Kevin or Julia, who is telling the Troof?

Gillard now says she lied about Rudd’s personal traits.

Wow, that’s some bow you got there.

But milk it for all it’s worth. ltdnews will be milking the lefty abc like crazy, along with their Union witch hunt.

And the right wingers are STILL crying about the “lefty” abc ROFL

When do we get to see at home with tabot?

had lowest debt of `teh-west

Thanks to Costello. It needs to be mentioned again that in 2007 the Commonwealth was debt free. In fact we had money in the bank. Govt debt was at -3.8% of GDP in 2007. Yes minus 3.8%.

However thanks to Kevin, Julia and Wayne and the people who voted for them this did not last long.

for nils

Combet performed well in the show.

Bowen as leader and Combet as the attack dog – that would do some damage to the current government.

Shorten would be relegated to the type of post that suits his ability – Assistant Minister for Aged Care (or something)

For the resident fuckin moron…

I think that is a harsh thing to say about yomm

Accurate, but harsh 😉

Cesar Melham has resigned as state government whip because he (apparently) agreed to a discounted wage in return for a fee.

This practice was that the employer would get cheaper wages, the union would get the employer to pay the membership fees and the union would leave them alone. Everyone’s a winner except the employees!

I wonder whether this practice was initiated by Melham, or whether he inherited the practice.

Cesar isn’t that bright, and I suspect he didn’t invent it, possibly he got it from his predecessor – Bill Shorten.

It will be interesting to see whether anyone comes up with examples that predate Cesar Melham.

I don’t think there is much doubt about the practice.

I recall some of the turf war between AWU & CFMEU when Shorten was rescuing the AWU from insolvency. The CFMEU got annoyed that the AWU was doing deals at below general settlements to get members.

Did the growth rate of the economy of China EVER drop below 6%?

I recall ROFL

Did the growth rate of the economy of China EVER drop below 6%?

Just how many percentage points did it drop yomm?

Because, if it was going gangbusters, why did mining have their own mini recession (which would have been much bigger had the rest of the country not supported them)?

While China grows at 6+%

What was their growth rate pre GFC again yomm?

I got it right.

How do you explain away that data I linked to above then, the data that showed the stimulus money was all that was keeping Australia going in 2010? Or the oz arguing that “we really did have a recession”

Shit, if they’d listened to the likes of you or the libs, we WOULD have had a recession, no ifs or buts there.

Swan didn’t change policy.

Exactly. And we stil missed a recession by a whisker, and the stimulus was still keeping the country afloat years later. Stimulus that both you and the libs would not have used. Stimulus that prevented a recession you seem to think we should have had.

Did anyone notice my change of title.

Mrs Walrus was so taken by the way Rudd and Julia completely rewrote History last night that she decided she would do the same so she appointed herself Queen of England descended from the House of Walrus of Palm Beach this morning and granted me a lifetime peerage.

“”Splendid and a jolly good show your Majesty””………… I replied

“Associate diploma””

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

And what do you know about Ass. Dips,/i>

That they’re outta reach of the average ex drug cop cum politician

Swan, TB etc thought unemployment would reach 10.5% (I think TB nominated 12%)

They didn’t really understand the structure of the economy, and that while ever China’s growth remained above 6%, AUstralia wouldn’t suffer the severity of the downturn that would occur in other countries.

Some economists got it, and they were the ones that I listened to.

TB didn’t.

and that while ever China’s growth remained above 6%, AUstralia wouldn’t suffer the severity of the downturn that would occur in other countries.

Why do you pick 6% yomm? Have you answered my previous question in regards to what the growth was before the GFC?

How do you account for the fact that we missed a recession by a whisker, even with the massive stimulus, and that mining (you know, the one relying on China) entered a technical industry wide recession?

And the fact that, years after the GFC, the stimulus was still the only driver within the economy?

Agree with Tom of Melbourne i do.

These were the same economists who got hit with the financial tsunami they either missed or ignored … but certainly didn’t predict …

I went to the trouble of getting myself informed by going to some economic forums. A couple economic consultantsI got to know did a lot of work on the mining sector, and researched elements of the demand from China, even in the event of a severe international downturn.

I found their research persuasive, so passed this on in my commentary at the time.

It turns out they were I was right, and TB and Swan were WRONG!

GFC? G19+1 = G20? Co-ordinated stimulii of 2% of GDPs? Ring any bells? Bueller? ToM? Joe? Anyone?

Is yomm hockeys new adviser?

After months of hinting the Abbott government isn’t doing enough to lift the economy, Glenn Stevens has come right out and said it.
……
Borrowing to fund infrastructure that will earn a return makes sense even if it runs up deficits and debt. It is “not the same as borrowing to pay pensions or public servants”.
..
The governor desperately needs the government to do its bit to boost the economy, rather than leaving the heavy lifting up to him.

He came out and said so.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/reserve-bank-governor-glenn-stevens-more-infrastructure-spending-now-please-20150610-ghl1ri.html

Infrastructure spending is deteriorating, yet we are borrowing more and more, as opposed to reducing it as was happening before the election. If it isn’t going into infrastructure, where is it going?

Furthermore commodity prices exploded after 2007.

Is the commodity price the same as investment or output nil?

So, you are claiming Ken Henry is lying, too.

Is there anyone who you disagree with who isn’t lying? OK, scrap that, I think I can guess the answer 😆

picture from this link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_in_Australia

coal output did not collapse

“I am sure output exploded as well. It certainly did for coal.”

I think from memory Coal came off its peaks in the run up to 2009 and it was Iron Ore and Gas prices that exploded out of the blocks .

But I might be wrong………………..?

yep it looks like Ken Henry is lying. Iron ore production, people employed and production value all increased during the GFC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_ore_mining_in_Western_Australia#Statistics

I’ll also add that if the ALP put together a decent policy on negative gearing and limit it to new developments rather than existing housing, and limit the foreign investment in existing housing…I may vote for them.

A few years on… and MY VIEWS HAVE BEEN PROVED CORRECT

Except for the evidence I listed, and continue to list, that shows it wasn’t 😉

But, apart from reality ……………

And you inability to confront that evidence that disagrees with you. Perhaps you are in fact chriskenny. Just block me lol

Greg Combet from “The Killing Season”

“If you’re gonna hand over 1600 bucks to an installer to go out to someone’s home to install installation for free for the householder, they’ve got to at least have the life experience and experience in the real economy to say, ‘Well, sh*t that’s open to abuse isn’t it?’”

And what have we been saying on here for fucking ever ???????????

And what have we been saying on here for fucking ever ?

That the abusers are the ones breaking the law?

No, Combet believes the people who rolled out the program were fucking naive.

I’m not disagreeing with that. In fact, I recall at the time many people were extremely frustrated at just how far the PS had been razed and how little talent was left there to implement any such policy.

Does that change the fact that the people rorting are doing the wrong thing?

“”………Ben Phillips, the principal research fellow at the National Centre for Social and Economic Modelling (NATSEM), says it is “interesting” that no other economic modelling outfits or academic experts share “such concern” about his budget analysis as the government does….”

That’s just and out and out LIE.

Unless in his world women dont count

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Sloan

Unless in his world women dont count

It’s a not a gender thing, it’s the point that you are taking about a paid shill who is wrong more times than she speaks. Judith Sloane, expert ROFL

Would love to see her sharing her “concerns” in this regard ROFL

Ken Henry said production collapsed during the GFC. Henry is lying. There was no collapse.

And you are basing this on a graph from wikipedia that showed a dip for the time in one section of the industry. Interesting

The stoopid just got stoopider

Prime Minister Tony Abbott has described wind farms as “visually awful” and boasted slashing the Renewable Energy Target will restrict growth in the industry.

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/awful-and-noisy-tony-abbott-slams-wind-farms-during-interview-with-alan-jones-20150611-ghl7m0

……..probably not

From my reading, weren’t the companies just paying the Union fees for Union members directly? Is this illegal, as I recall setting up similar in past.

Or perhaps I am mis-reading what is being claimed.

“many people were extremely frustrated at just how far the PS had been razed and how little talent was left there to implement any such policy.

Honestly, that is so stupid.

If the government pushes lots and lots (ie $$$$$BILLIONS & $$$$BILLIONS) –
*in front of contractors and
*the contractors are actually required by the government program to recruit inexperienced workers and
*they are paid per installation

…then it is no surprise to sensible people that poor safety will result. The people that set up this program have to accept their significant share of the blame for the outcomes.

Must be a “Male thing

Reading isn’t your thing is it.

It’s a not a gender thing

Why do you always try to bring sex into it?

And haven’t seen her “concerns” yet. Of course, your disagreement over the NATSEM is that ONE paid shill has “concerns”, which makes it all wrong. Really, THAT is your argument 😯

“Really, THAT is your argument”

No that”s just the start of it.

He first up lied over whether anyone disagreed with him except the government.

Whether his figures stack up are a whole new thing.

…and THE FACT IS THAT MY ECONOMIC COMMENTARY WAS MORE ACCURATE THAN SWAN’S

yomms going to go with ignoring I see

He first up lied over whether anyone disagreed with him except the government.

well, we are currently taking your word for that, even though I’ve asked you a couple of times for a reference

And you are basing this on a graph from wikipedia that showed a dip for the time in one section of the industry. Interesting

Give it a miss. Your imagined dip is not a collapse. A collapse would be a halving of production. The only graph which showed a dip was in coal employment. Coal production and iron ore production EXPLODED under Rudd as did commodity prices.

Ken Henry is lying. Gee i wonder which party he votes for?

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/australia/gdp-from-mining

I should have clarified at the start that the chart nils was linking to is “Australia GDP From Mining”.

“”……even though I’ve asked you a couple of times for a reference”

“”Professor Judith Sloan, one of Australia’s best-known economists, is a leading figure in academic and business circles and has extensive experience in both the …”” – ABC News

https://www.google.com.au/#q=related:www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/columnists/judith-sloan+NATSEM+Judith+Sloan

And

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/calm_down_these_budget_changes_are_not_brutal/

And just makes Ken Henry’s comments look more and more reasonable

You are dishonest. I cannot understand how you can be so dishonest.

There was no collapse in mining production or prices. In fact there was an explosion.

Drop or no drop every figure in that graph was higher than in 2007.

Second link is wrong one…………..my bad

Trying to puncture Paywall now

Drop or no drop every figure in that graph was higher than in 2007.

It’s a percentage of GDP nil, and it plateaued at a time when GDP crashed, which would indicate …………..

Trying to puncture Paywall now

cheers wally. From what I have read, she is arguing that it is not so bad, because it could have been worst. I haven’t seen anything anywhere where she actually disputes what NATSEM is saying.

Of topic (but prob back onto the original), it looks like the smear on Shorten is hotting up.

“”I haven’t seen anything anywhere where she actually disputes what NATSEM is saying.””

No….no…………like I said my bad. That”s last years stuff.

I originally got in via Judith Sloan NATSEM for this years Budget but now “” the drawbridge”” is up.

Like I said my bad

No probs wally. Although, it’s just a matter of time imo until she does start bagging it. I did see on a catallaxy thread she was bagging it previously.

Both will give you the ALP line on any issue.

Backed up with the relevant data I’d hasten to add 😉

Growth of -Q1 0.01%, Q2 -0.01% Q3 +0.2%, Q4 +0.3% = Recession

Change the order = No Recession

Swan never predicated the stimulus “to avoid recession” that’s just the spin you’ve come up with more recently.

“If Albo performs they won’t need to bring out the Vietnamese brothel photos.”

LOL

I have a very attractive single female who was subjected to a lot of unwanted attention at a certain Sydney Lord Mayor’s Annual New Years Eve Fireworks Party by a certain ALP high flyer

Vietnamese brothel photos

Like I said, the smears are just ramping up, which to me indicates he’s doing his job just fine 😉

Perhaps it is time you did a google search.

If you are going to run a smear, at least have the common decency to provide the smear. Or haven’t you had time to get the site up yet 😉

Dr Karl getting his mojo back

Dr Karl telling lies again

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/awful-and-noisy-tony-abbott-slams-wind-farms-during-interview-with-alan-jones-20150611-ghl7m0

Mr Abbott made the remarks after the conservative broadcaster Alan Jones asked why the government had agreed to subsidise wind farms when residents living near them claim to suffer health problems.

It was the residents who made the claim.

read the whole article nil

Mr Abbott replied the location of wind farms was primarily a state government issue but said he agreed they could cause health problems.

read the whole article nil

It was the people living next to these wind turbines who made the claim. I would believe the residents before i would believe Dr Karl.

Actually what Abbott said was this

“Well Alan look, I do take your point about the potential health impact of these things

It was the residents who claimed their health was at risk. I would believe them before i would believe Dr Karl.

“Not including references is pretty poor form for a PhD”

Not really…….most of it is in the very first article he links to down the bottom also done by him and a colleague.

My Link is to a quick summary

Ask yourself a question………………………………..Would you want one erected within 1 or 2 or 3 kms of your place if you lived in a rural area ?

They’ve gone downmarket.

TB entertaining at a Lib function…

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/uncyclopedia/images/9/9a/Dumbad.gif/revision/latest?cb=20070618152115

Meanwhile, the tewwa level is cranked up to eleventy, while yabot and his cronies do all they can to help out the tewwas

A terrorism expert has warned that Prime Minister Tony Abbott is feeding Islamic State’s (IS) own propaganda machine by calling it a “death cult”.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-06-11/terrorism-expert-says-death-cult-is-a-misnomer/6539862

But this was the most revealing

“You can’t negotiate with an entity like this, you can only fight it.”

hmm, sounds a lot like our current grubmint.

I see the media is covering their arse over the budget, and sheeting home the blame to Labor. Business as usual.

It’s going to lead to serious losses of disposable income for low and middle income families, with a single-parent family with two children (with an annual income of $55,000) set to lose a huge $20,648 by the end of 2018/19.

But Labor is partly to blame, too. It tried to be too cute with its media strategy when releasing the modelling and that strategy backfired.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/how-the-abbott-government-stopped-us-talking-about-natsems-modelling-of-their-budget-20150611-ghjm1u

Sorry but it didn’t “backfire” without a lot of help. In fact, had you lot applied a modicum of journalistic integrity, it would have played well. Not only were the libs lying in Parliament over the modelling, you lot were running cover for them with your ‘he said, she said” shit. You should have called them out for lying, instead of pretending it is all part of some greater ‘debate’.

It is also not too late to highlight the fact that this budget IS as bad as the last, But instead, you wring your hands and bemoan “woe is us”, while still ignoring the elephant in the room.

the Coalition objected – quite rightly – that Labor ought to release the entire modelling immediately if it wanted people to take it seriously.

No, the grubmint claimed Labor wrote it you tool, in Parliament. Now THAT is a story. But no, wring your little pencils and cry about how Labor screwed you’se all over, even though the story was there in front of you. Lets forget the fact that the actual budget doesn’t even have it’s modelling. Again, THERE’S a story.

If you’d turned your TV off at that moment the criticism may have stayed with you.</i

But the damage was done. Talk of NATSEM modelling tapered off considerably from Thursday. Voters felt confused about its authenticity, and Labor had lost enthusiasm for the fight.

The damage doesn’t have to stay done. Instead of listing your failures as Labors, write articles that highlight the accuracy of NATSEM ffs. Yes, voters are confused, but that is more thanks to you then the libs. And this “Labor had lost enthusiasm for the fight.” is only in the fact that you have followed mordors eyes everywhere but where it wants to be, ON THE BUDGET.

Labor ministers continue to hold doorstops and speak to journalists about the budget (or try to), but you all want to talk about witch hunts, tewwa and wind mills

Stop titling in the wrong direction, then maybe us poor voters won’t be so ‘confused’

I guess you’ll have to get that site up and running after all nil

I would comment if i knew what you were taking about. But it looks like you are wrong again. I have not watch The Killing Season but it looks like the ABC has managed to spin the story into Labor saved Australia from the GFC. Here is a different opinion.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-06-11/barnes-the-killing-season-and-the-gfc-drama-not-history/6537256

Yet is the programme’s version of GFC history reliable? Gillard and Combet might have had political doubts but didn’t question the “Labor fixed the GFC” claim. No dissenting economic or partisan voices were presented…………….While politics is all about claiming credit and denying it to others, it’s hard to accept the Rudd-Henry GFC thesis at face value. It may be considered heretical to question received political wisdom on the GFC as reinforced by The Killing Season,and while later episodes may modify that story, the fundamental fact remains that, despite the crescendo of internal shocks in 2008 and 2009, the Australian economy was in good shape when Labor took office at the end of 2007.

Rudd, Gillard and Swan inherited from Howard and Costello zero net government debt, and had the unheard-of luxury of a budget surplus of $12 billion that was projected to rise to $60 billion over four years. We were riding the wave of a commodity price and export boom that gave the Labor government and its advisers supreme confidence in their own fiscal position, and the Rudd government’s ability to guarantee the big four Australian banks while global financial markets teetered

put a halt to the work of the commission?

It didn’t, as she um clearly showed. But, as she um clearly pointed out, it makes it a poor time to start one. Especially when one is already um pencilled in for the next um year.

“You know i do not know Gillian triggs but i bet this comment is a load of BS…………..Triggs is a lying piece if shit.”

I’m sure she’d love to get to know you NoS if you and her met

Um, why? What difference would it make to anyone

Well, her reply to the initial badgering by the fools in the senate committee who didn’t even have the common decency to read the report will offer an insight into that. When asked if she had spoken to the Labor ministers about the report at one of the specific times they posited, her reply was, of course not, as there was a caretaker mode in place. How will an inquiry be able to run when hurdles like that, in addition to the bullshit ones both sides throw up, are there, and are actually real?

And that’s because the straight forward ones had already been released. The remainder were the ones of a more difficult nature whose parent(s) were taking a greater time to verify.

wow, clutching at straws. So, your thesis is, the last ones in were the hardest to process, when they didn’t have a backlog. Because, under Labor, the time in detention was well under what we see now, so obviously none of these “hard cases” were around back then. With much more resource on hand. Then again, it seems most of the resources are out actually becoming a cog in the people smuggling chain.

Tony Abbott has refused to rule out Australian officials paying people smugglers to turn back asylum-seeker vessels, saying the government was determined to “stop the boats by hook or by crook”.

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2015/jun/12/tony-abbott-refuses-to-rule-out-paying-people-smugglers-to-turn-back-boats

So even tabot admits they wouldn’t stop at illegal activities to further demonise those worst off.

Walrus

Read my post

https://theguttertrash.com/2015/06/09/kevin-or-julia-who-is-telling-the-troof/#comment-106854

As soon as people are stopped being locked up the AVERAGE time in detention will increase for the people in detention. It was the continual addition of new asylum seekers that kept the average time in detention lower under Labor than under Abbott.

Just think about it for a minute. It is also the left again being deceitful. Never trust anything they say.

Just think about it for a minute.

It’s quite obvious you haven’t thought about it at all. What a circular piece of garbled nonsense

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/record-number-of-asylum-seeker-deaths-at-sea-in-2014-international-organisation-for-migration-20141217-12903h.html

Sensationally interesting article Tom R. F**KING Abbott, he’s now drowning people in the Mediterranean-

the crossing from the Mediterranean to Europe claimed over 3000 lives, while 540 migrants died in the Bay of Bengal. At least 307 died trying to cross the land border between Mexico and the USA. There have been no known asylum seeker deaths in Australian waters in 2014.

“Abbott, he’s now drowning people in the Mediterranean”

ROFLMAO

He dares chastise OUR logic ?

That’s TomR logic for ya

I’ve ben rolling around laughing at him so much I’ll need to get the timber floorboards recoated .

There have been no known asylum seeker deaths in Australian waters in 2014.

Just thought I’d emphasis that, but, that isn’t the point.

When we send them off on their merry way, WHERE DO THEY GO?

Think before you type!

because 2,000 have been in detention for only 2 weeks.

Get your mum to explain it to you dopey, because that is soo stoopid……

As to the drownings, let’s not forget the recent asylum seekers Indonesia refused. That is directly on us.

Get your mum to explain it to you dopey, because that is soo stoopid……

I actually thought from some of your comments that you might have a science education but obviously not.

Just say 2,000 people have been in detention for 12 months. Well the average time in detention is 12 months.

Just say another 2,000 people turn up so we now have 4,000 people in detention. Just say you measure the average length of time in detention the next day.

average time in detention now becomes 6 months.

2,000 people in detention for 12 months and 2,000 people in detention for zero months means the AVERAGE length of time in detention is now 6 months.

It is just simple maths.

Talking to a brick wall would be easier.

I am sure the length of time in detention for each individual asylum seeker has not changed under Abbott.

I am sure you know what an average is. Average length of time has increased because there are no new arrivals at detention centers.

It is just simple maths

😆 @ splatter

TomR- some maths for you

If 50 people have been in detention for 4 months and another 50 people had been in detention for 8 months, the average time in detention is 4+8/2=6 months.

If another 50 people suddenly turn up and we do the calculation again, average time in detention = 0+4+8/3= 4 months.

The average time in detention has been reduced from 6 to 4 months by the new arrivals. Abbott had no new arrivals so average time in detention was higher under Abbott.

The last time I did an illegal download was when I was 25 she was 23 and she said “don’t you dare “and I pointed something at her kneck.👿

Watch me here in a week-

http://www.biarritz.fr/portail/webcam_2.html

Alms for the poor.

I am sure the length of time in detention for each individual asylum seeker has not changed under Abbott.

nil, get an education

https://www.humanrights.gov.au/publications/forgotten-children-national-inquiry-children-immigration-detention-2014/4-overview

No point in misunderstanding the links and information Tom R provides!

Yet you do. Please, tell me again (sarc), where did these boats we forced back (and possibly actually made land) end up?

and who was a one of the most disgusting humans that ever lived

You mean, worst than a catlik priest?

so now we have to wait and see if blib will have the ticker to say anything publicly before hand

He had already pre-empted you teamnobody

nil, get an education

Well i was actually talking about total asylum seekers not kids in detention. Kids in detention peaked at almost 2,000 under Labor and are now down to less than 100.

And that graph you shows stops at Jan 2014, just after Abbott was elected. I fail to see your point. You would need to present a graph in Dec 2014 to make your point.

See this link for a maths lecture. As soon as new arrivals are stopped being added to detention centers the average time in detention will go up. It is just simple maths.

https://theguttertrash.com/2015/06/09/kevin-or-julia-who-is-telling-the-troof/#comment-106898

What a stupid tactic by Shorten, he says he defends his record as a union leader, but then says he won’t be answering questions about his record until August or September.

At every opportunity he should be asked questions about his record and he’ll be shown to be the dodgy, evasive hack that he really is.

It is just simple maths.

Exactly, simple maths

Triggs said time in detention increased under the libs

The data confirms it. Maybe now you should say sorry?

At every opportunity he should be asked questions about his record and he`ll be shown to be the dodgy, evasive hack that he really is

Are we talking about tabot, pyne? From memory, they both have lots of questions to answer.

Which reminds me.

We are currently involved in the people smuggle industry

People smugglers have been linked o funding ISIS

Those linked with tewwa and are of dual national citizenship can have their Australian citizenship revoked under the new proposal.

Is it time for tabot to prove for once and all that he revoked his British citizenship?

Else he might find himself in a position where he is forced back there 🙂

that transcript snippet you dropped team-cheerer just shows blib tap-dancing around the mulberry-bush,

Actually, it showed a churnalist interrupting before Shorten had answered.

Yep, a hack that took money from employers Who had taken it from employees to pay their Union fees. We used to do it for Union fees, it was very common practice for the employer to deduct them out of our pay directly. It is still done for super. In fact, it is illegal NOT to do it for super.

What a fucken conniption.

Meanwhile, tabots daughter gets a free scholarship, the institution gets special treatment from tabot, and there are no “Question to Answer”.

Pyne has so many Questions to Answer of Ashbygate, but silence from the journos.

A Union rep gets pay rises for workers, and there are nothing but Questions to Answer, no matter how often he does, (or is able considering the ongoing legal witch hunt)

What a crock of shit. Our media are bankrupt.

So you’re saying this was payroll deduction rather than the employer paying the fees?

Does the current AWU state secretary agree that this was the practice?

I don’t know if they had the same arrangement or not, and I’m not aware how much things have changed recently.

With workchoices and other attacks on Unions, it probably isn’t allowed, or it is at least frowned upon.

Just another method of driving Unions out of workplaces. Most people won’t go out of their way to pay a Union to get the pay rises they’ll get anyway from the Unions work.

If numbers of kids in detention went down how could time in detention increase?

😯

And you want to lecture me on maths ROFL

Anyway i was talking about asylum seekers in detention not just kids.

Who gives a fuck

Who gives a fuck

Just pointing out your errors. This comment from this article explains the error in more detail.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-02-23/triggs-detention/6083476

wave2surf 4:35 PM on 24/02/2015

Average time in detention, as measured in the way shown in the article, is actually a meaningless figure as it is mostly influenced by the number of arrivals on any given day, not just how long its taking to process people.

It is not a measure of processing time.

Oh, dear HTF would anyone know … Anyone!

BUT HE HAS QUESTIONS TO ANSWER!!!!!

“Oh, dear HTF would anyone know … Anyone!

With the greatest of respect TB, the current AWU state secretary seems to know, and he’s now criticising the past practices. You should try to keep up.

People Smugglers and Asylum Seekers?

All problems caused by ALP/Greens

Detention Centres?

All built or put back into action by ALP/Greens

International Relationships?

Phone bugging by Rudd and banning the live cattle trade caused lots of problems

ISIL and troop deployment?

What is your problem?

F35?

Submarines?

Did Hawke/Keating not spend any money on the military? It was Beasley who wanted us to build the Collins Class submarines in Australia. I should add this is one of the few things i agreed with that Hawke/Keating did.

What are you saying TB, we should not have a military?

It was Beasley who wanted us to build the Collins Class submarines in Australia.

And it was yabot who went against the militaries advise and began this rubbish with Japan.

Again, see the link I put up earlier which shows just hos poorly suited the Japanese set up is for Australia. There is no way you can call them “off the shelf”

Excuse me! The link showed that the number of drownings worldwide increased dramatically in line with Australia forcing boats back.

Come on TomR. You have totally lost it. So the thousands of drownings in the Mediterranean are Abbotts fault?

All we have done is shipped the problem off elsewhere, and magnified its intensity in the process

So the drownings just off Italy are Abbotts fault.

Don’t blame me if you find your link inconvenient

Don’t blame me if you cannot tell me that none of those drownings are a result of Australias policy or not

I’m only referring to the criticism of past AWU practice by the current AWU secretary.

Perhaps you could provide his exact words, as, in the past, what you think you hear is not always what was said.

I mean, if the biggest issue you have is “Shorten did this previously, we don’t do that now”, then it’s time you checked history and changing practices over time.

#justsayin

Documents tendered to the commission show that the union’s Victorian branch in 2005 – when Shorten was in charge – invoiced a Melbourne builder, Winslow Constructions, for $38,228 to pay for 105 union memberships. The company was invoiced again when Shorten was branch secretary.
While the arrangement has been portrayed as an unscrupulous deal hatched by Shorten, Winslow has told the commission that it started in the 1990s, before Shorten was at the AWU.
Winslow said the practice was driven by a desire to keep out the militant Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union. The two unions have had a historical conflict, and the AWU’s apparent willingness to reach accommodations with employers led to it being dubbed “Australia’s Weakest Union” by the CFMEU.
While an employer paying union memberships is not illegal, it is industrially questionable. Current AWU secretary Ben Davis told the commission the practice weakened the bargaining power of unions and their members.

So under Shorten, the AWU invoiced the employer for the money, and Tom R and TB think it’s payroll deduction!

http://www.afr.com/news/policy/industrial-relations/shorten-at-risk-of-being-haunted-by-choice-20150612-ghmqse

From yomms link

It was concerned the practice could be in breach of a construction code introduced by the former state coalition government to reduce the influence of unions.

So the coalition grubmint made the practice (well, not even illegal, but questionable) and they now want to pin this on actions BEFORE the changes were made

ffs, is this not the biggest piece of unsubstantiated smear yet?

Well, Gillards was just as stoopid, yet our media still fell over themselves.

It isn’t up anyone else to prove anything

So, the fact that boats are being sent back, without our knowledge of details, and then more people start drowning. I can draw a line yomm. Not being able to prove anything is precisely WHY this bullshit “on water matters” is so wrong. So, where do these people go?

It isn’t up to anyone else to prove anything.

You are the one making a claim that is something else, you show something

LINDSAY PARTRIDGE, MANAGING DIRECTOR, BRICKWORKS: Yes, that is correct. It was fairly normal practice in the-from 70s on for companies to collect on behalf of their employees, the union dues then pass them on to the union on a monthly basis.

This thread is hilarious!

I AGREE!

yomm thinks Union officials getting better pay deals for their members have “Questions to Answer”

nil thinks we should only look after asylum seekers from countries we have invaded.

Much amusement

They came after WWII and Vietnam you fucking dopey moron …

And how many of these people came by boat? I believe most of the Vietnamese refugees which we took under Fraser were flown in.

The only person telling lies is you TB. Oh and also TomR who is trying to blame the thousands of refugees turning up in Italy on Abbott. Oh and also the rest of the ALP deadbeats who would not recognize the truth if they saw it walking down the street.

This post is hilarious..
1. Let’s just get some background straight Tom R.
• You asserted that the drownings were still occurring.
• SB challenged you on this
• You posted a link that said none were known in Australia
It isn’t up anyone else to prove anything, you posted a link that you said would prove something, and it didn’t.
—–
2. You asserted that the practice referred to was payroll deductions of unio fees by an employer.
It isn’t up to anyone else to prove anything. It’s up to you to show that the statement referred to payroll deduction by the employer.

and…
Tom R.
• You asserted that the drownings were still occurring.
• SB challenged you on this
• You posted a link that said none were known in Australia

As I said, and proved, more asylum seekers are drowning NOW than before the grubmint began forcing these boats back out onto the open sea. The facts proved this to be the case. No one here is able to confirm or not if those we sent back are in this group, but the fact remains, more are now drowning, precisely as I stated.

We also know that people died recently when Indonesia and Malaysia tried the same thing. A direct result of OUR policy.

You can try and prove my statement wrong yomm, but, since I have already put up the evidence, that might prove difficult

The commission’s analysis is also humiliating for the SDA.

The SDA are shit, and have been for a long time. It’s what happens when Unions are weakened and become puppets for big business. Luckily, safeguards put in by Labor prevent anachronistic old farts like them removing conditions.

Haven’t the SDA already been through the witch hunt. WOW, and they got through unscathed. Unsurprising. Mates rates perhaps 😉

A little background re Tom R’s current obfuscation –

Tom R said – “So even tabot admits they wouldn’t stop at illegal activities to further demonise those worst off.” (ie Australian context)
SB replied – Better than drowning them by the thousand like the ALP did! (ie Australian context)

Tom R replied – Considering even more are drowning now that the libs are forcing/paying smugglers to carry them back onto the ocean, not sure how anyone can try and run that argument with a straight face. (ie Australian context)

SB sought to test the assertion – And your evidence for that is????? (referring to Australian context)

Tom R posted the “evidence” that included – There have been no known asylum seeker deaths in Australian waters in 2014.

Then followed lots of obfuscation about the international situation.

That’s just not being honest.

(referring to Australian context)

Who said I was limiting it to Australian waters? I very clearly elaborated the reasons behind it, and you still have not supplied ANY sort of an answer to my question of WHERE DID THEY GO.

And fer nil, it is not just Italy (or the Mediterranean) that saw a spike. It was worldwide, except Australia, where they were very clear to emphasis “known”, as the clearly don’t know.

We shipped our problem off elsewhere, and, elsewhere, that problem has multiplied.

Work that one out.

This isn’t Australian context?

Again, for the slow ones.

Who said I was limiting it to Australian waters?

Which really was the point of my argument. We pushed them back out, to drown elsewhere. You may think that makes them someone elses problem. I don’t

lol Interesting headline, with this tucked in at the end

But the real property barons are among the ranks of the Liberal and National parties

Of course, making the most of tax arrangement is bad, if you are Labor, but good, if you are Liberal.

It really is a case of “perspective”, isn’t it.

Of course, making the most of tax arrangement is bad, if you are Labor, but good, if you are Liberal.

One point of the article was that it was Labor having a go at Hockey when Tony Burke was doing the same thing.

It is not illegal but it is not a good look. Perhaps Hockey and Burke should donate the rent money to charity.

It is not illegal but it is not a good look.

Yes, and guess who stopped doing it.

But you chose to argue “how” Vietnamese refugees arrived rather than say … oh, yes I forgot about WWII and Vietnam … no, you said … it was all Rudd/Gillard … twit!

Not sure what you are talking about TB but it was all Rudd/Gillards fault. But i forgot to add it was also the fault of the people who voted for them.

The Howard govt had solved all the problems through trial and error and the Labor party reopened all these problems.

50,000 illegal arrivals, 1,200 drownings, many more we do not know about and worse thousands of people in UNHCR camps denied places because of country shoppers.