Those Russian Beaver Fuckers are Gonna Beaver Fuck Us All!

I really can’t get rid of you lot can I.

Now I realise why I don’t hang around here that much any more.

You need to rein in the personal abuse splatter bottom. Seriously.

Baloons have rights too reb

lol splats, still listening to asshats I see

Yes MN.
The proof is that Putin is a cunt. That’s no longer in doubt
I suppose you’ll dismiss the report of the High Commission for Human Rights, that documented the rape of women and girls aged between 4 and 82 by the Russian military.

I wonder why she threatened Reynolds with having to pay her own costs if she didn’t shut up.

Is it because reynolds is full of $#it?

(btw, where did she ‘threaten’ this?)

Note to MN
I see that Silvio Berlusconi is providing support to Putin.
1. Demented old fascists have plenty in common with Putin
2. You’re known by the company you keep

Speaking of youtube videos, this isn’t one, but it is from an authoritative source.

Re the Robo Debt fiasco and the failures of the public service to provide “frank and fearless” advice as claimed.

Robodebt was started by Shorten/ALP in 2011. That is when computers started sending out debt notices.

Robodebt was started by Shorten/ALP in 2011

LINK!

TomR

“”Media Release:
New data matching to recover millions in welfare dollars
29 June 2011

A new data matching initiative between Centrelink and the Australian Taxation Office is expected to claw back millions of dollars from welfare recipients who have debts with the Australian Government.

Minister for Human Services Tanya Plibersek and Assistant Treasurer Bill Shorten today said the new initiative will enhance Centrelink’s debt recovery ability and is expected to recover more than $71 million over four years.

Beginning on July 1 this year, Centrelink and the ATO will automatically match data on a daily basis as a way of cross-checking former welfare recipients who have a debt with the Commonwealth.

Those who are identified as having debts and who haven’t made repayment arrangements with Centrelink may have their tax refunds garnisheed when they lodge their income tax return.

“The Government prefers to work with people and provide them with flexible debt repayment options, rather than having to garnishee their tax refunds,” said Ms Plibersek.

“But if people fail to come to an arrangement to settle their debts, the Government has a responsibility to taxpayers to recover that money.”

Ms Plibersek said Centrelink customers sometimes incurred a debt with the Commonwealth because they either inadvertently or intentionally claimed a benefit they were not entitled to.

Mr Shorten said the tax garnishee process had been carried out manually once a year for the past 15 years and involved a significant amount time on the part of the departmental officers.

“The automation of this process will free up resources and result in more people being referred to the tax garnishee process, retrieving more outstanding debt on behalf of taxpayers,” he said.

He said more than $27.5 million was recovered from over 43,000 former Centrelink customers’ tax refunds in the 2009/10 financial year through the tax garnishee process.

“The new data matching link is expected to increase the number of former customers identified for this process by an additional 65,000, above current detection levels, over the four years.”

(Compare:…”Beginning on July 1 this year [ie 2011], Centrelink and the ATO will automatically match data on a daily basis as a way of cross-checking former welfare recipients who have a debt with the Commonwealth.”

….and….

Contrast:…”The robodebt scheme ran from 2015 to 2019 and used income averaging of tax office data to calculate and raise debts”.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/mar/08/department-withheld-key-documents-from-watchdog-that-flagged-potential-illegality-of-robodebt )

I highly doubt this income averaging idea was a Coalition idea. It would have been thought up by some guru in the Public Service

Anyway Robodebt started in 2011. That is when computers started sending out debt notices

Did you know – “More than 10,000 jobs will be created from Australia’s acquisition of nuclear-powered submarines under the defence pact, according to the country’s navy.
Speaking ahead of his visit, the admiral who headed the AUKUS taskforce said thousands of jobs would be created from Australia’s biggest defence project.”

https://www.9news.com.au/world/aukus-update-nuclear-powered-submarines-deal-to-create-ten-thousands-jobs/f2b65469-d7ca-468b-938b-e67c131a3aaa

And we need those subs to protect the trade routes from Chinese aggression.
Even though China has trade pacts with 149 Nations. None of whom live in fear of a Chinese takeover.

Too ridiculous for words. Australia has given away its independence.

Will America defend its Empire till the death of the last Australian?

That is when computers started sending out debt notices

Where in that statement does it say a ‘computer sent out debt notices’, or wtte? All it says is it automated their process. It means INTERNALLY

As for morrison MN, he is the one who started it, allowed it through as treasurer, and then let it rip beyond all imagining, because of his destruction of our PS

“The public service is meant to be an enabler of government policy and not an obstacle.”

Yea, nah, it is supposed to implement, not enable ffs. The Government is not supposed to be a dictatorship. Yet morrison made it one. In almost all respects

https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2023/03/07/paul-bongiorno-robodebt-royal-commission/

What the Coalition did in 2016 was bring in a new computer method to determine income called income averaging.

No, income averaging had been used for years. What they did what use that solely to create a debt, when all it was was a method to determine who MIGHT have a debt.

You really are slow nil

No, income averaging had been used for years. What they did what use that solely to create a debt, when all it was was a method to determine who MIGHT have a debt.

If someone could translate this into English for me i would be grateful.

But your vile Liberal mates thought that they could get more money if they didn’t bother to check.

And they KNEW what they were doing was wrong. It was simply a means to get money from the disadvantaged to try and fill their black hole. They need to be put in jail, the ministers involved, and the public servants too timid, or too greedy, to do the right thing

Ten days later, the then Human Services minister, Marise Payne, in a meeting with Campbell, made an entry in her notebook that indicated they had discussed this welfare crackdown. Her notes record a decisive observation: “What can we do w/o having to legislate?”
This, perhaps, is the original sin of the debt recovery program known as robo-debt. The desire to go after welfare recipients for “easy” budget savings was to be done without new laws and this absence of new laws would mean the fundamental welfare assessment changes in what would become robo-debt could never be legal.

https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/law-crime/2023/03/11/robo-debt-final-week-it-served-them-right-did-it#mtr

btw, to ALL our gormless, corrupted, sphincter licking media
(I know, I’ve been blaming them for years yaaawn)

suspect it was thought up by some guru in the Public Service

Yes. morrison is too stupid to think of things like that. But, he asked a bunch of sycophantic fools how he can get money out of people, and this idea was floated. When they were told they would need to to change legislation, quite obviously, the word went out to hide that piece of information, and push on regardless of the cost, legally, or morally. Which is what the royal commission has shown all the way through.

Howard’s Liberal successors in the Lodge after 2013 began by cutting $8 billion in savings from the APS and in their first two terms they slashed 19,000 jobs.
….
But one now-retired senior mandarin who served under Liberal and Labor prime ministers says against this background, Morrison’s laying down of the law to the APS after his surprise 2019 election win was a cultural wrecking ball.
……..
Morrison said: “It’s about telling governments how things can be done, not just the risks of doing them, or saying why they shouldn’t. The public service is meant to be an enabler of government policy and not an obstacle.”

https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2023/03/07/paul-bongiorno-robodebt-royal-commission/

And so it happened. Australia is going full vassal.

““Australia has an urgent security problem. These confronting ideas can help solve it,” and it is the most incendiary of the bunch. The “experts” suggest rolling out mandatory national service to prepare Australians for war with China, as well as “basing US long-range missiles armed with nuclear weapons on Australian territory.”

https://caitlinjohnstone.substack.com/p/they-work-so-hard-to-manufacture?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=82124&post_id=107401978&isFreemail=true&utm_medium=email

And when did Australia citizens get to vote on this nonsense?

When Albo and Dutton are rowing in the same boat – be afraid – be very afraid!

Robodebt refers to the illegal system of generating a debt on the basis of an algorithm without actually knowing whether there was in fact a debt. That system is purely a creation of your Libmongrel mates.

OK thanks. Trouble is i have been told so many false things over the years by ALP/Greens supporters i no longer believe anything they say.

Even on this issue people were telling me that 2,030 people took their lives because of the stress they were under. No wonder people hated the program.

But it turns out over a two year period there were 900,000 debt notices sent and there were 2,030 deaths. A natural death rate for a population that size.

But i suspect 2011 was the beginning of a fully automated system. I also suspect that it was the idea of some guru in the Public Service

In a tumultuous world, where autocratic regimes have expansionist objectives, I think democratic nations should have alliances to ensure invasion is a most unappealing option

MN, I have to say, your posts are stupid. It’s time to state that as a fact.
Can you advise which country NATO has territorial claims on?
Expansion has been willing and justified by the threat of the expansionist autocratic regimes.
None of the former Warsaw Pact countries now support Putin. They chose to look west for a more prosperous and participative society.
They didn’t see their future with the largely impoverished Russia.
Grow up

But then, why are you comparing the death rate of the general population with the suicide rate of young people?

Are you saying nobody over the age of 24 is on Centrelink benefits?

Splatterbum- The media published an article with this title

Over 2000 people died after receiving Centrelink robodebt
notice, figures reveal

The implications are obvious. Down the bottom of the article it gave the full story.

The article examines a two-year period where 900,000 debt notices were sent and there were 2,030 deaths. A normal death rate for a population that size. Many of those 900,000 were old age pensioners on a pension and most probably died of old age.

The media tried to make out those 2,030 people died because they received a debt notice.

Why did you bring up 15-24 year olds? Many of those 900,000 were old age pensioners.

What sort of people would say that 2,030 people killed themselves because of govt policy when those 2,030 people died of natural causes? ie heart disease, old age, cancer plus some who took their life.

It shows that ALP/Greens supporters do not care about truth.

The ABC published an article with this title. I wonder if the title would be the same if the ALP was in power and did the same thing?

Over 2000 people died after receiving Centrelink robodebt
notice, figures reveal

Ivi

That article started the urban myth that 2,030 people who received debt notices killed themselves.

Down the bottom it gave the full details. Over two years 900,000 people received notices and there were 2,030 deaths.

“The department sent more than 900,000 debt letters to individuals during the period 1 July 2016 to 31 October 2018. A total of 2030 of those individuals died during the same period, which represents 0.21 per cent.”

It’s important to note here that the figures provided by the spokesperson include deaths of people who receive a pension payment, which by definition puts them in the older age bracket.

The aussie death rate is 500 per 100,000 people. So you would expect 4,500 deaths in a population of 900,000.

Ivi

What was your motive in posting that ABC article? To support my point or to disagree with my point? That was the one i was talking about. This was the title

Over 2000 people died after receiving Centrelink robodebt
notice, figures reveal

The ABC was trying to make out that 2,000 people died due to Coalition policy. Quite a shocking allegation. The facts are 900,000 notices were sent and 2,030 died. A normal death rate.

Many of those who died would have been old age pensioners who died of old age. The ABC was trying to make out they died due to Coalition policy

“”OK then””

Illegal as well. How the hell did the Public Service allow the govt to bring in something that was illegal? And why was it illegal? I can see why income averaging was a bad idea but why was it illegal?

TomR

I don’t believe anything someone from your side of politics says. It is designed to mislead and deceive.

On this particular topic i was told 2,030 people committed suicide because they received a debt notice.

Nope. 2,030 people died of old age, cancer, heart disease, car accidents etc plus some people took their life. It was just a normal death rate for a population of 900,000 people.

(Ah, yes, poor Penny; an unwise minister, once universally-lauded for being almost-perpetually on tour on ‘consular’ business among Our Pacific Family; whilst a most unwise (prime(d) minister proceeded with the real work of (un)sett(l)ing Australia(n Labor)’s foreign policy, and, indeed, (in)directly, all Australian policy(ies), (dis)allowing for opportunity(ies) cost(s), for a (past-as-)future-remainder of a post-(British-)colonialist), post-American, post-Asia-Pacific, pro-(North-)Atlanto(-Australo(-Indo(-Asia(-Pacific) Century (not to be confused, per Penny, with neo-colonialism, mind; more a beneficent reminder to the kiddies that ‘all your (economic) base are (still) belong to US’, because ‘interests’ and a (do-as-we-say(-not-as-we-do)) (over)’rules’-based ‘order’; perhaps).

“Australians have been denied knowledge and debate on existential matters, by Labor in cahoots with the LNP. The questions put by the press gallery afterwards revealed a uniformly barren mentality. The matter of nuclear submarines is really a distraction from the bipartisan political capitulation to America’s interests.”

Yes – all bow to our over-lords.

They gave us Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq etc but still we follow wagging our tails.

https://johnmenadue.com/keating-exposes-ministerial-incompetence-in-albanese-government/

Australia will fight the Chinese to our last ‘digger’ just as Ukraine will sacrifice its youth and all in the name of maintaining a ‘hegemony’.

Where is the ‘active and informed citizenship’?

https://johnmenadue.com/keating-exposes-ministerial-incompetence-in-albanese-government/

No doubt TB & MN will think the ICC are “right wing wankers”
Situation in Ukraine: ICC judges issue arrest warrants against Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin and Maria Alekseyevna Lvova-Belova
https://www.icc-cpi.int/news/situation-ukraine-icc-judges-issue-arrest-warrants-against-vladimir-vladimirovich-putin-and

The hilarious thing is that Putin had planned to attend the BRICS summit in South Africa, in August.
As a signatory, South African authorities would be required to arrest him.
Vlad will have to do it by zoom.

in silencing enemies of the regime

How were they doing this again? mass manipulation of media, social media?

RE – ” getting closer to being the 51st State … ”

Beg to disagree. In the USA, States’ Rights have some significance. On the other hand, Australia is a mere Vassal. Just a payer of tribute.

Now forced to pay an ongoing level to The American Empire – supposedly to defend us against our strongest trading partner which is China.

https://johnmenadue.com/aukus-submarines-on-the-never-never-or-castles-in-the-sky/

Yesterday I listened to Richard Marles discuss the need for us (as an island country/continent) to have a capacity to protect our trade routes.
It seemed rational, but those that think diplomacy is a euphemism for brown nosing probably don’t get that.

Did you notice that about 70% of Australia’s trade isn’t with China? And we’re seeking to be even less reliant on them.
We seem to be trying to increase trade with countries that have patchy relations with China, such as India.
But maybe let Richard Marles know that you think he’s wiring for thinking we should have a capacity to protect our trade routes

TomR – did you know that the PRC has negotiated trade deals with 149 Nations? Did you know, that China has 6 ‘foreign ports’ (most of which are used to combat piracy off the African Coast) while the USA has something in the order of 180.

Did you know the the American Empire spends more on weapons of war than the next highest 9 (including Russia, China etc)? And that doesn’t include what it spends on its veterans.

Shouldn’t be surprised, because since 1990, when the USA became the only Uni-Polar Nation (now under economic threat from China), the American Empire is now even more determined to maintain that sole status.

The USA can certainly pursue that goal. There is no umpire who can rule against them. Might is right. All all major geo-political players understand that. So America can, and will, do what it wants.

But that doesn’t mean Australia has to join USA chorus line. Increasingly, in the last 70 years, our foreign policy has been a disaster.

Who wants to sacrifice their offspring to maintain America’s “unipolarity”. Not for me! None of my offspring!

I prefer a multipolar world. Besides, it’s inevitable. Let the Americans fight to the death of the last American and leave us alone.

SB – you seem to proceed on the assumption that China is bent on territorial expansion (of the physical kind). Where is the evidence – apart from a few rocks in the China Sea which they reclaimed. The evidence suggests that they are into ‘trade’ in a big way. (Much to America’s chagrin and failed attempts to date of countering same – as well as using dodgy statistics.)

Take Sri Lanka as an example. In the West there is much, much talk about China and its “debt trap”. But not confined only to the western media. It’s spread elsewhere. The locals including many of the guides also speak in those terms as I can personally attest.

Yet the hard cold evidence is absent. Indeed, it’s otherwise. Sri Lanka’s biggest debtor is in fact India. But there’s rarely mention of that unless, you have go looking for it.

The American Empire not only makes valiant efforts to win physical wars but also the “propaganda” wars and there it’s very, very successful.

Watching Ferguson’s nonsense on 7.30 Report (interviewing the Russian Ambassador) last night was downright embarrassing. Talk about a lack of professionalism. Would be out of place on Sky.

Re: – “Australia is better off as part of a more powerful alliance.”

Was that the case when we went to Vietnam? Afghanistan? Iraq?

Seems to me that our “friends” can get us into trouble.

“Powerful alliances” have helped us out when?

Must have missed that bit? Or are you talking hypotheticals without a basis for that speculation?

By the way, the evidence suggests that Australia is forever the follower and not the leader. And not confined to foreign Policy either. Try educational policy as a good example.

Sad but true.

You still don’t get it.
There was a popular uprising against Yanukovych because he sought to join the Russian trade zone, in breach of his commitment to seek membership of the EU.
He ordered the military and police to shoot civilians protesters.
They wouldn’t.
He lost control of the tools of government because of his own decisions.
The parliament removed him because he would/could not carry out his responsibilities.
That only a “coup” in the opinion of f**kwits
You are an apologist for anything that is anti western democracy.
A verbose (useful) idiot

A Definition of a (political) COUP. is – “a sudden, violent, and unlawful seizure of power from a government.”

The Maidan Coup was “sudden”; it was “violent” (deaths in triple figures); and because it was outside constitutional legitimation – it was therefore unlawful.

You really should seek help. And at any number of levels.

That’s why you’re stupid MN.
There was no “seizure” of government. There was no illegal installation of a new regime.
Yanukovych lost power because he lost control of the apparatus of government. There was a popular uprising against his objective of aligning the country with Russia, contrary to the commitments he made.
Following him losing control of the government, the parliament established a process, including an election, to resolve this.
Ukraine didn’t wish to be a Russian colony (again)
You just hate facts that get it the way of your blinkered anti western democracy bias

Task Force 44

“The force saw action during the Battle of the Coral Sea, in which it helped turn back a Japanese attempt to invade Port Moresby, New Guinea.

At the start of May, the Americans learned of an imminent Japanese invasion of Port Moresby, and HMAS Hobart was sent with HMAS Australia to rendezvous with United States forces in the Coral Sea.[1] At 07:00 on 7 May, Rear Admiral Crace, embarked aboard Australia as commander of Task Force 44, was ordered to take his ships (Australia, Hobart, US cruiser Chicago, and US destroyers Perkins, Walke, and Farragut) to the Jomard Passage, and engage any Japanese ships found en route to Port Moresby, while several US carrier groups engaged a Japanese force headed for the Solomon Islands…….”

Re: – “When a friendly nation joins the war on our side and we start co-ordinating with them, that is an alliance.”

Well it maybe an “alliance” (in you view) but that doesn’t make it an “Alliance”. That came in 1951 – as I’m sure historians will attest.

Just as Capital letters added significance (and gravitas) to ANZUS so it is with AUKUS. Presentation matters as does the bringing of documentation into existence.

Re Victoria Nuland and her ‘claim/boast’

” Victoria Nuland told Congress that US advisors serve in 12 Ukrainian ministries, US-trained police operate in 18 Ukrainian cities, the US Treasury helped close 60 Ukrainian banks while protecting depositors, and the US spent $266 million on training Ukrainian”

Nuland would be aghast that the foreign expert from Melbourne is now downgrading her significant achievement(s).

Organising ‘coups’ takes a lot of work and money. Not for the feint hearted.

Also claims some credit for Nord Stream. One of Biden’s favorites. and early resurrections from Trump.

Is admired for her achievements.