensus of 97% of scientists,’

    You are completely out of touch, there never was 97% of scientists in agreement with AGW, that was a fraudulent paper made up by Cook and Co.

    ‘yabot backed coal, which has now turned on him and bit his hand’

    This only appears to be the hottest year since time began, but 1877 and 1879 were a lot hotter.

  74. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:13 am

    You are completely out of touch

    exhibit a) through z) 😆

    This only appears to be …… the ramblings of a fucking idiot

  75. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:14 am

    The numbers are in. The year 2014 – after shattering temperature records that had stood for hundreds of years across virtually all of Europe, and roasting parts of South America, China and Russia – was the hottest on record, with global temperatures 1.24F (0.69C) higher than the 20th-century average, US government scientists said on Friday.

    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jan/16/2014-hottest-year-on-record-scientists-noaa-nasa?CMP=share_btn_fb

    Appearances can be deceiving, but numbers are harder to fake 😉

    Yet, the denialists continue to fake it :facepalm:

  76. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:20 am

    ‘We, as a nation, threw away our opportunity to be world leaders. We will now be dragged kicking and screaming into the new reality, although, most unfortunately, at incredible cost our countries future.’

    The new reality is that global cooling will have a hugely negative impact on agriculture in the northern hemisphere and Australia, being a large island in the south, is destined to become a large food bowl

  77. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:24 am

    egg, you really are an ignorant fucking idiot

    Mind you, there are a few of your type around 😉

  78. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:25 am

    ‘Manmade climate disaster proponents know the Saul Alinksy community agitator playbook by heart. In a fight, almost anything goes. Never admit error; just change your terminology and attack again. Expand your base, by giving potential allies financial and political reasons to join your cause. Pick “enemy” targets, freeze them, personalize them, polarize them and vilify them.’

    Paul Driessen

  79. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:29 am

  80. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:37 am

    Funny grodo, sounds like denialists to me. What ever happened to wtfuwt brave dispelling of the warming figires from weather stations? turned out, his measurements were actually warmer ROFL

    Of course, he dismissed his own findings, hilariously on the basis that it wasn’t ‘peer reviewed’ ROFL (Monty Python couldn’t come up with this degree of stupidity)

    Yes, like I said, your spiel explains the denialist tactics perfectly, and, like all good denialist, project it onto others.

    Ignoring their own massive gaps in logic or reason. 😉

  81. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:42 am

  82. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:43 am

    ‘Ignoring their own massive gaps in logic or reason.’

    Do you accept the hiatus?

  83. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:49 am

    NOAA says the past 25 years is not unprecedented.

    http://c3headlines.typepad.com/.a/6a010536b58035970c01b7c738b6f0970b-pi

  84. January 19, 2015 8:58 am

    So much for medicare…aye El Gordo you derailing fucktard 🙄

  85. January 19, 2015 8:59 am

    “”Do you accept the hiatus?””

    “Hiatus…??””

    Hottest year on record.

    Do you accept your own blind stupidity?

  86. January 19, 2015 9:00 am

    El Gordo you derailing fucktard.

    Yep – which explains why I haven’t been around much lately.

  87. January 19, 2015 9:06 am

    Give her a no expense spared sanity holiday

  88. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 9:15 am

    ‘The Nasa climate scientists who claimed 2014 set a new record for global warmth last night admitted they were only 38 per cent sure this was true.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2915061/Nasa-climate-scientists-said-2014-warmest-year-record-38-sure-right.html#ixzz3PDJrCU7W
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  89. January 19, 2015 9:27 am

    You see…

    In the past when I’ve temporarily banned egg from derailing threads, I’ve eventually decided to let it back in when it ingratiates itself posting comments on Tony’s art thread..

    However, invariably, once it gets its foot back in the door in always ends up doing the same thing – derailing threads with its own little pet obsession.

    So much so, that since my (and during my holiday) I’ve haven’t really been around this place very much ..

  90. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 9:29 am

    ROFL

    So, your pretty picture simply shows that, in hte last 100 years, our climate has increased in temperature more than once. This proves … what ❓ 😯

    And the other is from someone who, as I mentioned before, is a serial offender ofr making shit up

    https://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/

    Nothing but lies and obfuscations, it’s all you got.

    And, like wtfuwt, ignore anything that doesn’t fit your little denialist world. Even when it’s your own figures ROFL

  91. January 19, 2015 9:35 am

    Tom R FFS mate

  92. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:01 am

    ” since my (and during my holiday) I’ve haven’t really been around this place very much ..**

    There are about half a dozen people here who have been exchanging views with one another since 2006/07.

    A sense of genuine friendship and fun has developed over that time (I think), each is respectful of others, needling is light hearted and usually funny.

    reb has done a remarkable job in fostering a site that has endured so long and developed these values. People like El Gordo (and a couple of other blow ins) would be wise to take on board this culture and perhaps reflect more of the types of exchanges that occur between HD, AO, TB, Tony, Wally, reb (and probably Tom R) etc.

    (**ignoring the grammar corrections in these circumstances)

  93. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:01 am

    This only appears to be the hottest year since time began, but 1877 and 1879 were a lot hotter. egg

    My bold … chuckle …

  94. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:11 am

    Je choisis reb, je suis reb

    I may have started that. I posted the news that NASA reported the hottest year on record, and it was all downhill after that. It seems that there will never be a time when we can report anything climate change related without it turning into a denier beacon. Hard as it is, I will have to censor myself, one person’s obsession has made it a taboo subject.

  95. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:11 am

    since my (and during my holiday) I’ve haven’t really been around this place very much

    So at the risk of being assumptive … you’ve been back for a little while?

    So, welcome home … 🙂

    I’d agree with that, ToM … sb is a newer but contributor but he caught on to the “kultur” pretty quickly I thought … very insightful comments … then there’s our “occasional regulars” ee, et al …

    As for heat Brisbane is pretty well in the mid 30’s and another massive downpour has just started … reminds me of the weather in the sixties …

  96. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:19 am

    I agree TB, splatter makes a great contribution, he gets the tone of exchanges

    AO, there is no way you should restrain your comments. I think it is El Gordo who needs to show that.

    This is reb’s site, he’s entitled to have people observe the conditions he’s outlined a few dozen times.

  97. egg permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:20 am

    Gentlemen please, Kitty is the troublemaker for discussing the issue in the first place. CC is my portfolio and I will not let her lies go unanswered.

  98. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:21 am

    I posted the news that NASA reported the hottest year on record

    Which unleashed a torrent of bullshit from the usual suspect. It’s got to the point where ANY mention of AGW just descends into denialist bullshit regurgitation from the one dickwit, and everyone ends up going FUCK OFF EGG!!

    Fuck him. Simple fact, it’s fucking hot, it’s getting fucking hotter, as it has for the past decade (flat-lining fuckwits ignored), and it WILL get fucking hotter

    And no amount of denialist bullshit will change that.

  99. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:23 am

    you don’t have a fkn portfolio, you have a mental health problem

  100. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:24 am

    I will not let her lies go unanswered.

    What lies you ignorant little fuck! ?

  101. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:25 am

    you have a mental health problem

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

  102. January 19, 2015 10:30 am

    “”Gentlemen please, Kitty is the troublemaker for discussing the issue in the first place. CC is my portfolio and I will not let her lies go unanswered.””

    Oh that is complete and utter fucken bullshit.

    I’ve stated countless times on this blog that I have very little interest in climate change as it’s a pointless debate between those who believe the science and those who do not.

    The arguments are always the same – I’ve got some BS graph to prove I’m right and someone else has some other graph to prove them wrong.

    If you consider CC your “portfolio” when then perhaps have the courage of your convictions to argue your case on your own blog or fuck off somewhere else where people might be remotely interested because I am certainly not and I’m sick to fkn death of you derailing threads with your denialist BS!

    I’m trying to think of another way to put it, but why don’t you just FUCK OFF!! Seems to be the most concise and to the point way of saying it.

  103. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:38 am

    Signs of mutiny on the Good Ship Abbott:

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-19/matthewson-signs-of-mutiny-on-the-good-ship-abbott/6024180

    …We’ve known for some time that the Good Ship Abbott was in trouble, and with MPs now seemingly jostling for position could it be a case of man overboard?

    That sound you hear is the whisper of Liberal Party MPs carefully shuffling around a Prime Minister who’s taken on water and is listing dangerously…

  104. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:42 am

    Gentlemen please, Kitty is the troublemaker …

    And that just demonstrates your simple-mindedness … lies?

  105. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:45 am

    That sound you hear is the whisper of Liberal Party MPs carefully shuffling around a Prime Minister who’s taken on water and is listing dangerously…

    Well I hope they man the pumps to keep The Abbott afloat for the next two years … that will ensure his awful navigation skills will run the whole miserable crew aground on a reef somewhere out in the CHINA SEA!

    GOD SAVE THE ABBOTT!

  106. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:46 am

    I see even the oz, who were probably the most responsible for installing yabot into the position he now holds, is starting a bit of a campaign against him.

    The question is, who will they go with?

    From the looks of the treatment murdor has been given her,the asbestos bishop looks to be the front runner.

    And sooner rather than later I think. I reckon by mid year, we will have our second female pm. And I foresee a far different treatment of her also from the assembled

    You heard it here first (and when have I been wrong before) 😉

  107. January 19, 2015 10:52 am

    I have a feeling you could be right Tom…..

  108. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:55 am

    My opinion on global warming is that since the people who are wrong on almost everything (ie ALP/Greens) believe in global warming this means that there is a 99% chance that it is not occurring.

    ALP/Greens are wrong on almost everything so i don’t see why their beliefs in global warming would be any different.

  109. January 19, 2015 10:56 am

    Intelligent people might find this article interesting reading…

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-19/matthewson-signs-of-mutiny-on-the-good-ship-abbott/6024180

    “”We’ve known for some time that the Good Ship Abbott was in trouble, partly because it was constructed using shonky policies and shattered expectations, but also because it was steered with the reckless abandon that comes from political hubris mixed with a misguided sense of entitlement.””

  110. January 19, 2015 10:59 am

    “”My opinion on….””

    That’s all very well Neil, but I think the fundamental fact of the matter (that you seem to be missing), if you don’t mind me saying, is that no one really gives a flying fuck about what you think, or what you think you think…

  111. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:04 am

    is that no one really gives a flying fuck about what you think, or what you think you think…

    is nil egg?

  112. January 19, 2015 11:09 am

    Reb thats why I follow Paula.. and

    Nils just cant hep himself as always.. with irreverent irrelevant wank
    .
    TOM you are fine as long as everyone agrees with you…you are a simplex didactic when it comes to discourse polarized by a painted shut consciousness… discuss 🙂

  113. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:19 am

    Reb

    That is OK. This blog allows me to post for which i am grateful (unlike AIMN).

    Also nobody has to read what i say

  114. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:33 am

    from the paula mathewson link:

    …The core problem with the budget is the design, and responsibility for design faults ultimately lands at the feet of the Prime Minister … Abbott used his authority to take charge of the Government’s first budget, yet he seems to be using his political skills to sidestep responsibility, leaving ownership of the document with Hockey…

    abbott micromanaged everything, and abbott [and credlin] insisted on controlling the process.
    When it gets rejected as too much for people to bear, abbott wants to abdicate any ownership or responsibility for his actions, leaving others holding the stinky mess while he acts like a saviour – total hypocrisy from a shifty and immoral, unethical operator.

    That’s the MO of his entire career, his entire life really and I hope the voters for once in abbott’s life, make him accountable for his own actions.

  115. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:38 am

    Well at least two of us will, KL …

    Came home yesterday to find “the sign” had “blown over” in the wind?

  116. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:41 am

    We never did get a photo of it here TB

    Was it very windy yesterday?

  117. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:47 am

    hahaha

    We need to worry about medicare in 150 years, the budget costs for the next generations, but not climate change, these people are a fraud!

  118. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 11:49 am

  119. January 19, 2015 11:51 am

    I’ve put up a poster of my own…

  120. January 19, 2015 11:52 am

    Nils should pay you for therapy Reb..

    I always find its the ones who repeat themselves in life are always those who have the least to say..

    Listening to the first hour of JJ.. went to the party on Saturday night with my best friend a foundation member.. (so many heavy hitters there especially on the outside dancefloor) a cultural evolution that was opposed by the Fiberals.. nothin changes

  121. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 12:04 pm

    “I’m not going to engage in a discussion on gossip,” Mr Hockey said

    “But I will base my rantings on science fiction ” he probably went on to say 🙂

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

    This is probably why the asbestos bishop is their only answer ROFL

    A fucking nasty and devious she is, she isn’t that stupid (well, not obviously anyway)

  122. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 1:05 pm

    from the hockey science fictiony science files

    The Treasurer said his five-year old son had broken his leg over the Christmas break. Although his son attended multiple consultations and X-rays, Mr Hockey only had to contribute $40 to pay for a waterproof cast.

    “That is wrong,” Mr Hockey said, noting he is a high income earner who could afford to contribute more.

    So why do their changes hit those who cannot contribute more harder than those who can>

    If you want to do as you say hockey, legislate the conditions that most GP clinics in the lower economic areas already do. They only bulk bill people on benefits, pensioners or children.

    In a perfect medicare system, everyone would be treated the same. But while we are subsidising private health cover with funds better used in medicare, it isn’t a perfect system.

    I also hope that hockeys kid didn’t suffer his broken bones from having to circumvent a group of patrons who had taken over a pavement with their cafe chairs all grouped together 😉

  123. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 19, 2015 1:57 pm

    “But while we are subsidising private health cover with funds better used in medicare, ”

    Load of crap. I am in private health insurance. The health insurance subsidy does not mean i pay nothing, it means i get a discount.

    But if i didn’t pay anything the govt would have to cough up a lot more money. My insurance premium money goes into paying health costs of people who are sick. If i didn’t pay a premium the govt would have to cough up the money.

  124. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 2:02 pm

    I’ve never been bulk billed, every Dr I’ve been to only B/B pension card holders.

    How come the wealthiest australians seem to get these b/b ones who live in the wealthiest areas have such an abundance of these drs?

    I tend to think its a mindset, if they can get something for free, the wealthy demand it, where the poor will scrape up whatever they can even if they go without food to pay what is asked.

  125. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 2:28 pm

    How come the wealthiest australians seem to get these b/b ones who live in the wealthiest areas have such an abundance of these drs?

    I don’t know if that is the case or not AO, but I do know that in our area, no GP clinic offers bulk billing to just anyone. It would be interesting to find out if this is a pattern though?

  126. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:08 pm

  127. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:11 pm

    je suis getting pissed off?

  128. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:19 pm

    This is why I like dave warner, he hasn’t forgotten his roots and the people he left behind.

    PM’s office in bizarre cover-up over chat with Dave Warner:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/media/pms-office-in-bizarre-cover-up-over-chat-with-dave-warner/story-e6frg996-1227188932717

  129. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:28 pm

  130. January 19, 2015 4:32 pm

  131. January 19, 2015 4:33 pm

    I thought all that “je suis Charlie” nonsense was a load of bollocks.

  132. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:44 pm

  133. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 19, 2015 4:59 pm

    I like tim winton too

    http://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2013/december/1385816400/tim-winton/c-word
    SOME THOUGHTS ABOUT CLASS IN AUSTRALIA
    The C word

  134. January 19, 2015 5:39 pm

  135. January 19, 2015 6:42 pm

    BTW, a warning to subscribers of The Gutter Trash…

    Should you receive an email from someone called “Walrus” asking you to invest in a new business accounting software application, we suggest you treat it as a scam email.

    While on the surface it may seem like an attractive investment opportunity, the Management Team at The Gutter Trash recommend that should you receive an unsolicited invitation to “invest” in the development of an enterprise-wide software application called “Mind Your Own Fucking Business” we suggest you treat it with some scepticism.

  136. January 19, 2015 7:32 pm

    ‘an enterprise-wide software application called “Mind Your Own Fucking Business” we suggest you treat it with some scepticism.’

    Thanks for the warning. Catchy name, though.

  137. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:36 pm

    Dutton accuses protesting Manus Island asylum seekers of ‘aggressive behaviour’

    Dutton should go to Manus Island (yep been there, done that) but Queenslanders still think he’s an arrogant Dickwit® that has trouble remembering whether he should be having a piss or a wank!

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    I wondered where Willy was! BTW how HTF would Wally get my fkn emai?

    Others may have short memories, Jummy. but us regulars at the bar know your just a WCP … I smell a smelly a jockstrap con job here …

  138. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:38 pm

    Ahhh … I see he sent me an email and I replied … well here’s Wally’s …

    sirwalterofnthshore@gmail.com

  139. January 19, 2015 7:38 pm

    “” I smell a smelly a jockstrap con job here …””

    In your (I shudder to think ) dreams TB…

  140. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:39 pm

    how HTF … 😉

  141. TB Queensland permalink
    January 19, 2015 7:40 pm

    In your (I shudder to think ) dreams TB…

    Speak fer yersel’, Jummy, more a nightmare faer me! 😉

  142. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 8:04 pm

    Ricky, you need to get you and ya dacks down to little ol’ Adelaide 😉

    https://www.undiesrun.com.au/

    Where’s my bloody email???!!!!

  143. January 19, 2015 9:12 pm

    At the risk of upsetting the delicate balance between this blog’s commitment to free speech, and its rejection of discussion on this topic by certain individuals, I’ll add this comment.

    FACT: Gavin Schmidt, NASA GISS director, admits 2014 might not be the hottest year ever, as claimed.

    OPINION: Real scientists, rather than activists, would have disclosed by how much the new “record” exceeded the old one, and whether it was statistically significant (i.e. greater than the margin of error).

  144. January 19, 2015 9:26 pm

    “Frydenberg plans to clip unions’ wings on super funds”

    OPINION: Anyone interested in maximising their retirement income shouldn’t put a cent into a union-managed super fund.

  145. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 9:55 pm

    and its rejection of discussion on this topic by certain individuals

    If you call what grodo does a “discussion”, then you have a far more generous interpretation of the word than do I

    Anyone interested in maximising their retirement income shouldn’t put a cent into a union-managed super fund.

    Even though Industry Super Funds perform better?

  146. January 19, 2015 9:58 pm

    “Even though Industry Super Funds perform better?”

    Than what, exactly?

  147. Tom R permalink
    January 19, 2015 10:07 pm

    Than what, exactly?

    retail funds.

  148. January 19, 2015 10:08 pm

    Link?

  149. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:07 am

  150. January 20, 2015 1:38 am

    ” the reckless abandon that comes from political hubris”

    Indeed.

  151. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:09 am

    Thanks for the link to Gavin Schmidt’s twitter feed AO. It highlights, as I mentioned above, the problem with relying on people like rose (who could slot straight in at the oz) for actual facts. He has a long history of lying. And this latest about “38 per cent” is no different. The article also fails to highlight just how uncertain other “max temps” have been. And dismisses entirely that, ignoring the breaking of ANOTHER record, what we see is the continual climb (that some call a “hiatus”?) in global temperatures.

    Of course, in denial humpty dumpty land, 2014 cannot be the hottest, as 2010 might have been, but, 2010 cannot have been the hottest, as 2014 might have been.

    The illogical twists made by denialists is mind boggling in their dexterity. It would also be fucking hilarious, if it wasn’t so fucking important an issue.

  152. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:14 am

    The new medicare card, courtesy of the lying fiberals

  153. egg permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:23 am

    ‘Is there evidence that there is a significant change of trend from 1998?’

    Yes, its as plain as the nose on your face.

  154. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:31 am

    Interesting article by a certain “Michael Taylor” 😉

    Stop pandering to the wealthy, and Medicare becomes sustainable. It is the luxuries afforded to the well-off that are unsustainable. How much is it costing us? Too much. Here are some examples.

    http://theaimn.com/average-person-realise-much-abbott-government-helping-wealthy/

    Subsidies, tax breaks, you say tomato … ❓ 😯

  155. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:32 am

    Can you expand with not false, not debunked, not made up evidence at all grodo

    Or is trolling all you have left?

  156. January 20, 2015 8:33 am

    I guess when I told you yesterday to FUCK OFF, the message was somewhat unclear.

  157. January 20, 2015 8:35 am

    “”Or is trolling all you have left?”””

    Did it ever have anything else…??

  158. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:39 am

    Did it ever have anything else…??

    Quite obviously not, but some people seem to enjoy the diversion, even tag along with the denialist trolls

    Sorry but when denialist ignorance is perpetuated, it doesn’t look good. And, it’s not like the history rose has with the truth was a secret. It had been highlighted here, yet doubled back down on.

  159. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:48 am

    “Interesting article by a certain “Michael Taylor””

    Yeah the guy who banned me from posting for proving him wrong. Facts and lefties do not mix.

    And on his article why didn’t Labor do the things he suggested when in power?? The only thing he can hang on the Coalition is the abolition of the mining tax and like all things Labor does was a total failure. It was bringing in little money and was not going to be used to pay off debt but to bribe voters.

  160. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:52 am

    Facts and lefties do not mix.

    Interesting insight after AO’s posts last night 😆

  161. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:00 am

    I notice lefties like bringing up the taxation benefits of putting money into Superannuation for the wealthy.

    Well why didn’t Swan unlegislate them??

    Perhaps economic management is not as simple as lefties think and who knows what damage what Labor supporters want will do to the economy??

    Lefties thought budgets were easy because Costello got lucky. No. Costello knew what he was doing.

  162. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:05 am

    Perhaps economic management is not as simple as lefties think

    ROFL. Wasn’t it yabot who promised a land of milk and honey without any GREAT BIG NEW TAX ROFL

    Actually nil, Swan (Labor) tried many times to wind back super concessions. Sometimes successfully, sometimes not.

  163. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:10 am

    Swan/Gillard had the numbers to get any legislation they wanted through parliament.

    I do not recall the evil tax advantages of superannuation tax concessions being mentioned until the Coalition got into power.

    Same goes for negative gearing. Why didn’t Swan get rid of it?

    The only thing you can hang on the Coalition is the abolition of the mining tax. And money gained from that was to be used to bribe voters not to pay off debt.

  164. January 20, 2015 9:22 am

    “”And money gained from that was to be used to bribe voters not to pay off debt.””

    I’m sorry, but would you mind explaining that in a little more detail…….?

  165. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:33 am

    Swan/Gillard had the numbers to get any legislation they wanted through parliament.

    You’re a complete idiot nil ROFL

    but would you mind explaining that in a little more detail…….?

    ooh ooh, pick me

    “Labor are crooks and I hate youse all”!! 🙂

  166. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:35 am

    I do not recall the evil tax advantages of superannuation tax concessions being mentioned until the Coalition got into power.

    I think I explained in my last post the reason for that 😉 nIl with a capital I for …. 🙂

    http://www.cis.org.au/media-information/opinion-pieces/article/1080-mr-swans-preoccupation-with-superannuation

    https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/13543265/swan-to-hit-rich-in-super-tax-grab/

  167. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:14 am

    “I’m sorry, but would you mind explaining that in a little more detail…….?

    Labor was going to spend the expected revenue from the mining tax on the school kids bonus and things like that. Worse the spending was put into the forward estimates but it turns out the money raised from the mining tax does not come close to matching the spending promised.

    Labor said Costello wasted the mining boom but he didn’t. Costello saved $50B in his last three budgets. It was our low debt which helped us through the GFC.

    Labor did not save a cent in 6 years but did nothing but blow the budget as anybody with any brains new would happen.

  168. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:20 am

    Labor was going to spend the expected revenue from the mining tax on the school kids bonus and things like that.

    We still have the school kids bonus, but not the mining tax.

  169. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:39 am

    Labor said Costello wasted the mining boom but he didn’t. Costello saved $50B in his last three budgets. It was our low debt which helped us through the GFC.

    Not just labor neil, economists say that. Did costello get world’s best treasurer?
    Costello collected and wasted the rivers of gold that poured into his coffers from the mining boom. Labor with a reduced revenue because of a mining slow down and a GFC were still committed to all that costello/howard middle class welfare, including superannuation, which has been shown to be the cause of the deficit we have now and the reason joe is looking for coins under the matresss of paupers..

    How about talking less about low govt debt and more about the sky high private debt?
    Then you will clearly see what the liberal party do to people.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-05-07/alberici-economic-comparisons/4672166

    …As a proportion of GDP, between 1996 and 2007, government spending averaged 24.2 per cent. The stimulus spending of 2009/2010 pushed spending up to 26 per cent of GDP but since then it’s been contained at 24 per cent. All things being equal, if Wayne Swan had the revenue today that Peter Costello had in the 2000s, the 2012/13 budget would be in surplus.

    By 2007, the $96 billion in debt the Howard government had inherited in 1996 was entirely paid down and the budget was in surplus to the tune of $20 billion. Mr Costello managed this impressive turn around despite a cash splash on families, pensioners, new babies and first-home buyers as well as income tax cuts over eight successive years. In all the noise about who can claim the record as the most generous treasurer, the IMF shows the prize must indeed go to Peter Costello.

    In a recent study of 55 leading economies around the world, The International Monetary Fund identified four periods in Australian history when governments were engaged in “fiscal profligacy”: they were in 1940, 1960 and between 2003 and 2007…

  170. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:41 am

    “Even though Industry Super Funds perform better?”

    Than what, exactly?

    JFC!

    OPINION : Stick to art or go out and play in the real world for a bit …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Same goes for negative gearing. Why didn’t Swan get rid of it?

    I asked the same question over and again, Kneel …

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Labor did not save a cent in 6 years but did nothing but blow the budget as anybody with any brains new would happen.

    Not many people did straight after 2007/08 … but then GFC conveniently becomes lost in that tiny one track mind of yours …

    Pete Custard was rolling around in so much of other people’s money he actually lost $10 billion … yeah, what a clever treasurer was he …

  171. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:43 am

    Costello used mining boom revenue to pay off debt.

    Labor used mining boom revenue to buy votes.

    But even though the boom was bigger under Labor they wanted even more money.

    The new Mining tax raised bugger all. In fact it may have scared off business. Better to get rid of it. And it cost a lot to administer.

  172. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:44 am

    In all the noise about who can claim the record as the most generous treasurer, the IMF shows the prize must indeed go to Peter Costello.

    That’s “generous” to the rich and powerful … not the smartest … Kneel …

  173. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:45 am

    …Swan/Gillard had the numbers to get any legislation they wanted through parliament…

    Considering it was a hung parliament, you’ve just shown outright stupidity in understanding how hard it was to get things through that parliament and the political skill displayed.

    By comparison, you could look at the rabble we have now and the utter incompetence shown by those who have a majority.

  174. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:49 am

    Costello used mining boom revenue to pay off debt.

    Labor used mining boom revenue to buy votes.

    Mmmm … Howard was the pork-barreler of the century!

    How is that regional hospital in Tassie doing with the $1 million he gave them …?

    The new Mining tax raised bugger all. In fact it may have scared off business. Better to get rid of it. And it cost a lot to administer.

    Because the mining boom fell on its arse and it should have been done a decade earlier … may have scared off business – piss in the other pocket …

  175. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:50 am

    OT

    KL, I decided not to take a photo of the sign … might just give some clues to my location … and I’ve been stung once – as you know …

  176. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:53 am

    neil, the world’s greatest amateur treasurer!
    Apparently managing australia’s complex economy is exactly the same as sitting at your kitchen table divying up the household bills.

  177. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:54 am

    Considering it was a hung parliament, you’ve just shown outright stupidity

    He’s not nIl with a capital I for nothing AO 😉

  178. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:56 am

    might just give some clues to my location

    If the name of your moniker doesn’t keep people away TB Q then nothing will 😉

  179. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 10:56 am

    “Because the mining boom fell on its arse

    Nope. You should get your facts right. Check this figure.

    http://www.rba.gov.au/chart-pack/commodity-prices.html

    Commodity prices have crashed from their record highs under Labor but they are still higher than they were under Costello.

  180. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:19 am

    Here we Joh again! LNP’s Strong Choices to hit families hard:

    https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/here-we-joh-again-lnps-strong-choices-to-hit-families-hard,7273

    …This is because an LNP government will lose income of more than $1 billion a year from the hugely-profitable, publicly-owned assets it plans to privatise.

    Last year, that income was $1.586 billion — equivalent to extra taxes and charges averaging $1,381 for Queensland’s 1,148,175 families…

  181. January 20, 2015 11:21 am

    “Interesting article by a certain “Michael Taylor””
    Yeah the guy who banned me from posting for proving him wrong. Facts and lefties do not mix.

    In your minuscule damaged logic that’s why you think you were banned..?

    1: You were torn a new asshole whilst desperately posting the same shit you post here..versioning selected truth.

    2: The very fact that you predictably use Lefties as a derogatory term combatant to all that you think you understand and believe is testament to your limited intellectual capacity.

    3. YOU REFUSE TO TALK ABOUT THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM, THIS CURRENT GOVERNMENT, WHO IN JUST 18 MONTHS HAVE PROVED BY THEIR ACTIONS TO BE INCOMPETENT SOCIOLOGICAL AND FISCAL RADICAL VANDALS OF UNPARALLELED PEER

    Your delusion is a condition of proportion unto itself.

    Here is a challenge… Like TOM of Melbourne, El Gordo EGG write an Article prosecuting your position and I will personally submit it for publication.

    Then and only then will you differentiate yourself as a contributor to intelligent discourse rather than just another insignificant obstinate, derailing troll.

  182. January 20, 2015 11:23 am

    According to the latest available APRA report on five-year fund-level rates of return for the largest 200 super funds, there are three industry funds in the top 12, and two retail funds. However, there are 7 corporate funds, including the top three (PDF, p.10). So, statistically, the best returns come from corporate funds. However, self-managed funds might be an even better way to go, if only for their low administration costs. (The total cost to run my own SMSF are in the order of .35 % of the fund’s value.)

  183. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:25 am

    Neil, I don’t think it makes sense to tar all left types with same brush because of your experience with AIMN and its owner.

    The only reason he allows you to participate from time to time is so that he has the odd satisfaction of banning you at a whim.

  184. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:26 am

    ”In your minuscule damaged logic that’s why you think you were banned..?

    Please see above.

  185. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:31 am

    The household sector’s savings situation is dire, as reported by ME Bank in a 2014 report:
    https://independentaustralia.net/business/business-display/australian-private-debt-and-dont-skimp-on-the-pat,7262

    …Only 46 per cent of households reported the ability to save each month;
    Only 32 per cent would easily be able to raise $3,000 in an emergency;
    50 per cent aren’t confident they have enough savings to last if unemployed for three months;
    35 per cent reported having less than $1,000 cash on hand;
    17 per cent have less than $100 in savings;
    60 per cent have less than $10,000 in savings; and
    In 2009, Australians were saving a median $300 per year (AMP/NATSEM)

    …f the real estate fever gripping the nation does not break soon, Australia may well secure the top OECD ranking for the most over-indebted household sector. A financial crisis beckons, for history documents that extraordinary over-lending routinely precipitates chaos; falsifying expert claims that ‘this time is different’…

  186. January 20, 2015 11:34 am

    “” self-managed funds might be an even better way to go, if only for their low administration costs. “””

    Perhaps, but only if you have around $400,000+

    For people with less than $200,000 they’re a dud deal but that hasn’t prevented many dodgy advisers from setting them up, or stoopid investors who only want one so they can buy an investment property…

  187. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:35 am

    Ricky, I have no interest in having anything to do with AIMN because of the inclination of its owner to ban those of us that dealt with him 4, 5, 6 or 7 years ago.

    He likes to ban people that are able to specifically remind him of political and policy positions that he has held in the past.

    Your knowledge of this background is limited.

  188. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:42 am

    Political sign theft in Springwood TB
    Just listening to ABC now where someone is saying that ALP supporters are reporting their signs being stolen and knocked over, damaged or taken away from their homes. Home owners also most concerned about people entering their property,vandalising and trespassing to do this.
    One person saying she is not going to be intimidated by this and will get another one. ALP candidate signs also disappearing and being replaced by LNP ones.

  189. January 20, 2015 11:43 am

    “”He likes to ban people that are able to specifically remind him of political and policy positions that he has held in the past.””

    He also likes to ban people who remind him that he stole intellectual property in the form of a confidential email database.

    He also likes to ban people who remind him that he published a report as “his own work” when in fact it turned out be a report written by a Professor in Canberra.

    He also likes to ban people who make fun of his self-proclaimed womanising (which is actually quite funny).

    And he bans people who aren’t pro-Labor or pro-Gillard.

    However he doesn’t ban senile old ladies, which presumably is his target market.

  190. January 20, 2015 11:47 am

    I wholeheartedly agree about AIMN.

    I wouldn’t piss on that site, it’s an echo-wankathon with the same bending of facts to fit presupposed ideological conclusions I’d expect from a Creationist site.
    And those responsible for its genesis have serious form.

  191. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:47 am

    five-year fund-level rates

    I went down to page 15 Tony and saw the ten year ROR, which has a different take 😉

    I wonder how many people cash their super in after 5 years? 😯

    I also note that those high performing corporate funds are very limited in their access 😉 Poor joes like us won’t get in 😦 Looking after the robber barons.

    self-managed funds might be an even better way to go

    Yea, cos everyones a market man 😆

  192. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:50 am

    but only if you have around $400,000+

    Sign me up!

  193. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:52 am

    I wouldn’t piss on that site

    The site thanks you 😉

  194. January 20, 2015 11:53 am

    I’m in an Industry Super Fund.

    So there.

  195. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:55 am

    Get the idea Ricky that the issue isn’t limited to me, Neil etc?

  196. January 20, 2015 11:57 am

    “The site thanks you”

    I can’t remember the last time I even looked there. It seems pointless to me, what’s to be found is so monocular & boringly obvious.
    A herd of hiveminded nodders, much like Boltblog in that respect…except Bolt actually writes far better (the content of his rantings aside).

  197. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:57 am

    I’m in an Industry Super Fund.

    So there.

    Case closed 😉

  198. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 11:58 am

    what’s to be found is so monocular & boringly obvious.

    But, did you disagree with the quoted comment or not?

  199. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:00 pm

    (The total cost to run my own SMSF are in the order of .35 % of the fund’s value.)

    Returns, costs and service are ALL significant when choosing a fund …

    And you can’t join a corporate fund … so just a red herring …

    there are three industry funds in the top 12, and two retail funds.

    So what are the remaining seven? The corporate you mention I take it …

    Chant West’s score …

    The top ten performing growth super funds for the 4014 financial year consist of seven not-for-profit super funds, two retail funds and one company super fund.

    http://www.superguide.com.au/how-super-works/top-10-performing-super-funds-20132014-year-past-10-years

  200. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:02 pm

    So, from all the different measurements of funds, one remains consistently strong, the Industry super funds, which of course is the one the grubmint wants to single out for special “treatment”

  201. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:09 pm

    AIMN … as far as I know I can knock on the door whenever I want … they lost my respect when they released personal details of people …

    I think I’m the only person here who met Migs and Min … maybe sreb has?

    I was actually left off the aforesaid covert email list they nicked when they started business … is that being banned? 😉

  202. January 20, 2015 12:10 pm

    Your knowledge of this background is limited.

    Your knowledge of this my background is limited to your perspective

    Intellectuals are always open to the fresh perspective of a well constructed and logically prosecuted point. That’s what “think’in” is all about

    Still waiting for those articles Tom,

  203. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:15 pm

    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/opinion/topic/2014/12/20/tony-abbott-looks-the-event-horizon-his-fate/14189940001378#.VL2oA9LQqSo

  204. January 20, 2015 12:18 pm

    “”I think I’m the only person here who met Migs and Min … maybe sreb has?””

    Thankfully I have not.

  205. January 20, 2015 12:19 pm

    “”Intellectuals are always open to the fresh perspective of a well constructed and logically prosecuted point. “”

    That’s why I don’t bother with AIMN.

  206. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:20 pm

    What the f**k is it with your attention Ricky? You offer to submit for publication an article at a site that has no credibility with most of the people who have contributed here for years (and years and years)

    Why the f**k would anyone bother?

    Try reading comments, rather than relying on your own preconceived opinions

  207. January 20, 2015 12:32 pm

    “attention”.. don’t flatter yourself….

    ” preconceived ” meditate on that word, its a revelational adjective

  208. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:34 pm

    I welcome this

    hehe, we always know who the very politicised qld police support

  209. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:35 pm

    So, from all the different measurements of funds, one remains consistently strong,

    We’ve been members of Sunsuper since the mid nineties … as small business owners it was the only industry fund really available to us …

    It was triggered when we realised that Suncorp took out annual fees and charges up front every time we deposited a lump sum into our super accounts (obviously we didn’t get regular pay cheques) … they were ripping an enormous amount of earning capital from our accounts …

    We check our super daily (well The Minister’s now) … I’m two years older and we retired when I was 59, lived off my super as The Minister’s accrued, when I turned 65 I had none left which = one member of a couple full pension for me … Centrelink only recognise super when you turn 65 … The Minister reached that milestone in January … our combined assets now include her/our super, so though my pension reduces we both get the same amount

    Don’t ever think retiring is simple … here’s the formulae for calculating when you join an account based pension (ie regular payments) through the financial year …

    If George commences an account-based pension on 1 April 2013, and elects to receive one single annual payment of $48,000, the annualised payment is:

    $48,000 x (365/91) = $192,527
    Assessable income = $192,527-$25,350 = $167,177

    This results in the cancellation of George’s age pension entitlement.

    Timing is very important to this calculation. If George had commenced the account based pension earlier in the financial year, the assessable income would be reduced.

    http://www.moneymanagement.com.au/professional-development/capability/financial-planning/centrelink-assessment-of-account-based-pensions

    We know about this ’cause its took us about three weeks to figure the crap out, discuss it with Sunsuper and Centrelink Financial Information Service* (Hockey changed the deeming rules to commence on the 1st January … we had a very narrow window to make it happen for us) … and Centrelink have now been visited three times over it the last we hope with the right paperwork …

    *NOTE: The FIS officers are the best (and free) financial advisors we have come across since we retired in 2005 … very helpful and very professional … and ANYONE can use them … no need to have a concession card …

    Shit that got long winded … hope its helpful to someone …

  210. January 20, 2015 12:36 pm

    “what’s to be found is so monocular & boringly obvious.

    But, did you disagree with the quoted comment or not?”

    My comment was a broader observation about the general contributions to be found at that site, not a response to the quoted comment.

    I’m not banned there. I just don’t go there, coz it’s sappy partisan defecation, for the most part.

    And yes, the ‘proprietors’ are tarnished by their history. A history which they’ve banned, revised, occluded & rewritten as they’ve gone on their boring way.

  211. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:36 pm

    Why the f**k would anyone bother?

    Because I have read quite a few good articles over there. Ignoring any “preconceived opinions” 😉

  212. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:37 pm

    Given the comments that you will probably have read by now Ricky, I think you might understand why your ‘submit for publication’ offer is respectfully declined.

  213. January 20, 2015 12:39 pm

  214. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:40 pm

    No surprise – Qld Police call terrorism alert press conference at time ALP launch due to start on TV live. ‘No specific threat’

    And I thought JBP was bad … what do the LNP think of the electorate … or are they so far up themselves they think we are all morons like them?

  215. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:41 pm

    LOL! @ sreb! 🙂

  216. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 12:58 pm

    OK ALP supporters can make fun of Newman but have a look at this graph

    Queensland has the highest debt in the country. And it has a smaller population than NSW or Victoria.

    I guess lefties say debt does not matter.

  217. January 20, 2015 1:44 pm

    Given the comments that you will probably have read by now Ricky, I think you might understand why your ‘submit for publication’ offer is respectfully declined. way above my literary and intellectual capacity.

    OK ALP supporters can make fun of Newman but have a look at this graph

    Yes unattributed graphs show alarming statistical evidentiary proof of all sorts of rhetorical denial

  218. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 1:49 pm

    campbell newman presser:
    Flatly refusing to answer any questions about alan jones despite being asked about four times, just ignored these reporters and went on to another one. Also asked did he speak to the qld police commissioner re timing of terror update conference – also refused to reply, says “not going into detail about my discussions with police commissioner”

  219. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:03 pm

  220. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:04 pm

  221. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:16 pm

  222. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:19 pm

    The conservatives treatment of Griggs has been reprehensible AO. And yabots attack on any legal decision he is not happy with just shows how petty he is.

    I recall the way Gillard was slammed when she said she didn’t agree with the High Courts decision on the Malaysian solution, but yabot is largely left free to criticize far more vehemently judges and public servants than what Gillard did then.

  223. January 20, 2015 2:24 pm

    From the files of “Headlines we’d like to see more of….”

  224. January 20, 2015 2:26 pm

    “”I recall the way Gillard was slammed when she said she didn’t agree with the High Courts decision on the Malaysian solution””

    Yes and I was one of those who was doing the slamming cos she basically wanted to tear away laws that protected asylum seekers…

  225. January 20, 2015 2:27 pm

    ‘In an open letter the 24 academics express concern about the nature of the criticism directed towards Triggs, who they describe as “one of Australia’s most respected independent public office holders”.’

    I’m wondering how they measure that. Anyone got a graph?

  226. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:30 pm

    Anyone got a graph?

    I’m sure egg could find one to suit. 😉

    cos she basically wanted to tear away laws that protected asylum seekers…

    I was talking more about the way she complained about the decision, not the actual case itself reb

  227. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:37 pm

    Ricky, you’re now proving you’re a goose. Your seeking to defend the indefensible.

    …and there’s about 5 people whose word you’ll probably accept, even of you don’t agree with my orientation.

  228. January 20, 2015 2:38 pm

    “”I was talking more about the way she complained about the decision, not the actual case itself”””

    You’ll forgive me if I can consider the two kind of interrelated ….

  229. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:38 pm

    The revealing facts on bikie laws and crime in Queensland:
    http://theconversation.com/the-revealing-facts-on-bikie-laws-and-crime-in-queensland-35892

    Free trade agreements driving labour market reform by stealth:
    http://theconversation.com/free-trade-agreements-driving-labour-market-reform-by-stealth-36124

  230. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:46 pm

    You’ll forgive me if I can consider the two kind of interrelated ….

    Understandable, but I was intent on focussing on just one aspect. I guess you’re not 😉

  231. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:49 pm

    ‘You’re ‘

  232. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:54 pm

    yor?

  233. January 20, 2015 2:56 pm

    Ricky, you’re now proving you’re a goose. Your seeking to defend the indefensible.

    That’s rife coming from you Tom… …as I reiterate..you are not interested in discourse unless everyone agrees with you… so the echo chamber meme is a little tired don’t you think?

    You love consensus of hatred.. such bitterness is a pitiful indignation of self proclaiming affirmation.

    I look forward to reading some of your work.. however in the meantime excuse me if I treat your “contributions” with the salt grain of predictable intellectual insight you have earned. I can most certainly sort the wheat from chaff as I “think” for myself 🙄

  234. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 2:58 pm

    …Anyone got a graph?…

    Can’t you paint us a picture? 😉

  235. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:04 pm

    What? You kindly offer to submit an essay to a site that is not respected by a range of people with a range of political orientations… but you continue to press your point!

    Just explain again exactly why I would give you an essay for that purpose…

  236. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:11 pm

    st explain again exactly why I would give you an essay for that purpose…

    to stop tha’ bitchin’ perhaps?

  237. January 20, 2015 3:13 pm

    “”such bitterness is a pitiful indignation of self proclaiming affirmation.””

    You say that like it’s a bad thing…

    Others might consider it a philosophy to live by.

  238. January 20, 2015 3:15 pm

    “I was intent on focussing on just one aspect. “””

    Yes, I gathered that… 🙂

  239. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:20 pm

    Lib ideology on super, same as medicare

  240. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:21 pm

    Yes, I gathered that…

    So, how was your holiday reb? 🙂

  241. egg permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:22 pm

    “such bitterness is a pitiful indication of self proclaiming affirmation.”

    There, fixed it.

  242. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:23 pm

    ”I look forward to reading some of your work..

    …and I’ll look forward to reading something that you’ve actually written or replied to… as opposed to your normal contribution which is to photoshop an image with of a backside and adding a caption.

  243. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:23 pm

    One reasons some politicians are worried about the increasing cost of healthcare is that we are living longer.

    Men used to retire at 65 and then conveniently die at 68. Now they retire at 65 and live to 85. And lots of people are on all sorts of pills for most of those years. I know someone who had quadruple bypass at 68 and is still alive at 80 but is on all sorts of expensive pills.

    He would have died at 68 if not for modern medicine. So i can see why politicians are worried about the increasing cost of healthcare.

  244. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:34 pm

    …One reasons some politicians are worried about the increasing cost of healthcare is that we are living longer…

    http://www.theshovel.com.au/2015/01/19/joe-hockey-says-australians-may-live-long-enough-to-see-him-pass-his-first-budget/

    Advances in science and medicine mean Australians may live to 150 – long enough to see the Government pass the 2014 budget, Treasurer Joe Hockey said today.

    😆

  245. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:38 pm

  246. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 3:57 pm

    more freedom of expression hypocrisy

  247. January 20, 2015 4:08 pm

    “”He would have died at 68 if not for modern medicine. So I can see why politicians are worried about the increasing cost of healthcare.””

    I know Neil. If only people would die sooner we wouldn’t be in this mess.

    That’s the problem with “people” these days, they only think of themselves.

    But if you look at it another way, people living longer could actually be a “good thing.”

    For example, it means they have more time to pay taxes like GST, and also keep those struggling banks afloat with their healthy bank balances.

    Energy companies benefit too, as old people tend to feel colder than most, so they’re more likely to spend what little money they have left after buying their medication propping up the gas and electricity companies.

    We all know that Australia has an ageing population, but old people have to eat too, and one of the things that’s ideal for their toothless gobs is baby food – creating a new market for an industry segment that would otherwise be in decline. Which reminds me, they’ll probably need diapers too.

    You see Neil, this is the problem with the state of the business community in Australia today. For far too long, people (and businesses) simply expect the government to pitch in with a bottomless pit of money when things go a bit pear shaped.

    Take Ford and Holden for example, why didn’t they just make cars that people wanted to buy rather than go begging cap in hand to the government for a handout? Just because every other country around the world props up their own automotive industry with generous subsidies doesn’t mean we should too, and what’s more we would’ve denied those former employees the thrill of unemployment and the luxury of financial hardship. Where’s the fairness in that, I ask you.

    It’s character building when you think about it, and that’s exactly the sort of people this country needs.

  248. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 4:26 pm

    “Just because every other country around the world props up their own automotive industry with generous subsidies doesn’t mean we should too

    But we did subsidise our car industry with billions of dollars. In 2007, 25% of cars were locally made. After 6 years of Labor rule this had dropped to less than 10%. Nobody wanted to buy them. Take away fleet car sales and private sales were most probably less than 5%. Furthermore subsidies were continuing until 2020.

    Car manufacturers got $30B in subsidies from 2008-2012. Subsidies produced cars that nobody wanted to buy. Do you drive an Australian made car?

  249. January 20, 2015 4:33 pm

  250. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 4:33 pm

    …I know Neil. If only people would die sooner we wouldn’t be in this mess…

    But it’s the pollies who won’t let them die, they won’t allow any euthanasia. They complain living is too expensive and won’t allow the practical alternative. Then they complain bitterly about the cost of keeping the poor buggers in dog food in their heater less and non a/con poverty.

    What a mess it all is!

  251. January 20, 2015 4:33 pm

    LOL @ ToM 🙂

  252. January 20, 2015 4:36 pm

    “”What a mess it all is!””

    I know AO…

    Maybe it would be better if we were all just plugged into the Matrix, fed sludge, and paid some form of taxation…

    I think that’s really what the neo-cons have in mind.

  253. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 20, 2015 4:38 pm

    Mungo MacCallum gets it right again, and adds some humour:

    Well, perhaps; but some of Abbott’s remaining credibility has been his supposed adherence to principle. He might be wrong, but at least he has been consistent.

    Actually, of course, he hasn’t; on examining the record it can be seen that his credo is not so much that of Martin Luther – “here I stand, I can do no other” – but of Groucho Marx: “These are my principles. And if you don’t like them, well, I have others.”

  254. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 4:56 pm

    Reb

    Do you drive an Australian made car?

  255. January 20, 2015 5:06 pm

    “”Do you drive an Australian made car?””

    It’s a Toyota. I have no idea whether it was assembled here or fully imported.

    But besides, living in Melbourne where there is now free public transport in the CBD I hardly every use it.

    Does this mean I’m still a traitor?

  256. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 5:06 pm

    😯

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-20/pope-francis-catholics-do-not-need-to-breed-like-rabbits/6028836

    …Pope Francis has said that good Catholics do not have to breed “like rabbits”, defending the Church’s stance on artificial contraception and appealing to the world’s 1.2 billion Roman Catholics to practise responsible parenting…

    Do you drive an Australian made car?

    is that some kind of tripwire being laid for you reb 😆

    careful!

  257. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 5:15 pm

    I have no idea whether it was assembled here or fully imported.

    What to say? I have no idea what to say?

    But you did make a smart arse comment that the Coalition did not want to subsidise the car industry.

    Subsidies were promised until 2020. When Ford left (under Rudd) the remaining car industry went to Hockey and asked for even more money. Hockey told them to get stuffed. The money promised until 2020 was enough.

  258. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 20, 2015 5:17 pm

    I drive an Australian made Commodore and a Mercedes

    The Commodore is a heap of crap.

  259. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 5:31 pm

    You know i most probably want us to have an Australian car industry more than TomR does.

    But you cannot live in leftie laa laa land.

    Australian made cars are crap.

    In fact most of our manufacturing is crap. That appears to be a fact.

  260. January 20, 2015 5:56 pm

    “”What to say? I have no idea what to say?””

    What type of drugs exactly are you on?

    I’ve mentioned that I hardly drive at all. It’s simply abject laziness that’s prevented me from getting rid of my car altogether.

    Are you suggesting that people who drive are unAustralian?

  261. January 20, 2015 5:57 pm

    “”most probably””

    What does that even mean?

  262. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 6:08 pm

    Well i asked a simple question.

    Do you drive an Australian made car? i asked this question because you brought up the topic of subsidies for the car industry.

    Do you agree with subsidies for the car industry making cars that nobody wants to buy?

  263. January 20, 2015 6:11 pm

    “”In fact most of our manufacturing is crap. That appears to be a fact.””

    Our UGG boots are quite popular in Asia (yes they do have a market outside of Queensland!), and our wine is also increasingly popular in China – red varieties in particular.

    The Chinese are quite good at making lots of things. But I really wouldn’t like to see our wine manufacturing industry outsourced to them.

    Have you ever tried that red wine from Vietnam? They only have one type – Delat (or something like that, and it’s fkn shit). It’s best served thawed if that gives you any indication of the quality.

    And just last week a Malaysian woman working in a wine shop of all places suggested that I try this particular bottle of red wine from Chile. Thinking that she might have some inside knowledge I figured I’d give it a go. Big mistake! It was shit too!

    Although they might quite like to drink it – presumably it makes them feel “”affluent”” – I doubt the Chinese would be very good at making wine.

    The Malaysian woman probably thought she was doing me a favour recommending that fkn awful wine from Chile but in hindsight I reckon she might’ve been on some sort of under-the-table sales based commission from the manufacturer.

    Why else would someone who is in a trusted position make such insincere recommendations? As we all know corruption is rife throughout Asia and these are the kinds of risks we run should we consider outsourcing all our remaining manufacturing.

    Imagine if you were promised an outstanding bottle of wine for $100 only for it to turn out to be something like Taylors Promised Land or something from the Gossips range? I doubt you’d be impressed, but people like us would be the real life casualties should such an unfortunate reality eventuate…

  264. January 20, 2015 6:12 pm

    “Do you agree with subsidies for the car industry making cars that nobody wants to buy?””

    No, I don’t . In fact, I think that was my point… 🙄

  265. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 6:21 pm

    Wow. Wine and UGG boots.

    I rest my case.

    Actually if we have to subsidise we should be giving money to things that people want to buy.

    Like kangaroo boots and wombat ties and platypus hats.

    But not even Australians want to buy Australian made cars.

  266. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 20, 2015 6:24 pm

    “I rest my case.”

    I can barely afford a bottle.

  267. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 20, 2015 6:51 pm

    SB

    You said this

    Mungo MacCallum gets it right again, and adds some humour:”

    You are correct. But the fact is Hockey is this countries only hope.

    That is how bad it has become.

    The alternative is Shorten/whoever.

  268. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:42 pm

    …Maybe it would be better if we were all just plugged into the Matrix, fed sludge, and paid some form of taxation…
    I think that’s really what the neo-cons have in mind…

    I think they are motivated by sadism, there’s a pattern here. The old folks being kept alive just so they live out the rest of their lives in pain and suffering. Don’t you see the similarity to the way we’re treating asylum seekers?

    A government of sadists!

    Don’t worry, there will be a relief soon

    Life on Earth now officially at risk, scientists say:
    http://grist.org/climate-energy/life-on-earth-now-officially-at-risk-scientists-say/

  269. January 20, 2015 8:45 pm

    “I think they are motivated by sadism”

    NTTAWWT

  270. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:47 pm

    😆

  271. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:51 pm

    I have no idea what to say?

    That became obvious once you went on to say.

    Do you agree with subsidies for the car industry making cars that nobody wants to buy?

    Neither do I. However, a lull is not the end. The corner turned, but alas, the curtain was already drawn. Pre-evaculation?

    That’s what happens when a treasurer tells an entire industry to go get fucked.

    http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/C97D51D70F94A80CCA257CAF0006A233

  272. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:54 pm

    He would have died at 68 if not for modern medicine. So i can see why politicians are worried about the increasing cost of healthcare.

    “Arbeit Macht Frei”

    Absolutely astounding ignorance … and a complete lack of empathy or understanding about life and living …

    Soylent Green anyone?

    You are correct. But the fact is Hockey is this countries only hope.

    Probably explains why your banned from AIMN … even they can recognise abject stupidity when they see it …

    (Not that, sreb, can’t but he has a much deeper sense of humour …)

  273. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:57 pm

    That’s what happens when a treasurer tells an entire industry to go get fucked

    Primarily General Motors … but then went on to buy more fkn useless F35’s … speaking of patterns …

  274. TB Queensland permalink
    January 20, 2015 8:58 pm

    What to say? I have no idea what to say?

    We’ve known that for some time … when did you first comment here?

  275. January 20, 2015 8:59 pm

    “he has a much deeper sense of humour …”

    Or it could be that he’s just lazy, lying in a drug induced or alcohol infused coma, or just completely lost interest in the relevance of existence ……

  276. Tom R permalink
    January 20, 2015 9:04 pm

    when did you first comment here?

    tomorrow, hopefully

  277. January 20, 2015 9:05 pm

    You are correct. But the fact is Hockey is this countries only hope.

    MAybe I have it all wrong and NILS is some kind of new wave alpha wave pioneering comedic genius that employs existential sarcasm ? Do I need a Babel fish or something?

  278. January 20, 2015 11:14 pm

    ””””””During a recent interview, a journalist pulled me up for using the c-word. ”Class?” she asked with lifted eyebrow. ”What do you mean?””” http://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2013/december/1385816400/tim-winton/c-word

    #this (if true) is a nice example of how out of touch the journo-herd is armchair, we can`t have reality interfering with a good yarn 🙂

    #for the first half of his post, winton nearly made me doze-off with his wanderings of west-coast nostalgia, l`m glad the second half of the post brought home the meat and potatoes of the working-poor-class and the unemployed-class, and the removal of `opportunity` that teabag-theory inflicts (hint, it also explains why l horse-whip you-know-who when needed)

  279. January 21, 2015 12:41 am

    ””””””Stephen Fry has married his partner Elliott Spencer, ten days after announcing their engagement.

    The 57-year-old took to Twitter to share the happy news, posting a photograph of he and his stand-up comedian husband signing the civil register in Dereham, Norfolk.””””

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2914707/Stephen-Fry-announces-marriage-Elliott-Spencer-Twitter.html

    ”””””’It is not known how many people were in attendance, though Mr Fry this evening joked their vows had been witnessed by an Oscar Wilde doll.””””#giggle

  280. January 21, 2015 12:45 am

    Bane of twoo beweebers.

  281. January 21, 2015 7:12 am

    ‘My mother was not exactly thrilled to the back teeth when she first heard about it,’ she said. ‘She did say she wasn’t too sure about the idea of not coming back. But in the end she’s been a fantastic supporter and believes it’s a great opportunity for me.’

  282. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 7:35 am

    Famous last words tosy ❓ 😉

  283. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:05 am

    OPINION

    Never mind that the industry funds – with equal representation of union and employer trustees – have been the outstanding success story of the Australian superannuation industry, that they have consistently and rather comprehensively outperformed their traditional bank-and-AMP-dominated competition, and done considerably more to reduce fees and provide competition than anything yet mentioned by the Liberal Party.

    http://www.smh.com.au/business/perception-industry-funds-are-funding-the-labor-party-20150120-12u39m.html

  284. egg permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:51 am

    ‘Life on Earth now officially at risk, scientists say:’

    We won’t be going out with a bang.

    ‘Japanese population is expected to drop by a third in 50 years.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2918747/Nearly-half-Japanese-adults-not-having-sex-Fatigue-lack-blamed-birth-rate-continues-slide.html#ixzz3POthUo00
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  285. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:52 am

    ”your banned from AIMN … “

    Even they probably have some standards of grammar and spelling, which may explain why you’re unlikely to be welcomed there!

  286. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:59 am

    the yor off( 🙂 ) yomm

    Meanwhile, back to that pesky medicare stuff

    An Ode to dutton dressed up as Lambie

    This can be the only reason for the co-payment contraption the government eventually came up with in the budget last year, a bastardised, socially regressive, bureaucratic, ill-conceived, anti-health policy meant to fund the apparently imminent discovery of cures for dementia and cancer.

    Given Mr Dutton’s years as opposition health spokesman, he should have learnt enough to see what it really was and warn his colleagues against it. Maybe that happened. But the evidence is absent.

    http://blogs.crikey.com.au/croakey/2015/01/20/beware-the-anti-health-minister/

  287. January 21, 2015 9:03 am

    ””””’Mars One, a not-for-profit based in the Netherlands, aims to establish a permanent human settlement on Mars by 2025”””’

    #this seems like another expensive exercise in the pointless to me Tinfoil`osy

  288. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 9:15 am

    Poor egg is left out 😦

    I’m not an astronaut, but what they will be looking for, obviously, is people who have the ability to learn.

  289. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 10:36 am

    Japanese population is expected to drop by a third in 50 years.

    Karōshi

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kar%C5%8Dshi

  290. egg permalink
    January 21, 2015 10:41 am

    Working oneself to death is highly commendable.

  291. TB Queensland permalink
    January 21, 2015 10:58 am

    Which fkn thread was I discussing Islam with sb, on?

    Anyway …. did I mention Saudi Arabia?

    http://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/woman-struggles-during-state-sanctioned-beheading-10th-execution-this-month-in-saudi-arabia/story-fnh81ifq-1227191017506

  292. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 11:10 am

    And even more stuff about Islam

    This does appear to be a little over the top.

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/isis-killers-butcher-13-football-5005266

    Islamic State (ISIS) killers butchered 13 football fans for tuning in to watch Iraq take on Jordan in the Asian Cup.

    The young men paid the highest price possible for their love of the game after they were machine gunned in an arena in the IS-controlled Iraqi city of Mosul.

  293. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 11:12 am

    Working oneself to death is highly commendable.

    Why would that be, could you outline the positives?

  294. TB Queensland permalink
    January 21, 2015 11:38 am

    Why would that be, could you outline the positives?

    Is there scientific evidence for this?

    Are you discussing paid work or volunteer work?

    Work to some is pleasure for others, how would you define work?

  295. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 12:28 pm

    could you outline the positives?

    And is there a graph for that? 😉

  296. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 1:03 pm

    Work to some is pleasure for others, how would you define work?

    Interesting thought TB, a professional sportsperson would consider themselves at work, while a labourer or factory worker might think they get a lot of money money for play, same for acting possibly. Work comes in many forms, it is the value placed on different work that is highly conscientious IMO and who decides the value!

  297. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 1:26 pm

    Low 10-year bond rates are the deal of the century but Abbott’s not at the table:
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/low-10year-bond-rates-are-the-deal-of-the-century-but-abbotts-not-at-the-table-20150120-12tq4j.html

    …Could the Coalition grab the opportunity before it vanishes? There are some good signs. With help from the Greens it axed Labor’s debt ceiling. Since taking office it has run up an extra $78 billion in debt. But it is unorganised, behind in the polls and a prisoner of some of the silly things it said about debt while in opposition.

    We have a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. It’ll slip through our fingers…

  298. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 1:38 pm

    The Independent’s tribute to the dropping of the p.3 girl

  299. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 2:14 pm

    “Low 10-year bond rates are the deal of the century but Abbott’s not at the table:”

    Oh great. The Green lunatic makes a comment.

    Lets get into even more debt because interest rates are low.

    I think lots of home owners are doing just that

  300. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 2:37 pm

    I think lots of home owners are doing just that

    You say that like it’s always a bad thing?

  301. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 2:46 pm

    Well some people are borrowing so much money that if the interest rates go up to normal levels they will be in big trouble.

    Same goes for Australia.

    But the Green lunatic wants us to borrow even more money. If the govt borrows even more money interest rates may be low for 10 years but what will interest rates be in 10 years time?

  302. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 2:59 pm

    You didn’t read the article did you nIl

  303. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 3:15 pm

    I read the article.

    Some lunatic wants us to spend spend spend.

    And what happens in 10 years time if bond rates are at 20% and we have not paid the money back?

  304. January 21, 2015 3:19 pm

    I just read the article. Martin sounds somewhat confused. He’s urging the government to borrow even more money (does he think they’re not already borrowing?), but can’t quite come up with feasible projects to spend it on …

    “In Australia’s case that’s probably an extra $100 billion. That’s enough to build the long-awaited Brisbane to Sydney to Melbourne high-speed rail line, or to build Labor’s original national broadband network, or Sydney’s $11 billion WestConnex road project plus Melbourne’s $11 billion metro rail project plus Melbourne’s $16 billion East West Link plus something big in each of the other states.

    “And it would cost next to nothing. All each of these projects would need is a positive real rate of return (which several of those listed above lack) and we would get ahead.”

  305. January 21, 2015 3:21 pm

    Martin thinks the money is almost free, because interet rates are low. There’s still the small matter of repaying the principal, which he fails to address.

  306. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 3:25 pm

    and we have not paid the money back?

    If you invest in projects with a higher rate of return than what you are borrowing, looking at under ten year projects as the article states, then you can come out in front.

    NBN springs to mind 😉

  307. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 21, 2015 4:44 pm

    NBN springs to mind

    Yeah! What could go wrong with coughing up $60,000,000,000 for project that is built by a band of money hungry contractors?

    It’s bound to make money for everyone!

  308. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 4:52 pm

    It’s bound to make money for everyone!

    Who cares about everyone. It was the business people who were making the money. The rest of us just got our porn quicker (allegedly)

  309. January 21, 2015 5:17 pm

    “If you invest in projects with a higher rate of return than what you are borrowing, looking at under ten year projects as the article states, then you can come out in front.”

    I think I recall you admitting maths is not your thing.

    If you have a project with a rate of return equal to or greater than the interest rate you borrowed at, that will take care of the interest payments. But how are you going to pay back the money you borrowed when the ten year bonds are due for repayment? I know, you borrow more money at the prevailing (likely higher) interest rate.

    The terms “living on the credit card” and “intergenerational debt” come to mind.

  310. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 5:26 pm

    But how are you going to pay back the money you borrowed

    One would assume that, having invested this money, the budget would be made available to pay that off over the ten year term. The difference being, you get the cash now to implement infrastructure, and pay that off over the ten years.

    Money needs to spent on infrastructure anyway (as yabot keeps telling us). Instead of spending the money on infrastructure over the ten years, it could go into paying the principal off.

    The difference being, we have the money at the start to invest.

    The NBN is the prime example. The longer we leave it, the more expensive it will become. Do it now, with money borrowed basically for nothing. In the long run, we’ll save money.

    The terms “living on the credit card” and “intergenerational debt” come to mind.

    The terms “investment” comes to mind.

    Most people in the country are “invested”, mostly in houses, but often elsewhere.

  311. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 5:37 pm

    “The terms “living on the credit card” and “intergenerational debt” come to mind.

    According to lefties, Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) means this is not a problem. A country with a sovereign currency can create money and can never go bankrupt.

    It is amazing. People can always find theories which back up their own personal beliefs. MMT suits lefties. It means in theory that they can spend spend spend and there will be no problems. It suits what they want to believe perfectly.

  312. January 21, 2015 5:48 pm

    lt is much better not wasting money on so-called NBN, the next Google, the next Fakebook, the next `big` thing, will still come out of Silicon-Valley or Alberta-Canadia. Australia doesn`t need to be part of nerds `inventing` these type of things. We are the `clever` country and `dig` things up. #teabags

  313. January 21, 2015 5:53 pm

    “the budget would be made available to pay that off over the ten year term.”

    You mean the budget that’s a defecit budget because our governments continue to spend more than they receive in tax revenue? That budget? Years of deficit budgets mean we as a nation are already in a huge amount of debt (hint: debt means borrowed money). But you suggest we just keep on borrowing. No wonder the country’s fucked when we have economic ignoramuses (ignorami?) like Peter Martin parading as economics reporters.

    Here’s an idea. Let’s tighten our belts and get the budget into surplus. Years of surplus budgets would mean we could start to pay off our debt. Once that’s done we could actually start spending money that isn’t borrowed, but that we actually have.

  314. January 21, 2015 5:57 pm

    “the budget would be made available to pay that off over the ten year term.”

    Let’s borrow $100 billion to build infrastructure then pay that off with more borrowed money.

    Fucking brilliant.

  315. January 21, 2015 6:00 pm

    We used to have surplus budgets and $billions in future funds. That’s probably all been pissed up against the wall by now.

  316. Tom R permalink
    January 21, 2015 6:24 pm

    because our governments continue to spend more than they receive in tax revenue?

    Yea, how did that come about again?

    Of course, borrowing money in bonds is a little different from having an unsustainable budgetry position. 😉

    #justayin

    the next Google, the next Fakebook, the next `big` thing, will still come out of Silicon-Valley

    I’m hoping that’s all tongue in cheek teabag. I’m really hoping……

  317. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 6:32 pm

    As everybody knows I like to repeat myself so here i go again.

    The worst thing about our debt is that the majority is foreign. WE do not have enough money in Australia to fund our debt so we have to borrow from overseas. Apparently we borrow about 70% of our debt from foreigners.

    Our interest bill on our debt is currently $1B/month so this means $700M leaves the country every month to foreign investors.

    For the USA it is reversed. They fund about 30% of their debt from foreigners. But the USA also has vast overseas assets (GM, Ford) that more than covers their overseas borrowing.

    There is a budget emergency for us but lefties cannot see the problem.

  318. January 21, 2015 6:36 pm

    “Of course, borrowing money in bonds is a little different from having an unsustainable budgetry position.”

    How, when it makes the budget position (debt) even worse? You can’t compartmentalise debt. You owe x amount of dollars then you borrow more. The result is higher debt.

    Of course the leftist-Keynesian answer is not to curb spending, run surplus budgets, and pay off debt. That solution is to increase taxes, run budget deficits, and keep on borrowing and spending.

    Leave it to the next generation to sort out. The (I’m all right) Jack system.

  319. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:42 pm

    Leave it to the next generation to sort out. The (I’m all right) Jack system.

    deficit is not a dirty word

    I would say ‘I’m all right jack’ is this generations attitude to climate change action, why is it not OK to do one thing [have debt] but OK for another [leave enormous next generation debt for CC action]?

    One is just money, the other is survival of the species. I know which is more important.

    There is a budget emergency for us but lefties cannot see the problem.

    lefties can see the problem, but the government won’t take the necessary budget measures which would bring it back in surplus immediately [hint: not the ones they’re trying to ram down our throats currently]

  320. January 21, 2015 8:44 pm

    We just can`t go around capitulating to `Lefty-ideas` or `common-sense`. We all know the excessive waste Gough left us in when he connected all `users` to the National Sewer Network, if Gough had been `responsible` he would have saved the taxpayers 4% and made `users` pay for and run flexible hosing from their crappers to the nodes located down the street. #teabag-theory

  321. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 21, 2015 8:49 pm

    Most people in the country are “invested”, mostly in houses, but often elsewhere.

    yep, they’re on their 3rd or 4th investment property by now.

    The next generation can’t even get their foot in the door of a property because the investors [the ones who really are living on the credit card] have created such a bubble, they don’t care about housing for others, it’s ‘i’m more than all right jack’ for them.

  322. January 21, 2015 8:53 pm

    “One is just money, the other is survival of the species. I know which is more important.”

    Money? 😯

  323. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 21, 2015 9:18 pm

    “lefties can see the problem

    I don’t think i have seen a leftie say we have a budget problem. I have seen them say our debt is low, their is no budget emergency and now is the time to take advantage of low interest rates to borrow even more money and get us into more debt.

    I think the low interest rates are changing peoples investment behaviour. Money in the bank gets almost nothing. Better to buy Telstra shares and get a good dividend. Or borrow some money and buy an investment property and hope for some capital gain.

    If interest rates go back to more normal levels i think a lot of people will be in trouble. Same goes for Australia, if interest rates double we will be spending $2B/month instead of $1B/month in interest on our debt.

  324. armchair opinionator permalink
    January 22, 2015 12:02 am

    Seems that others feel the same was as me, pointing out the problem with hockey’s logic

    http://www.smh.com.au/comment/smh-letters/if-we-live-to-150-were-going-to-need-another-planet-20150120-12u18y.html

  325. January 22, 2015 1:06 am

    ; tosy @ 5:17pm

  326. January 22, 2015 1:08 am

    Anyone wanna put money on Abbott staying the fuck out of Oddland until well after it matters?

  327. January 22, 2015 1:11 am

    “I would say ‘I’m all right jack’ is this generations attitude to climate change action”

    Honestly, I think plenty of em have assimilated the threat level.

    I’ve been chastised by some (who could give narry a fuck about most things) for leaving the outside & interior lights on in my hotel room to discourage burglary whilst I was away.

  328. egg permalink
    January 22, 2015 6:44 am

    ‘One is just money, the other is survival of the species. I know which is more important.’

    Death to humans, they really are a wasted space.

    ‘but the government won’t take the necessary budget measures which would bring it back in surplus immediately’

    Tax the richest 1% so that they are virtually worthless and then do the same to the upper middle class, anybody earning more than $80,000 is dead meat.

  329. egg permalink
    January 22, 2015 9:13 am

    Its against my principles of ‘free trade’ to punish the middle class, so the best way forward is to create an infrastructure lottery (similar to the Sydney Opera House lottery) and don’t touch the tax system, which is equitable.

    The people have the money, we just have to extract it in a more popular way. If you want a very fast train network the lottery could fund the interest on the debt until the end of never.

  330. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 9:34 am

    From the files of “No shit sherlock”

    The Abbott government has been accused of exaggerating growth in healthcare spending to justify cuts to Medicare rebates.

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/government-accused-of-overstating-health-spending-growth-20150121-12v8mb.html

    No wonder the grubmints sales job is so bad, they keep lying to people.

  331. January 22, 2015 9:58 am

    Slate: Daniel Sarewitz: It’s the End of the World as We Prefer It, and I Feel … Stupid

  332. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 22, 2015 10:00 am

    Wow

    Has been accused.

    Lefties are always making accusations, mostly falsely.

    Fact is people used to retire at 65 and die at 68. They are now retiring at 65 and dying at 85.

    Heath costs are therefore much higher than they used to be.

  333. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 10:12 am

    dying at 85.

    I thought it was 150 ?? lol

  334. egg permalink
    January 22, 2015 10:24 am

    Sarewitz is good, cuts through the fog brilliantly.

  335. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 10:47 am

    cuts through the fog brilliantly.

    In the way that only fog can be cut through 😉

    So, bad things happen, we should care less about making it worst 😯

    I have noted the denialists are (almost) past the denying phase, and into the care factor phase.

    In a recent private conversation under the Chatham House rule, one of the world’s most senior industry leaders, who is considered to be at the more moderate end of the spectrum, insisted that we are going to burn all the world’s hydrocarbons despite the consequences.

    His reasoning is that a growing population in the developing world needs energy to raise living standards, that renewables will not become a dominant energy source till the end of the century and that politicians don’t have the courage or power to limit production.

    He acknowledged that the burning of all reserves would almost certainly lead to temperature rises of up to 4C, but argued the best way forward is to focus on limiting the damage through such technologies as carbon capture and storage.

    http://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2015/jan/21/al-gore-lord-stern-oil-companies-fossil-fuels-climate-change

    Perhaps they are right, they have stymied for so long, that real action is too late.

    The scientists disagree, so you can guess which side I’ll pick 😉

  336. January 22, 2015 10:58 am

    “I have noted the denialists are (almost) past the denying phase, and into the care factor phase.”

    Because they know they’re on the right side of history.

    The problem is that President Obama is listening to scientists that are either playing politics with their expertise, or responding to a political mandate from the administration (probably a combination of both). Not just administrators in govt labs (e.g. Schmidt, Karl), but think of the scientist networks of John Holdren and John Podesta: to me the scariest one one is Mann to Romm to Podesta.

    So what is wrong with President Obama’s statements as cited above?
    ◾His statement about humans having exacerbated extreme weather events is not supported by the IPCC
    ◾The Pentagon is confusing climate change with extreme weather (see above)
    ◾‘Climate change is real’ is almost a tautology; climate has always changed and always will, independently of anything humans do.
    ◾His tweet about ‘97%’ is based on an erroneous and discredited paper [link]
    ◾As for ‘Denial from Congress is dangerous’, I doubt that anyone in Congress denies that climate changes. The issue of ‘dangerous’ is a hypothetical, and relates to values (not science).

    And speaking of the ‘deniers’ in Congress, did anyone spot any errors in the actual science from Senator Inhofe’s rebuttal?

    The apparent ‘contract’ between Obama and his administrators to play politics with climate science seems to be a recipe for anti science and premature policies with negative economic consequences that have little to no impact on the climate.

    Maybe some day, in a future administration, we can have a grown up conversation about climate change (natural and human caused), the potential risks, and a broad range of policy responses.

    http://judithcurry.com/2015/01/21/raw-politics-of-climate-change-in-the-u-s/

    Get ready for TomR to call Prof. Curry a ‘denier’…in 5..4..3..2..

  337. January 22, 2015 11:05 am

  338. January 22, 2015 11:06 am

  339. Neil of Sydney permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:07 am

    Mate all these graphs and evidence and facts.

    They are all useless.

    TomR believes in AGW.

    That is all the evidence that anybody with any brains needs to know that AGW is a load of crap.

  340. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:10 am

    Tony, you are on fire with this. The only problem with talking truth to stupid is that it is a waste of breath. Stupid is impervious to logic. This quote from the Slate article captures the problem:

    No matter that long and sad human experience teaches us where such absolute orthodoxies lead. Indeed, with climate change being blamed for almost everything these days, the one phenomenon that seems to have escaped the notice of scientists, environmentalists and the media alike is that, perhaps above all, climate change is making us stupid.

  341. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:15 am

    Of course you can’t expect Climate Worriers to care enough to curtail their own behaviour. Their care and concern is about seeming to care. Reining in their own extravagant lifestyles to do their bit is completely out of the question. Here come the warm jets.

  342. Splatterbottom permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:18 am

    And spare a thought for the Swiss laundry workers who have to deal with designer knickers caked in the rancid frottage cheese generated by this wankfest.

  343. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:35 am

    I don’t need to call curry a denialist, her denial does that

    His statement about humans having exacerbated extreme weather events is not supported by the IPCC

    Except it is, and has been for a long time

    https://www.dieselnet.com/news/2007/04ipcc.php

    ◾The Pentagon is confusing climate change with extreme weather (see above)

    A pretty bold statement with nothing but a reference to her own fevoured mind (see above)

    ◾‘Climate change is real’ is almost a tautology; climate has always changed and always will, independently of anything humans do.

    There is no climate chage, except for the climate changing 😯

    ◾His tweet about ‘97%’ is based on an erroneous and discredited paper [link]

    Except it isn’t nor wasn’t

    http://skepticalscience.com/debunking-climate-consensus-denial.html

    ◾As for ‘Denial from Congress is dangerous’, I doubt that anyone in Congress denies that climate changes. The issue of ‘dangerous’ is a hypothetical, and relates to values (not science).

    Of course there is denial in congress. Being a smart ass doesn’t change the fact

    I don’t need to call curry a denialist. her denial shows it better than ever I could 😉

  344. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 11:36 am

    climate change is making us stupid.

    That article is exhibit A 😆

  345. TB Queensland permalink
    January 22, 2015 12:39 pm

    Fuck! Here we go again!

    ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

  346. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 1:03 pm

    WAKE UP JEFF! 🙂

  347. January 22, 2015 7:03 pm

    Hey Tinfoil`osy, ZZZZZZZZzzz, restart the boring denial topic on your `art` thread and stop derailing the other topics and boring us shitless, take the rest of the hob-goblins with you.

  348. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 22, 2015 7:17 pm

    Hey Tinfoil`osy, ZZZZZZZZzzz, restart the boring denial topic on your `art` thread and stop derailing the other topics and boring us shitless, take the rest of the hob-goblins with you.

    Personally, I think it would be great if you’d fuck off.

  349. January 22, 2015 7:18 pm

    ToM, I completely ignore any scratchings that fool makes now. It’s much more satisfying.

  350. Tom of Melbourne permalink
    January 22, 2015 7:26 pm

    Almost all contributors exchange their views in the right spirit (even Ricky). It isn’t that he has a political orientation that I disagree with (as his is entirely undefined).

    The reason that he should FFUCK OFF is that he-
    * is deliberately disruptive
    * has entirely no sense of humour
    * can’t spell and invents words
    * is a cunt

  351. January 22, 2015 7:31 pm

    Can’t argue with any of that, especially the last point.

    Bagz at his ‘puter:

  352. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 7:50 pm

    Thanks for the reminder tosy

    memo to self, put bandaid back over integrated webcam.

  353. Tom R permalink
    January 22, 2015 7:52 pm

    Personally, I think it would be great if you’d fuck off.

    Have you just got back from holiday too yomm?

    Both you and reb seem to be “in the spiwit” of it 😉

  354. January 22, 2015 7:54 pm

    #my mistake Tinfoil`osy, clearly it is the most interesting and popular topic, fill the joint with `denial`

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