Sex Abuse “All in the Past” says Cardinal Pell
Independent senator Nick Xenophon has lashed out at Australia’s most senior Catholic, Cardinal George Pell, for claiming sexual abuse by church members is historical.
Repeating his call for a national royal commission into sex abuse by Catholic clergy, Senator Xenophon said Cardinal Pell was wrong to consign the epidemic of abuse to history.
“I don’t agree with what George Pell said about this being an historical matter, I think he was wrong to say that.”
“You can’t call something historic if the perpetrators are still at large, if victims are still suffering, if there’s no sense of closure or indeed healing.
“I think we need to have a process in place to investigate who knew what, when, whether there was appropriate action by the church authorities or the police.
“This won’t be an easy issue to bring about. There’ll be a lot of politicians who’ll shy away from this, but the time has come.”
Cardinal Pell says that abuse and subsequent cover-ups were “largely historic” and “not part of a systemic failing” within the church.
theguttertrash.com 
Pell is more interest in putting a lid on the whole matter than in providing justice for the abused and exposing the abusers and those who have covered up their crimes. If such is religion then thank God I’m an athiest!
“not part of a systemic failing”
Oh yes it is ….death to the Church!
And I’m in favour of the Church paying the full cost for the Royal Commission …not the taxpayer.
1. The most objectionable comments about Royal Commissions is the cost. What was the last RC that didn’t provide some value? Certainly this one will.
2. Interesting to note that many are already seeking to make political points about a Royal Commission, using it as a point about Abbott. Really, there are some who just cannot help themselves. I think Abbott supported the Royal Commission before it was announced by Gillard.
I think Abbott supported the Royal Commission before it was announced by Gillard.
But with reservations … to dilute it away from the RCC … you always miss the detail, ToM …
TB, I can understand people being particularly critical of the Catholic Church, hierarchy and priests.
But Abbott simply supported a wide ranging Riyal Commission.
I think this is reasonable. While there is plenty to investigate in the CC, I don’t think it would be reasonable to tell a victim of scouts or Anglicans that their sexual abuse isn’t being investigated.
That narrow focus would have been an outrage.
That narrow focus would have been an outrage.
To whom? Catlics? Are they still so powerful … FMD!
I thought I lived in a secular society but that “belief” is challenged every day …
Focus on a broad spectrum dilutes the detail and spreads the time … focus on the MAIN perpertrator and then target each individual organisation down the line …
FYI, there is a greater number of pedophiles in the Catlic church and the Anglic church per population … if you argue that then NEVER argue polls and other statistical evidence with me again …
I have declared my agnosticism … what is your declaration?
So you’d tell a victim of sexual abuse by an Anglican that we’re not interested in their trauma?
Nah … just that we’ll get those bastards after we get the Catlics … ’cause if we try for all of them at once we’ll get none!
You obviously don’t know the story of the old bull and the young bull … would you (or anyone) like to hear it?
Perhaps they should also investigate the ADF .
Or is that off limits around here
How about the Scout movement
George Pell thinks stuff has been exaggerated.
He blames the Hate Media too
“FYI, there is a greater number of pedophiles in the Catlic church and the Anglic church per population …”
I suppose you have a Newspoll link do you ?
Funny – “Θα χρειαστείς ένα μεγαλύτερο σκάφος”
Just a link to an Australian Bureau of Statistics web page will do .
I’ll just sit here with my espresso and patiently wait for it all night and all tomorrow if you like.
LOL
While a wide ranging inquiry is justified, the real danger is that the Royal Commission will attempt to chase every rabbit down every hole and is so doing will miss the ‘wood for the trees’. At best, the RC can simply ‘highlight’ practices that were (and possibly still are in some instances) common within ‘institutions’ and ‘organisations’ over many years. It can’t beal with individual cases and make individual judgements.
The practice of ‘moving’ offending individuals to different locations (in the hope that the ‘problem’ would go away) was not confined to religious organisations. Indeed it was the ‘common sense’ within, for example, Departments of Education across Australia up to the 1990s and perhaps beyond.
The PM and her advisors need to be very, very careful with the Terms of Reference. Clauses such as ‘any other matter that the … sees fit to investigate (or like words) will guarantee the RC will be never ending. Simply it will become a lawyers’ picnic and the ‘public interest’ including the overall children’s interest will be neglected.
As for the ‘commissioners’, again this is fraught with difficulities at so many levels. While the PM may go for one Chief Commissioner with several deputies ( the options are many and varied), it will be essential that a prominent Catholic be on the team. if I were Gillard I would go for someone like Frank Brennan who will bring ‘gravitas’ to the role’ And is respected on sides of the political spectrum.
The Chair of necessity will have to be someone with a legal background. Perhaps three or five in number might be necessary. Then there is the gender balance etc.
Any thoughts?
FI
I agree. It needs to be generously manned with suitable legalese. Kirkby now retired would not be out of place plus a UK judge perhaps.
This is way too much for one commish to cover.
Otherwise it will still be going in 10 years.
Whoa
I forgot to change the name to fit the Country
I can gaurantee with absolute certainity that Michael Kirby won’t be within a bull’s roar of this enquiry. Think of the political implications. Bill Heffernan et al woukd go ballistic.
‘guarantee’ as well.
“Think of the political implications. Bill Heffernan et al woukd go ballistic.”
Thats why i suggested it LOL
So put Bill in there as well.
i think what is needed is some hard-hitting. Someone who’s prepared to break through the barriers and go for the jugular without fear of the consequences.
You know, someone like Bronwyn Bishop.
Just a link to an Australian Bureau of Statistics web page will do .
I’ll just sit here with my espresso and patiently wait for it all night and all tomorrow if you like.
Here ya go … thanks for your patience … you can find the rest yourself … I know how you like researching …
EMMA ALBERICI: You’ve said before that there is a disproportionately high number of child abusers among the Catholic clergy. Why do you think that is?
FRANK BRENNAN: That I don’t know. I was referring to the evidence that was given before the Victorian inquiry by Professor Patrick Parkinson. Now the thing about Parkinson is he is an independent lawyer who’s done a lot of work both for the Catholic Church and for the Anglican Church and he drew a comparison of the figures between the Catholics and the Anglicans.
Perhaps they should also investigate the ADF .
Or is that off limits around here
BTW, I recognise the sniping style … another Farnham returns … FMD … changing names and gravatars won’t hide you ..
Archbishop Pell last seen outside the Ecuadorian embassy in London attempting to claim asylum.
Archbishop Pell last seen outside the Ecuadorian embassy in London attempting to claim asylum.
Do you have a link or photo for that …? Fkn TrashyLeaks again …
I’ll just sit here with my long black and patiently wait for it all night
and all tomorrow if you like.Will be “offline” from tomorrow mid-day till next Tuesday … this fkn retirement is hard work soemtimes! 😉
” another Farnham returns … FMD … changing names and gravatars won’t hide you ..”
Yep.
An attempt at a clean slate while using a soiled piece of chalk with oily fingerprints all over it. 🙄
I’m with you, TB.
Go in hard on the micks. Sort that pile of obfuscation & repression out…then go through the rest of the abusers of position & trust.
Having spent 4 years at a Catholic boarding school I know about plenty of rumours, both legitimate & illegitimate, at school & surfacing many years afterwards. They give me pause to recognise the endemic institutionalisation of religious dogma enforcing ridiculous sexual repressions upon the jesusfreakz & the abhorrent consequences sometimes resultant.
There is clear evidence, globally, that the fkn Roman Catholic Church has interfered & contorted & manipulated allegations & abusive operatives as some kind of overarching campaign of damage control. Light a fire under the mess. Hell knows, the relevance of made up religious bullshit wanes by the day…& they can ill afford for such scandals to throw ugly light onto the undeniable flawed humanity of the supposed voices of god on Earth.
I know somebody who was sexually abused by a minister of religion, not Anglican or Catholic, shouldn’t he also be allowed a voice in a Royal Commission?
This young man’s life is completely ruined and he’s not yet 30, while that bastard who abused him continues to operate and is probably still abusing children.
Funny – “Θα χρειαστείς ένα μεγαλύτερο σκάφος” the george pell I know would never have sex with a woman
…shouldn’t he also be allowed a voice in a Royal Commission? …
Absobloodylutely, egg!
But what they are doing with this Royal Commission is making it a smorgasbord … so they will taste a bit here and a bit there and never finish … EACH organisation needs to be invetigated individully not as a GROUP … it dilutes the investigations and findings …
To use an old analogy … how do you eat an elephant? Mouthful by mouthful … this RC will try to eat it all at once …. and give up … with bellyache …
… the first mouthful should be the Roman Catholic Church … they might forgive each other their sins … but I don’t …
Okay, sounds good.
” how do you eat an elephant? ”
You will never work in the Canberra Press Gallery with that attitude.
Elephants are for ignoring, not for eating!
Pornstar Ron Jeremy has identified something that both the Catholic Church and the LA Porn Industry agree upon
They both hate the use of condoms .
Sex Abuse “All in the Past” says Cardinal Pell
Except for the bits that are rather current.
Lawyer alleges church cover-up as late as 2005:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-11-14/lawyer-claims-church-fails-to-comply-with-abuse-protocols/4372512
The senior lawyer who reviewed the Catholic Church’s Towards Healing protocols says the church was still covering up sexual abuse as late as 2005.
Pell sees himself as a candidate for rome, he will do whatever it takes to further his career goals, and if that means forsaking the children/victims yet again – so be it.
I don’t know how he lives with his conscience – guess he can just confess and be given absolution. Great system they have, no real punishment for wrongdoing even the most vile of crimes.
Drag him kicking and screaming into the Commission and let us see him lie with his hand on the bible.
” Drag him kicking and screaming into the Commission and let us see him lie with his hand on the bible. “
It will be interesting to see if the government retains it’s teeth through this RC, or if the politicians decide that sky fairies representatives on dirt are more important than the damage done to little children. Tragically, it is pre-ordained that the sky fairies representatives on dirt ‘ image ‘ and ‘ tax-breaks ‘ will be more important. The out-come will be toothless.
Sexual Boundary Violators are serial rapists….a lot of old Catholics are going to take this very hard.
‘THE Australian Catholic Church holds thousands of pages of documents containing the psychosexual profiles of dozens of clergy accused of sexually abusing children and vulnerable adults.
‘The profiles, often sent to bishops, were created as part of the church’s little-known 1997-2008 rehabilitation program for those it described as ”sexual boundary violators”.
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/catholic-churchs-secret-sex-files-20121116-29hkb.html#ixzz2CQTQSGPU
”sexual boundary violators”.
Neat bit of spin in that terminology, how to minimise the harm and make it appear almost like a code of conduct at work rather than the abuse of power and privilege over children and their families. How about common old paedophile or sexual abuser?
A lot of people are saying that the catholic church shouldn’t be singled out, but if the percentage of abusers is greater in that organisation than in others or in the general community then they have to admit that their culture, traditions and organisational structure was [?is] a beacon and a haven for the protection of criminals and their crimes.
If the church is responsible for (maybe) 85% of the abuse of children, it should get 85% of the attention. The other 15% shouldn’t be exempt from their behaviour.
Tom makes a valid point re not letting other institutions and organisations ‘escape’ from their potential liabilities but again the real problem for those developing the Terms of Reference is how NOT to let this inquiry/enquiry run for a decade or so.
“The human rights lawyer Geoffrey Robertson, QC, for instance, today warned that the inquiry “should be given a deadline of a year, 18 months at the outside, to recommend the most appropriate national safeguarding policies.”
“The commission must narrow its terms of reference, which at present are impossibly broad, and confine its inquiries to those institutions – churches, schools and organisations for vulnerable children – against which complaints have been made,” said Mr Robertson.
“Otherwise it will take many years to report, while molestation continues.”
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/in-depth/irish-abuse-inquiry-head-cautions-against-abuse-inquiry-should-avoid-mini-trials/story-fngburq5-1226515816584
bugger me … this issue has died a quiet death … or am I the only one to see The Robber Barons at work here too … is Pell so powerful … ???
Of course it’s, GET THE PM TIME … Hunger Games … anyone? Life is such a farce … (I hope, Sparta, doesn’t read this ’cause he’ll be sparting (sic) “life is such a fart” …) 😛
Do you think the Liberals (the Nats are such a spent force and so 1950’s it’s sickening … so much like, Sparta) That they attack the, Prime Minister, to take the “pressure” off the Micks? Wankers that they are … but oh so clever … just look at the timing .. and Abbott’s unusually low profile … does the Catholic Church actually control the Liberals as was thought in the sixties?